I'm having some warranty work done on my bike. It's at 570 miles. The Sales guy who took my bike in had me fill out some paperwork, asked if I wanted them to do the 600 Mile service. I said no that I could handle all of that myself. He get's all stern with me and tells me: "I know there are manuals and a lot of crap on the internet about how to do this yourself but the belts have to be harmonically balanced, you have to remove all of the belt covers and you can't get it right unless you have the proper tool to measure the harmonics" Anyone heard of this Harmonically balancing crap? According to a different (and considerably cheaper service department) a 600 mile service is just "change oil and filter, check brake and clutch fluid, brake pads. Adjust and lube chain and test ride." All stuff I can handle.
I guess I should add, that I trust this dealership. They are well thought of and do good work. I just can't afford to use them as they are very high compared to other dealerships in the area. And I didn't think that checking the timing/cam belts was part of the 600 mile service.
It's not exactly harmonically balanced, but they do adjust belts now with a tool that measures the resonance of the belts.
Pretty sure there is info on here how you can do that with a computer and a mic.
I'm not sure, but is belt adjustment recommended on a 600 mile check?
Quote from: ducpainter on December 01, 2008, 10:09:47 AM
is belt adjustment recommended on a 600 mile check?
That's what I'm trying to figure out. If it is... ok, I'll bite the bullet and pay them 300 bucks for service and put off my termi's for a while. If not. Then, I don't wanna pay for something I don't need.
Quote from: Clickjack on December 01, 2008, 11:00:25 AM
That's what I'm trying to figure out. If it is... ok, I'll bite the bullet and pay them 300 bucks for service and put off my termi's for a while. If not. Then, I don't wanna pay for something I don't need.
Ouch, $300 sounds high.
I just had my 696 600 mile service done. $165.00.
Most dealers are pretty staunch about the 600mi service because they're on the hook for the 2 year unlimited mile warranty. Have'em do only what is required using special tools. I can only think of the belts that require that. Normal service rate are $100 to $150/hr and I cant imagine it taking more than an hour to check the belt tension. Do the oil change, chain tension and bolt torques (the ones marked with a yellow paint) before you take it in so they can verify you did it. That ought to make them happy and keep expenses to a minimum. Personally I would not do the belt tensions myself, they are pretty finicky and the cost of a skipped tooth or shredded belt breaking is just too much (read crapped engine at your expense). While you're at it check the oil screen too, chances are you'll find a few "clippings" in it. these are thin steel shards that look like small finger nail clippings. They're from the trans square cut gears and come from the "clunk" you sometimes get during a poorly executed down shift.
You're not taking it to AMS Dallas are you? That is where I bought my bike. 600 miles service was $317 They didn't do anything but change the oil that I could tell. Chain was not lubed or adjusted. They may have "looked" at other stuff but they didn't actually do much. Wait until the 7500 mile service, that's when they will hit you with a big bill ($1017). If you can't really afford it, sell it now or learn how to work on it yourself. This is the problem I am facing now. I love the bike, but the service costs are breaking me.
Quote from: ducpainter on December 01, 2008, 10:09:47 AM
I'm not sure, but is belt adjustment recommended on a 600 mile check?
it's on the 'check' table. Hopefully they would not need adjustment. There's a lot of stuff on the 'check' list for that 1st service.
Ive had 2 dealers tell me that the 600 mile is "required to maintain warranty". It must be documented somewhere "in case". the rest of them can be done by yourself.
its probably BS, but i wouldnt doubt that ducati has turned down someone becaue it wasnt properly checked for the 600 since it is important to look over everything after that many miles. I think its mostly to make sure the bike is good to go more than anything else. aka, nothing came loose cause it wasnt put together properly right? the bike is still in one piece? engine isnt grinding of too much metal into the oil? okay it looks good kinda thing.
I think any dealer that is charging more than 200 for the 600 service is ripping people off. there is a thread here about the cost of the 600 service somewhere. most are below 200 i think.
I bought my bike from AMS as well. Would i get it serviced there? hmm maybe the alvaredo store after visiting and checking it out, but the Dallas store, nope. they left a bad taste in my mouth from the sale.
I went to the OKC store for my service. and yes i do believe in getting at least the first and major services from the dealers. Shadowchaser used to be on here, he's a tech and he can tell you more.
They actually took the bike to Alvaredo to do the work after I dropped it off at Dallas. I'm sure that I got charged 2 - 3 hours labor for that. On top of that, my bike came back with a scratched tank and frame, paint on one of my bar end mirrors was screwed up.
Quote from: lilmonster on December 02, 2008, 04:52:12 PM
They actually took the bike to Alvaredo to do the work after I dropped it off at Dallas. I'm sure that I got charged 2 - 3 hours labor for that. On top of that, my bike came back with a scratched tank and frame, paint on one of my bar end mirrors was screwed up.
yeah i remember you posting about that. that's sh*t. well i'm in germany now so no worries there. german's are meticulous about their bikes.
Quote from: lilmonster on December 02, 2008, 04:52:12 PM
They actually took the bike to Alvaredo to do the work after I dropped it off at Dallas. I'm sure that I got charged 2 - 3 hours labor for that. On top of that, my bike came back with a scratched tank and frame, paint on one of my bar end mirrors was screwed up.
What did they do to make this right?
I emailed Scott about after getting home. I didn't notice it until I was halfway home (70 miles). He wanted to see the damage to see if it could buff out. I already have stuff to do that so I did it myself. The mirror was a cheap bar end, it was silver when I bought it (all they had). I painted them black. I stripped the paint since I had to start over, I decided to polish them this time and like it better that way. I don't know what they would have done, but I know they wouldn't replace or repaint the tank to make it right in my eyes. I got a free gallon of Motul 300v. That cost around $70. I like everyone over there, they just charge crazy high prices. I paid $17 each for freakin' spark plugs for God's sake.
So maybe I'm dense, but I don't think I got a clear answer. Is the Belts being "harmonically" balanced apart of the 600 mile service or not?
This may be a dumb question, but why is their this 600 mile service in the motorcycle world. I have never taken a car in to the dealership for a 600 mile service. Well i also do all my work my self anyway but you know what I am getting at.
I don't know if the belts are supposed to be part of the service. To hear him, they go over the entire bike and check everything. They did the 7500 miler, I pulled the lower belt cover off the other day just to look at it (11000 miles now). The belts are loose enough that the cam can be rocked back and forth slightly becuse of the slack. Is this properly adjusted? Doesn't seem right to me if timing is supposed to be so critical.
My 600 miles service is coming this week. I asked that a battery tender cable be installed along with a 14T sprocket. (Hope the sprocket is a good thing to be doing.)
Quote from: Clickjack on December 05, 2008, 12:56:07 PM
So maybe I'm dense, but I don't think I got a clear answer. Is the Belts being "harmonically" balanced apart of the 600 mile service or not?
I just downloaded a 696 owner's manual from the Ducati website and according to it, a belt tension adjustment is not due until the 7,500 mile service. The "harmonically balanced" term that your dealer used is not quite right. The tension in the belts is important, and to determine if it's correct, Ducati uses a sonic tester to measure the frequency of the belt vibration when it's plunked like a guitar string. So it's really a sonic or acoustic tension test, not harmonically balance.
Even though Ducati doesn't require it (for the 696's at least, I'm not sure what bike you have or if it's different for other models), I think it's been shown that new belts stretch a significant amount during the first 1000 miles or so and it is not a bad idea to check the tension again around that time.
Stupid question time:
The manual says that the 2nd service (the one after the 600 mile service) is the 7500 mile service. Is this really right? I could've sworn my dealer said something like 3500 for an oil change. 6900 miles just seems like a long time to wait...
Hold me. :-[
Quote from: wark on December 14, 2008, 05:53:00 PM
Stupid question time:
The manual says that the 2nd service (the one after the 600 mile service) is the 7500 mile service. Is this really right? I could've sworn my dealer said something like 3500 for an oil change. 6900 miles just seems like a long time to wait...
Hold me. :-[
You will definitely be changing the oil before that 7500 mile service. Oil change isn't really a "service".
Ah. Thanks lots.
I topped up tonight and noticed the old oil is pretty dark brown compared to the new oil. Bike has 2200 miles on it. I suppose an oil change is in order!
The 696 manual says that the belt tension is to be checked at the 7500 mile service. The 600 mile service consists of:
- Changing oil and filter
- Check brake and clutch fluid levels
- Check tire pressure and wear
- Check brake pads for wear
- Check chain tension
- Road test the bike
ALSO!!!!!!! Next to where it mentions checking the valves, checking the belt tension, cleaning the air filter, checking the throttle body synch, and checking the clutch disc pack it has this......(1).
And this (1) has a note which reads: "Operation to be carried out ONLY at the specified distance intervals!"
So, IMO, and it seems DNA, you should ONLY check what is required for each interval when you reach that milage. IMO, if something goes wrong you are covered since the manufacturers recommended maint schedule was followed to a "t".
Oh, and dont forget that there is another note that mentions that service intervals are a matter of milage or time.
This time reference leaves me somewhat confused since I will probably not reach 7500 miles with in one year of my buying the bike. Does this mean that I need to have the 7500 mile check performed at one year even if the bike only has 5000 miles at that time? If that is the case and your usage doesn't vary from year to year, you could end up doing the 37000 mile check at year 5 with only 25000 miles on the bike. [roll]
I can understand changing the belts every two years since they "could" become brittle, but checking the valves every calender year when you only put another 4000 miles on the bike seems excessive.
I think this goes along with DNA's claim that all new Ducatis come with 50% less maintenance. It seems some of the dealers didn't get that memo.
The valves are part of a mechanical system that wears with use. If there is no use, there should be no wear.
Belts on the other hand are organic and wear with respect to time and use. so they should be changed accordingly.
the 600 mile is still a very important service. It ensures that the bike is properly put together and everything is running correctly. experience counts in this area. but thats not to say a duc dealer means a good tech. its kinda like looking for a doctor for your child i guess, you want the best for your kid and youd like to talk to the doc before you let them treat your kid for whatever illness.