Ducati Monster Forum

I'm guessing this was the same right-hand bend that messed Dad up...

:o

The parts highlighted in red are eerily similar.  We were almost exactly 20 miles from Estacada, and it was a right-hand bend with that whoop in it that unsettled the CBR.  Dad and Dave then sat there and saw almost every sportbike get messed up by that corner, and several that crossed the double-yellows.  Only bikes that were "fine" were dual-sports, cruisers, and sport-tourers who were going a lot slower.  When I got back out there with the trailer to haul the CBR home, I heard a high-strung twin make a couple odd throttle blips... turned around to see an Aprilia RSV Mille in the middle of the opposing lane, trying to recover after he hit the same whoop in the road.

My condolences to their family.

Ride safe everyone.

Read the fine print...the dude did not even have an endorsement. I am not saying it is any less tragic. I have ridden that stretch 100 times and have been fine, but I swear this would have been corrected we pushed for more MSF training.

While training is definitely a factor in this kid's death, Dad, Dave, and I saw enough other riders get screwed up by that corner to say that the corner is also a problem.  It unsettled Dave's bike, and he got close to the centerline.  We know what happened to Dad.  It hammered me (ouch...), but I didn't get thrown way off-line only because I was expecting it.  I'd ridden that stretch before and knew there were some hidden bumps, and so I consciously loosened up as we got 15-20 miles out from Estacada (which is where it starts to degrade).  Kinda like horseback riding, I suppose, you just learn to let it move without white-knuckling.

Anyway, the point is: there are corners on 224 that catch people off-guard.  It's not a proper racetrack.  Please ride carefully.

Makes me sad...  Please ride safe everyone!

This is one of the risks that one must accept as a very real possibility when choosing to ride on a two wheel object without a cage around you... RIP

I agree. I just hate the calamari giving motorcycling a bad name. Yes riding is dangerous, and 224 is a very technical route. Get training and start small.

Hey guys, BB has a point.  That is a bad spot in the road.  As I ride on the crappiest roads in the state, Tillamook County, I always advise you guys about specific near death road conditions before I ride with you (when you come down to visit).

I recall reading on the Bay Area thread on the old board about a blind corner on a popular moto-road that has claimed the lives of a lot of riders.  They got together and went out to paint a warning on the road.  I think they made a sign as well.

A known tricky corner should be known by all.  Squids and MSF passing riders are our 2 wheeled brothers.  Don't blame this or Dans dad shunt on inexperience alone.

[end rant]

I agree. Point out the dangerous spots. My point was pretty close to a threadjack of its own... the last two deaths from motorcycles in Oregon were as follows:
Non-endorsed rider on 224.
Guy riding wheelies down MLK loses control and hits a telephone pole.

At what point do people read, "another motorcyclist died" and not "guy doing something he shouldn't have"???

Plus... it is crappy weather and I am in a bad mood... so I will rant and pregnant dog and moan and complain and try and figure how this is any different from how I normally act.

You need a vacation.  It's sunny and 60º here.  [moto]

I can recommend an excellent B&B!   [thumbsup]

The stuntas who get themselves killed in town... those irritate me.

I guess I didn't see this news story so much as the stupid getting their just desserts, because that stretch of road hits a little close to home.  If there'd been an oncoming car, that story could've been about Dad.

Can't chalk his incident up to gross inexperience, either.  Dad's ridden dirtbikes, and probably has 30,000 miles throughout his life on different streetbikes.  He doesn't have as many miles on a sportbike as Dave or I, but you can't flatly say he's "an inexperienced rider."  Dad was also going slower than I was through that corner... my Michelins stuck going 55-60, the CBRs Dunlops let go while travelling between 45-55 (indicated... and my Duc's speedo indicates slower than the Daytona or CBR do).  They weren't new tires, but they weren't bald either.  They'd also had the pressure checked that morning.

How many inexperienced riders buy RSV Milles?  Granted, not everyone who owns one knows what they're doing, but your average inexperienced squid doesn't usually think enough to go for an Italian thoroughbred (they buy the first YamaKawiHonZuki that crosses their path).  I personally saw that one way across the double-yellows.  Again, had there been an oncoming car... could've been the same headline, but without the "no endorsement" note.

Anyway... I guess I'm just reiterating the original point: public highways are not ideal for 10/10ths riding, and in many cases not even 8/10ths.  Please ride carefully.  They're uneven, off-camber, have tar seams, potholes, bridge crossings with bad seams, inconsistently marked, etc.  This article is just a stark reminder of the risk associated with riding on some of the roads we do, and at least for me, was even more poignant because there's some "family history" on that stretch of road.

You're oppressing me - ain't cross platforms posts grand?  :P

Can't I post an irritating comment just to be irritating?  ;D   

Dan - I didn't disagree with you in any way. Just threadjacking and trying point out that if he wasn't on the road at all, he wouldn't have had the accident. Not being endorsed, he should not have been on the road. And, lastly, I like to argue.  As a side note, chuck smells.

he could have had a permit and been with someone who was endorsed then it would be legal and he would have every right to be on the road, I think that most articles about accidents need to be taken with a grain of salt as they will only put in the info that they feel is neccisary...  I know that I rode a solid 2 years on a permit before i was endorsed just out of not wanting to take the time to go take the test, and yes there were times I ventured out without someone with a endorsement.

 [laugh]

I know.  I do too (though I usually refer to it as "debating").  ;)  Nothing taken personally.

Excellent. Now on to better things.


Monty Python kicks ass!!

^I've seen Mo do this on the 749  [evil]  8)

  Amen to this, right said I say!!!  [clap] I don't know how many times I've tried to explain this to people and they don't get it, and some of them ride  :o  RIP fallen dude

Sounds like the County should post one of those warning signs at this corner; MOTORCYCLES USE EXTREME CAUTION. I'll bet one could go through the procedure to make that happen. I don't know but whenever I see a sign that say DIP I think they're talking to me  :-\

You said 'watery tart'....  ;D

I think we're all in agreement that this issue hits close to home for all of us.  G and I were discussing this today and who knows if I have the skill to handle the corner on Cara (she probably does, but she rox...  nuff said) doing 50+ after 20 years of dirtbike and only 1 year of sportbike...  *shrugs*

So, with all of that said, I think that this might be a grand opportunity to make a difference for future riders of HWY 224 (as suggested by others earlier in this thread).  Let's do one (or all) of these -> Either make a sign and post it, create some graffiti on the road as a warning, OR work on some legislation to have the state of OREGON post a warning sign... 

Thoughts?   [popcorn]

Push for legislation limiting the size of potholes and determining a minimum safe condition that considers MCs as the more limiting factor.

There was one pot hole on 224 last time I went through that was ~4" deep and would fit my entire bike in it.  It was on a corner!  I had to change my line after coming through partway and seeing the Grand make the beast with two backsin Canyon in front of me.  Road crews had outlined it in bright orange paint but  that DOESN'T really help eh?

Whoa... sorry, the libertarian in me is coming out... NOT pushing for legislation.

Legislating the size of potholes has absolutely nothing to do with the condition that sent Dad skittering off the road, screwed up the line of countless other sportbikes, and cost some kid his life this last weekend.  There's a barely-visible dip in the road... it's only a problem if you hit it goin' fast in something with stiff suspension, then it totally effs up the vehicle's composure.

(As an aside: that's why I don't like legislation... altogether too often legislators go off on a tangent, and it doesn't do anything to fix the original problem)

My vote is to petition the county, or the Forest Service (or whoever is responsible for the road out there) to put up a sign that says "DIP" or "MOTORCYCLES USE EXTREME CAUTION".  I'm also uncertain of whether there is a corner speed posted at that corner, and perhaps there should be.

If we wanna go "graffiti" the pavement in the meantime, I'm down for that too.  We just need to make sure it looks nice, and not like a hack job.  If Johnny Law stumbles on us and has a problem with it, hopefully we can get off the hook by explaining the situation (it's for public safety...riders skittering into oncoming traffic or off the road).  So... would we need to re-spray the pavement like once every six months, or annualy?

Librarian . . . and how is it you're qualified to make airplanes?

Dude . . . once again . . . you take me seriously.  Getting yourself into a bad habit you know.  ;)

We could have a legit Moto Use Caution yellow diamond sign made and bolted to a 4x4, and go plumb it into the ground. For the record, however, those signs are remarkably un-cheap.

Just throwing out suggestions... I've never been on this HWY but it sounds like some preventative maintenance needs to happen, either by us or by the 'powers that be'...  As Smokey said, "Only YOU can make a difference!" or some happy trash like that... :)

Ok, back to your regularly standard programming...

What order of magnitude are we talking about for just the metal sign part?  $200?  $1200?  $12,000?

If it's more than we want to split the cost for, but still less than stratospheric, we might be able to hold some kind of fundraiser party.

Probably $200-$250 for a 3'x3' reflective yellow diamond, and probably $15 bucks for the weather treated 4"x4"x10/12' and galvanized bolts, and a little bit of gas and some shovels and giggling to stick it into the ground at night. On that note, is it problem from both directions?

I crashed on 224 once.

Do you know who makes these signs so I/we can get a firm price?

The lumber and hardware I'm not worried about.  A treated 4x4 and hardware is chump change.  I just had no idea how much the tin sign with the reflective print would cost.

To my knowledge, that specific corner is only a problem when headed east.  The dip starts a few feet to the south side of the double-yellows, then goes to the edge of the road.

You can sorta see the shadow of it in the pic:
(http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii304/duc_fan/Other%20bike%20pics/Munch9.jpg) (http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii304/duc_fan/Other%20bike%20pics/Munch9.jpg)
The dip is on the left of this photo (pic was taken looking West... dip is in the Eastbound lane)

Gettin all pro and shit?

Get some stock sheet metal from Lowe's.  Get some yellow or reflective Krylon while there.  They got lumbar too I think . . .

Make a sign.

Why heck . . . make the sign out of plywood and just seal it up nice . . .

It's not like ODOT is out patrolling the highways lookin' for unauthourized signs. 8)

your concern is noble

however

spending a few hundred on a sign that odot trashcans in a week or so is going to piss y'all off

there are other ways to go about it


First you need to stop, think, and be very honest with yourself

"Would this be a dangerous condition had I been following the posted speed limit?"


Then if so, identify what kind of Road Condition you have

There are 3 types:

• Emergency
• Non-Emergency/Hazardous
• Non-hazardous

REPORTING HAZARDOUS ROAD CONDITIONS

All emergency road conditions should be reported directly to 911.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

All non-emergency road conditions please contact the Clackamas County Sheriff's Department at (503) 655-8211

Examples of Hazardous Conditions:

• Stop sign down or missing
• Malfunctioning Traffic signal
• Tree on roadway obstructing traffic
• Debris or material on roadway obstructing traffic flow
• Standing water obstructing traffic flow
• Dead Deer or Elk obstructing traffic flow
• Pot hole or sink hole imposing significant traffic hazard

To Report all Hazardous Road Conditions please call the Clackamas County Sheriff: (503) 655-8911


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Non-Hazardous Road Conditions

To Report A Non-Hazardous Road Condition: Call the 24-Hour Message Line (503) 760-3325

Examples of non-hazardous conditions are:

• Pot holes in road
• Road signs down or missing (STOP signs should be reported as a hazardous condition)
• Eroded shoulders
• Sight obstruction
• Dips or Humps
• Cracks in the road surface

Each request should include the following:
Your Name
Your address, including City, State and Zip Code
Telephone number where you can be contacted
A detailed description of the condition, including Road name, nearest cross street and/or address. (Mile Marker)
It is important that you include a contact number in the event more information is needed.

I am waiting for the fiery hail and brimstones to rain down from the sky. Jacob has become the voice of reason. What is wrong with this world?  ;D

We have now entered the 4th dimension....

in this land, chucks feet are big, he has long hair.

i actually show up to get togethers, we all live in Bend and marvelous lives in portland.

It's all JBubble's fault.  ;D

 >:( >:( >:( >:( >:(



 [laugh]

i don't get it

it is just a dip

looks like a nice road all paved

you want roads to complain about follow me out to Astoria

I know the exact road you are talking about!   >:(

 [thumbsup]

It is just a dip

in an otherwise nicely paved road

but...

it is also a dip that has sent multiple riders skittering across the double yellows.

The posted speed limit out there, IIRC, is 55.

I do not remember that specific curve having a lower recommended speed.

Can't speak for anyone else... but Dad claims he was going 50-55 heading into that corner.

...

And what the hell happened to Mother's posts?

Women, they ethenize your pain, they soothe your weary soul and fatten it up with happiness and love, the soften your reserve, break down your barriers, then they soften your resolve, take away your individuality and will power, suck all joy and happiness out of your life, take that fattened and sweetened sould and suck every once of goodness out of it and leave you a shrunken bitter husk.

Some, not all women.

True.  Some times they die before they can finish their project.  Some get bored and move on.

Mother will always be Mother. Do you guys honestly think that I can change him? A better question, do you honestly think I want him to change? If you think the answer to either of those questions is 'yes' then you don't know him and you don't know me.

The jokes are fine but I felt the need to set the record straight.


Chuck, I'm sorry you feel that way and I'm sorry that life has dealt you those cards. But do not apply that to Mother's relationship with me.


 [roll]

I like chicken pot pie.

I'm sorry, I felt the need to respond.

Well, I do.

It is quite yummy.

It wasn't big enough though, now that my appetite is back, it left me hungry for more.

You could make some moobie ice cream and eat it.

Oooh good idea! I can even drink some wine beforehand and make it FUN moobie ice cream

Oh hell yeah. FUN moobie ice cream. That could be all the rage. You could start packaging and selling in a little ice cream cart. Or Mo could get a creepy ice cream man van.

You people really need to stop taking me seriously!  WTH is wrong with you people?!?  ???

When have I ever made a serious post?  :P

i remember a post from you once when you were seriously hung over.......is that the same thing?

LOL... Chuck w/ hair?  Common, that's a bit of a stretch, doncha think?  :P

 [laugh]

Wow.  Hun, you really need to hang out with Chuckles more... even I, for as literal as I can be, could tell that he was being completely sarcastic...  ;)



 [laugh]

That was rich!

The only time ive seen chuck get serious is when his bike is acting up, then he aint messing around!

Even then he somehow manages to laugh at himself.