Ducati Monster Forum

I checked my clearances, and found that a couple of the closers were loose, but the openers are still around .004.  Removed one of the closer shims, measured it, and got a replacement from the dealer that should get the clearance close to .001 (I did measure the replacement).  When I reassemble everything, I'm finding that the opener rocker arm won't slide back into place.  It appears that I now have negative clearance for the opener, yet I'm using the same opener shim that I removed.  I'm sure that the cam is positioned such that the rocker can slide over, because it will slide if I remove the opener shim. Can this happen if the closer shim that I installed is too large?

Sometimes it's a bit of a struggle to get the opener rocker back in position.

Rotate the cam back and forth a bit as you try to slide the rocker over.

+1...

and make sure the engine is still at TDC

Thanks guys.  Its still at TDC, the crank has not been turned since I started.   I know what you mean about there being a very small window in which the rocker will actually slide into place, I got a good sense of this by sliding it over without the shim in-place.  I gently roate the cam to fnd that window as I slide the rocker, but it just won't go with the shim installed.  I'l  keep trying....

I take it that there is no way having too large of a closer shim could cause this?  I don't see how it could, but I'm at a loss since that is the only thing I've changed.

Closer shim shouldn't have any effect.

You've got the belts off, right?

This may help... If you remove the closer to give yourself temporary space to slide the rocker over. This will let you find the magic spot to where it will slide over. If you are off just a bit, I have found you could still can snap the rocker lose for removal, but going back is not going to happen until you get it in the proper TDC position.

I'm trying to recall that with one valve (cant remember if it was intake or exhaust), you had to actually press down on it with the same method to remove the collets, in order to allow for enough clearance to slide the rocker over. I believe it was the exhaust... but dont quote me on that! :)
 

Yea, belts are off.

I've followed the descriptions In LT Snyder's book, and the video on Cal Cycleworks.  I'm finding that this is nothing like the video.  In the video, the cam can rotate 360* with both rocker arms slid over, but I'm finding that I can only slide one or the other over, and the cam can't rotate that far because the closer rocker interferes with the opener rocker.  For example, once I rotate the cam enough to get the intake rocker slid over, there is no way to rotate the cam again to find the sweet spot that will let me slide the exhaust rocker over.  In order to slide the exhaust rocker over, I need to move the opener rocker back into its normal position.   I assume this is normal with the DS1000, or have I somehow managed to really mess things up?

You mean removing the opener shim, right?  If so, I've done that.... that is why I think it should be sliding over.

the 1000 are real pita to do this on.  we remove the rocker pins - it's just easier.  i think it is a case of can get it off, but not back from memory.

just don't damage the make the beast with two backsing o-ring on the rocker pin cover.

Addendum to my first post:

You can push down on the opener shim (fighting against the closer spring) with the same hand that's trying to slide the rocker over, while your other hand rotates the cam back and forth a bit.

what he said.  and he means fight.

OK. I'll give this a try when I get back out to the garage.  This had crossed my mind, but I don't understand why it should be necessary.  There was a .004 gap between the opener rocker and shim when I started, and the rocker slid out of the way easily.


I noticed that.....


yes, the rocker moved out of the way easily enough, but getting it back home is a different story.  If Speeddog's method doesn't work for me, I'll study the section in the factory manual on removing the rocker pins. 

Thanks all....

The cam position where you can slide the opener rocker over actually has the valve open a little bit, so there's some closer spring pressure involved.

It's a lot easier to drop your keys than it is to pick 'em up.  ;D

OK, the problem is that I am an idiot.  The keepers were not fully seated, so the closer shim was causing the closer rocker to bind on the cam shaft.  You need to really snap that closer rocker to seat the collets.  Yes, it shows this in the video, and I thought I was doing it right, but I just wasn't snapping it hard enough.

On to the next valve....

 [clap]

More importantly, you are less of an idiot now than you were the moment before you figured it out. And for that you are now smarter than the next guy who has not learned that lesson. Congrats!!!

BTW, i prefer to call it "challenged". While I did not decide on getting a Duc totally blind, I knew that there would be things to learn of which I had no clue of. And there is still much to learn... and with advice/help from great folks like the DMF, I know that I'm very thankful to everyone.

I will definitely remember, "It's easier to drop your keys, than it is to pick them up", next time I shoot a keeper across the garage. That still doesn't beat my ultimate boof... Setting my shim kit on my roll around seat where I managed to bump it, spill the entire contents on the floor, and have to measure every one of them to put them back in the kit. Now THAT was what being an idiot is all about!

Good luck finishing up!

Yes, this place is a wealth of information.  I'm thankfull! 

Dumping your shim kit, that is a classic.

The horiz cyl is done, tomorrow I'll start on the vertical cyl.

lol, i did my first adjustment this summer on my s2r1k.  took me about an hour of cursing and swearing to figure out why the cam wouldn't turn 360 deg after installing my first closer shim.  i found that pressing on the collet (enough to compress the lash spring) with a very small flat screwdriver was the easiest way to seat them.   

i dropped my keys into a bowl one time.  not the good type.

I've heard about those sort of parties...    [evil]

big

Yeah, you know they've gone bad when someone's riding off on your Monster and you're stuck with some lardy-arsed Japanese sports-tourer.

Nice work Ivan [thumbsup]

I'll see you in 6,000 miles ;)

p.s.  You should have installed some MBP collets...... there's no mistaking when the rocker snaps closed with those babies :o

Gus, where ya been?  Next time I am going to use the MBP collets.   Yesterday I found that one of the collets on the vertical intake was broken.