As of last night my system stopped doing it's thing... it stopped doing anything. So if anyone knows a bit about trouble shooting and has some things I can check before a Tech can make it, advice would be appreciated.
It's a heat pump set up - just FYI
This just happened over night so I haven't had time to investigate much but what I have found:
- Until last night it put out both heat and cold fine
- I cannot get the blower fan to come on at all. Not even when I switch it on manually at the thermostat nor when the on/off temps are changed and the fan is on Auto.
- Thermostat is a progamable electronic model. If I change the temp point so that it should come on (either heat or cooling) it still makes it's normal 'click' as it'd done always before - but beyond that I haven't checked to see if it's actually activating the heat pump and air sender. No odd messages are being displayed by the thermostat
Beyond that stuff... I'm in the dark about how to test stuff on these systems. Anyone got some better notions?
It would appear that the air handler (the indoor part) is not getting power, check your breakers.
Quote from: Capo on October 21, 2008, 09:30:56 AM
It would appear that the air handler (the indoor part) is not getting power, check your breakers.
I failed to mention that I checked the breakers. One of the 1st things I tired and no dice. none of the breakers were tripped. I turned them all off then back on, just in case.. but it didn't do anythig beside make me reset the clock on my stove.
All of them? I have two outside, and another two right on the air handler. Seems your thermostat is sending the signal, the unit is not responding. Does the outside unit start running and just the blower is not working or is nothing at all coming on? When mine got weird last year, the air handler would come on in manual mode but it wouldn't respond to heating or cooling requests from the thermostat. Turns out my thermostat was bad due to a power outage & surge when power was restored.
JM
Is the compressor running, does it hum, but not start?
Quote from: the_Journeyman on October 21, 2008, 09:46:06 AM
All of them? I have two outside, and another two right on the air handler. Seems your thermostat is sending the signal, the unit is not responding. Does the outside unit start running and just the blower is not working or is nothing at all coming on? When mine got weird last year, the air handler would come on in manual mode but it wouldn't respond to heating or cooling requests from the thermostat. Turns out my thermostat was bad due to a power outage & surge when power was restored.
JM
I'll check for more - but as far as I know I've got my main breaker panel inside that runs the whole house.. and? So looks like there might be some more breakers that might be on the units.. I'll check for those this evening.
I don't think the external pump unit kicked on at all either . I was in a bit of a time crunch this AM so I didn't confirm it's inactivity, but I don't recall hearing it kick on at all.
Nothing freaky with the power here recently that might kill my Thermo - but it's not like it couldn't have failed. But I'm not sure how to (or if I can) check for the Thermo not doing it's job. But if the external heatpump and internal blower aren't going it might seem that the thermo isn't doing it's thing right
Usually, the thermostat gets its its power (via a transformer) from the outdoor condensing unit. Does your thermostat have any indication of power ? The click you hear is mechanical and is not indicative of power.
You could of course call it in and get charged half a weeks pay to replace a fuse ;D
Quote from: Capo on October 21, 2008, 10:08:08 AM
Usually, the thermostat gets its its power (via a transformer) from the outdoor condensing unit. Does your thermostat have any indication of power ? The click you hear is mechanical and is not indicative of power.
You could of course call it in and get charged half a weeks pay to replace a fuse ;D
Thermostat does have power - it's a LCD display, so that'd be easy to tell. though it does have a battery back up - which I'll pull out this evening to see if it's just running off that for some reason.
Yeah.. that's the scenario I'm trying to avoid.
At least I've got a few more things to look for / check this evening. Any other tips?
I trouble shoot for a living, I will be around for a couple of hours if your home by then, I'd be glad to talk you through things.
Could there be a blown fuse somewhere in the main unit?
Quote from: Capo on October 21, 2008, 10:33:00 AM
I trouble shoot for a living, I will be around for a couple of hours if your home by then, I'd be glad to talk you through things.
I'm on the east coast of the US - you're in Europe someplace no? Either way I won't be home for a good 4 hours at least. But if you are - I greatly applicate the hand. IF you're not on, you might find some PMs in the AM
Quote from: Duc Stamp on October 21, 2008, 10:36:09 AM
Could there be a blown fuse somewhere in the main unit?
It's a possibility that's been brought to my attention. I didn't think to check the box on the exterior of the house during my hurry this morning... So I'll be skulking around like a burglar with my flash light when I get home.
I had a similar situation w/ mine over the summer, I had a float w/ a switch hanging on the interior of my drip pan and my drain was clogged causing the pan to fill and trip the switch kapooting the whole shibang, something to consider. you could also reset you thermostat via a reset button, but if it's "clicking" then continue your search
Quote from: cbartlett419 on October 21, 2008, 11:48:40 AM
I had a similar situation w/ mine over the summer, I had a float w/ a switch hanging on the interior of my drip pan and my drain was clogged causing the pan to fill and trip the switch kapooting the whole shibang, something to consider. you could also reset you thermostat via a reset button, but if it's "clicking" then continue your search
No drip pan to worry about - condensation is drained via a bit of plastic pipe right into a drain. Pipe's clear, I cleaned it out recently. So that *shouldn't be* an issue.
I do have a reset on the Thermo... worth hitting just in case?
It could be the transformer as mentioned or there is probably a control fuse in the air handler. Usually they are automotive type fuses that you can look at to see if they are blown. The windings in the blower motor may be open. If the system is wired correctly the condensing unit (outdoor unit) won't come on until the air handler is running.
I run a commercial HVAC service company in Baltimore. I'll try to check this thread later tonight and would be happy to answer any questions I can.
Quote from: MikeZ on October 21, 2008, 12:03:18 PM
It could be the transformer as mentioned or there is probably a control fuse in the air handler. Usually they are automotive type fuses that you can look at to see if they are blown. The windings in the blower motor may be open. If the system is wired correctly the condensing unit (outdoor unit) won't come on until the air handler is running.
I run a commercial HVAC service company in Baltimore. I'll try to check this thread later tonight and would be happy to answer any questions I can.
Thanks Mike. Seems the consensus is to look for fuses/breakers on the condenser and air handler. I know where the outside box is... but inside that might take some exploring - it'll be an adventure.
So I've got my short list of things to check - and I'll update here later on once I can actually check stuff.
Thanks for all the help gang [clap]
Again, thanks to all who chimed in with their knowledge - This is one of the things that made the DML (may she rest in peace) and this place so cool.
Occams Razor applied here and it was a fuse. Seems to have been one on the air handler, but I replaced the ones on the handler and heat pump. But one of the air handler fuses had what looked to be a bit of heat damage. I say looks since these are the big honker FRN-R 40 250v tube jobs. There's no filament or anything you can just peek at.
Either way, after the new fuses were in, I turned the breakers back on, then the thermostat and on she went. [thumbsup]
Glad you got it running.
Now the big mystery.
What caused the fuse to blow?
Yeah - actually I was going to pose that question to you - any thoughts?
The fuses were old... is to possible for them to fatigue?
if the unit short cycled (on and off quickly) that can cause a fuse to blow.
I'm assuming it hasn't been down for a while and blew during a storm or you haven't been doing home improvements and messed w/ or hit the wiring somehow. Might want to check the wiring outside going to the condensing unit. Sometimes animals will eat at the wiring and cause it to short out.