Hi,
Got into an accident :( The new 696 is split into two pieces! Front wheel/suspension came off from rest of the bike (engine/rear wheel).
Frame still OK but not sure if the bike could be fixed?
Any thoughts?
thx
Well, we're glad you're still here and able to post.
We will have a better idea if you post some pictures of it, especially where you said it splits at.
If your steering head broke cleanly off of the frame and nothing else then you have a chance. Be sure to check the interior of the steering column (tube) of the frame too.
Again, pics will help
Thanks Sleeper.
I am new here and could not figure out how to attach a picture although I looked at the help/forum guidelines.
picture posted at http://www.ducati.ms/forums/showthread.php?t=58630
r&l
Quote from: digital on February 07, 2009, 02:23:01 AM
Thanks Sleeper.
I am new here and could not figure out how to attach a picture although I looked at the help/forum guidelines.
picture posted at http://www.ducati.ms/forums/showthread.php?t=58630
r&l
Judging by the picture I would say the insurance will write it off, sorry to say [bang]
I will offer 1 dollar though ;D
Wow, glad that your alright. Did you rear end someone or did you just come out of the 7-11 to find it that way? I would agree insurance will say its junk but maybe you can save the motor or at least have spare parts for the new 696 you may be getting.
How did the front end come off without tearing the head tube from the frame?
Quote from: CowboyBeebop on February 07, 2009, 03:15:18 AM
How did the front end come off without tearing the head tube from the frame?
+1 ???
I'm so confused by that picture.
is there a bar/tube that goes into the steering head? did that snap?
you gotta give more info on how you did that? seems the frame sliders did a decent job.
you have to have hit something REALLY hard to have pulled off the front.
This is just a guess, but by the large oval scuff on the front tire and the scrape on the exhaust I would say
jumped a curb or something larger. Like to know more, and I am assuming you are ok?
Bike is probably a write off.
Quote from: digital on February 07, 2009, 02:23:01 AM
Thanks Sleeper.
I am new here and could not figure out how to attach a picture although I looked at the help/forum guidelines.
picture posted at http://www.ducati.ms/forums/showthread.php?t=58630
r&l
http://ducatimonsterforum.org/index.php?topic=109.0 (http://ducatimonsterforum.org/index.php?topic=109.0)
It a frequently asked question...so...
we put it in the FAQ section. ;)
Looks more like a thieft recovery to me.
Quote from: myssrhl on February 07, 2009, 05:59:31 AM
Looks more like a thieft recovery to me.
good one ;D
It is kinda embarrassing [roll]
Well, the bike is brand new and I am new to bikes. The accident happened the second time I was riding the bike. The engine kept stalling (more like four times). I got annoyed (never to do that again on a bike), let the clutch out too fast and gased it a bit too much I guess. The bike jumped and rushed head on into the wall fence (few yards away). It took a split second and could not react. Big split into two pieces and I survived with some injuries!
Well, the insurance thinks the bike can be fixed, but they have not seen it yet :o !!
You can fix anything, it's just a matter of time and money. Of course, if your insurance company is stepping up to the plate, you should have the right to a brand new replacement.
I dunno how stout those head tubes are on the new-style Monsters. On an old-style, the welds to your head tube would have cracked and it would have been an instant write-off.
I've seen an aluminum steering stem that sheared. There was still the standard other damage to the rest of the bike, but because it broke first, the frame tubes were still okay.
If the head tubes (and the rest of the frame) are okay, they may well be able to fix it safely, but it looks like there's enough other damage there that it could be close.
Get a lawyer and sue Ducati over the stalling issue.
Mine stalls at the most ackward times, heck my BMW BCR had the same stalling issues.
(http://www.ducati.ms/forums/attachment.php?s=057b0e280227381250103eecafce5bb4&attachmentid=43220&d=1234000533)
wow!
glad your ok
Glad you're ok man!
Quote from: Obsessed? on February 07, 2009, 06:37:25 AM
I've seen an aluminum steering stem that sheared. There was still the standard other damage to the rest of the bike, but because it broke first, the frame tubes were still okay.
If the head tubes (and the rest of the frame) are okay, they may well be able to fix it safely, but it looks like there's enough other damage there that it could be close.
Another thing to take a close look at is the roundness of the head-tube itself. Make sure it didn't get ovalized at all, or any replacement bearing dropped in there will cause the ovalized portion to get worse rather quickly, and you will lose control of the bike.
wow. glad you are ok.
I am guessing that this picture was taken at the tow yard or shop ? It appears that it slid on pavement for a while judging by the peg bracket and shifter. It all sounds and looks a little strange
I don't want to be rude or anything,
but if that is what happened, may I suggest some sort of class to learn how to ride before you get back on the thing if it is fixable?
good luck with the insurance company dude! [thumbsup]
Quote from: myssrhl on February 07, 2009, 06:44:05 AM
Get a lawyer and sue Ducati over the stalling issue.
Mine stalls at the most ackward times, heck my BMW BCR had the same stalling issues.
Hey dude you need to slow down a bit. Did you not read the part about the OP being a first time rider? Perhaps he hasn't figured out how to ease out a clutch yet. Oh shit let's sue Ducati and the dealership, and the guy that takes out the trash at said dealership because they sold me a bike I haven't figured out how to ride yet.
this is a VS pot to infiltrate the DMF
just say'n
Well I am OK and thanks for caring. For the other guys, take it easy on me. Hey, stupid accidents do happen even to the best riders like me. [moto]
I have taken the MSF but sure I will do a lot more practicing at an open parking lot when I get my next bike ;D.
I do not want to sue Ducati. I figure I have a better chance suing neighbors for errecting a wall fence? [laugh] Could any one recommend a good lawyer? :D
for the bike, the head tube snapped and front end came loose. The bike did not slide but could have been dragged around when compounded by the police. I should be able to fetch the bike tomorrow and take it to the dealer to assess damage. Will know soon what's the insurance take on this!.
la,
Hey Digital, my post was in no way a stab at you. It sucks that you wrecked. I applaud you for taking the MSF as that's a good move. I just hate it when people want to sue to cover up for their mistakes. Sounds like your okay for the most part and that's what's important.
Quote from: bobspapa on February 07, 2009, 09:50:01 AM
this is a VS pot to infiltrate the DMF
just say'n
I was thinking troll at first.
Quote from: Ducaholic on February 07, 2009, 10:22:21 AM
Hey Digital, my post was in no way a stab at you. It sucks that you wrecked. I applaud you for taking the MSF as that's a good move. I just hate it when people want to sue to cover up for their mistakes. Sounds like your okay for the most part and that's what's important.
No worries Ducaholic. I was and am still stunned at what had happened :-\ I will take it easy and slowly.
glad your okay [thumbsup]....but ......i think you just broke the laws of physics... how the hell did that separate again? ???
Quote from: He Man on February 07, 2009, 01:10:04 PM
glad your okay [thumbsup]....but ......i think you just broke the laws of physics... how the hell did that separate again? ???
Looks like the steering stem broke leaving the head intact.
It's a rather bit odd of what has happened here.
I can see the stem bending, but it would have to be a complete catastrophic shear failure of the stem for the forks to come off like this in the picture.
More pictures are required to determine exactly what happened -- specifically a picture of the steering stem itself on the backside of the triple clamps.
It just doesn't make sense! I've seen enough wrecked bikes and this is the first time I've ever since this.
Quote from: MotoCreations on February 07, 2009, 02:07:29 PM
It's a rather bit odd of what has happened here.
I can see the stem bending, but it would have to be a complete catastrophic shear failure of the stem for the forks to come off like this in the picture.
More pictures are required to determine exactly what happened -- specifically a picture of the steering stem itself on the backside of the triple clamps.
It just doesn't make sense! I've seen enough wrecked bikes and this is the first time I've ever since this.
+1
Quote from: MotoCreations on February 07, 2009, 02:07:29 PM
It's a rather bit odd of what has happened here.
I can see the stem bending, but it would have to be a complete catastrophic shear failure of the stem for the forks to come off like this in the picture.
More pictures are required to determine exactly what happened -- specifically a picture of the steering stem itself on the backside of the triple clamps.
It just doesn't make sense! I've seen enough wrecked bikes and this is the first time I've ever since this.
+1 on seeing another picture showing the stem.
It makes you wonder about the quality of that weld in the first place. Either they have made the weld a LOT stronger around the head tube on the 696 or somebody at Ducati failed the welding exam.
(Of course...I suppose they weren't really meant to survive a head-on into a concrete wall were they? ..... [roll]...)
Digital, it seems like in the picture the main wire harness from the bike to the instrument panel/headlight is torn off. That, in it self, may cause the bike to be written off. Fixing the torn harness may lead to other problems down the road. Replacing it requires a great amount of dis assembly not to mention it will sit in the shop for months on end waiting for parts.
It doesn't take a lot to replace the wiring harness. Months on end waiting for parts? You mean the wiring harness? You can order the main harness as one piece. It may take a few weeks, but months? I don't think so...
Front hits on ducks always break the stem from what I've seen. Seen bent triples and a broken stem with dead straight forks quite a few times.
I've got a broken stem laying around from that S4R I parted out last week, and a bent lower triple. Forks are nice and straight, cept the axle clamps/lowers are trashed :(
Well shit happens.But good thing your ok..
Quote from: MotoCreations on February 07, 2009, 02:07:29 PM
It's a rather bit odd of what has happened here.
I can see the stem bending, but it would have to be a complete catastrophic shear failure of the stem for the forks to come off like this in the picture.
More pictures are required to determine exactly what happened -- specifically a picture of the steering stem itself on the backside of the triple clamps.
It just doesn't make sense! I've seen enough wrecked bikes and this is the first time I've ever since this.
Quote from: PizzaMonster on February 07, 2009, 02:25:59 PM
+1 on seeing another picture showing the stem.
It makes you wonder about the quality of that weld in the first place. Either they have made the weld a LOT stronger around the head tube on the 696 or somebody at Ducati failed the welding exam.
(Of course...I suppose they weren't really meant to survive a head-on into a concrete wall were they? ..... [roll]...)
eh, I'm with you guys. This is mind boggling! I was at stand still, opened throttle and bang. Distance covered is at most 6 yards and i couldn't have reached more than 20 miles/hour if I am doing the math correctly.
Whether it is a wall or a car, same thing would have happened! May be the joint is designed to provide some sort of a crumbling zone for safety or there is an issue with the welding!
hmm, coming to think of it again, I should sue Ducati, not my neighbor [laugh]
Very strange hit, Norm said it well earlier, you can fix ANYTHING with enough time and money, the question becomes wether it is economically feasible. This'n, I'd say not. As many others said, check head tube/welds etc. And hey! glad you're ok enough to post!
Glad your OK, that 696 clutch took me a long time to finally get use to. A lot of stalling in traffic from a stop, and like you, gunning it at times so that I won't stall trying to feather the clutch. If you get another 696 practice feathering the clutch on back roads and empty parking lots and the clutch action will become like second nature.
1st off without more pictures it's all speculation... IMPO it doesn't seem to make sense from the one shot provided. The handlebars, top and bottom clamps all seem intact and somewhat lined up ?? The steering neck of the frame seems intact ? The steering stem on the triple clamps is pressed into the bottom clamp and hard to remove for sure and the top of the stem goes up though the top clamp.
(http://ducatiseattle.smugmug.com/photos/469591890_2aZ5A-L.jpg)
I suppose the steering stem could have sheared in two spots top and bottom and allowed the front end to somehow "fall off" ??? I have inspected quite a few crashed Ducati's over tha past 17 years and this one takes the cake if that's what happened. I have seen forks not bend and other parts of the frame or clamps snap from direct head on impact but that's only the case if the rider has the forks bottomed at impact from attempting to stop.
I would like to see other pictures someday. Glad no one was injured.
you know getting DUcati to evaluate your broken parts wouldn't be a bad thing. might save a life if there is a problem with them.
Quote from: Raux on February 08, 2009, 02:45:00 AM
you know getting DUcati to evaluate your broken parts wouldn't be a bad thing. might save a life if there is a problem with them.
I was thinking the same! I want to settle the matter with insurance first then I will get in touch with Ducati.
I will get more picture in couple of days. I kept a little piece that was left behind after the accident and removal of bike. I think it is part of the stem but can not tell which is the top or bottom end of the thing. If you notice one end got a bit rusty after rain.
Hope this helps a bit!
(http://i43.tinypic.com/2rosvat.jpg)
(http://i39.tinypic.com/4eqvl.jpg)
Quote from: digital on February 08, 2009, 04:26:03 AM
I was thinking the same! I want to settle the matter with insurance first then I will get in touch with Ducati.
I will get more picture in couple of days. I kept a little piece that was left behind after the accident and removal of bike. I think it is part of the stem but can not tell which is the top or bottom end of the thing. If you notice one end got a bit rusty after rain.
Hope this helps a bit!
(http://i43.tinypic.com/2rosvat.jpg)
(http://i39.tinypic.com/4eqvl.jpg)
That definitely be the stem. The aluminum part with the holes in it is the bearing preload adjuster. You can see it when you look down at your bars. Goes thru the center hole in your top triple. The rusty part looks like it snapped just above the lower triple.
Would love to see some close pics of the forks and triples, not to mention the steering head of the frame.
I'm with everyone else here... never seen anything like that. ???
It really doesn't matter how or why it happened, if you're insured, you're getting a new bike. If you like projects and can weld, buy it back, if not screw it.
I've been riding a long time and I can assure you that with enough time and mileage, everybody here will do every possible stupid thing possible. I certainly have. You have sooo much more to look forward to. ;D Anything that you come out of alive is called experience, and the definition of experience is "what you get when you don't get what you want".
Bottom Triple failure
curious about the rust though
Quote from: MotoCreations on February 07, 2009, 02:07:29 PM
It's a rather bit odd of what has happened here.
I can see the stem bending, but it would have to be a complete catastrophic shear failure of the stem for the forks to come off like this in the picture.
More pictures are required to determine exactly what happened -- specifically a picture of the steering stem itself on the backside of the triple clamps.
It just doesn't make sense! I've seen enough wrecked bikes and this is the first time I've ever since this.
+1 Something fishy is going on.
The wheel isn't even bent, but the steering stem broke? Seems to me that there was a manufacturing defect in the part.
Quoteyou know getting DUcati to evaluate your broken parts wouldn't be a bad thing. might save a life if there is a problem with them.
+1, DNA/authorized dealer rep should definitely see this!
Never seen anything like this neither, more pics appreciated.
if you had frame sliders the bike would not have received so much damage ;D god im a dick [evil]
Quote from: greenmonster on February 09, 2009, 07:32:29 AM
+1, DNA/authorized dealer rep should definitely see this!
Never seen anything like this neither, more pics appreciated.
You know he did ride into a wall right? Something usually will break if you ride into a wall.
Quote from: Ducaholic on February 09, 2009, 08:32:09 AM
You know he did ride into a wall right? Something usually will break if you ride into a wall.
[thumbsup] that is the bottom line, he should call his insurance agent not Ducati.
something had to give, he hit a wall hard by the looks of it [bang]
There is quite a bit of damage on the visible left side of the bike...
When you hit something while on the throttle the force is higher than when braking even if the speed is the same. Even though, Ducati may want to see the part since the stem should not be the weakest part. I'm not saying anything was wrong with the bike, more a "what if".
QuoteYou know he did ride into a wall right? Something usually will break if you ride into a wall.
QuoteEven though, Ducati may want to see the part since the stem should not be the weakest part. I'm not saying anything was wrong with the bike, more a "what if".
Just better safe than sorry if something is wrong material/constructionwise.
Quote from: causeofkaos on February 09, 2009, 07:38:33 AM
if you had frame sliders the bike would not have received so much damage ;D
Check out the pic...he did.
That'll buff right out. ;D Glad you're OK.
I think you could fix it.
I know I would want too.
That is after the insurance money comes in of course!
Anyways, sorry you had some bad luck and if there is anything I or I'm sure anyone else on this board can do for you, I know we will help out to get ya riding again.
Quote from: Triple J on February 09, 2009, 03:56:20 PM
Check out the pic...he did.
That'll buff right out. ;D Glad you're OK.
Can't believe it took 4 pages for that to be said.
Quote from: Obsessed? on February 09, 2009, 05:33:17 PM
Can't believe it took 4 pages for that to be said.
I know...that's usually in the first 3 responses! [laugh]
Quote from: digital on February 07, 2009, 08:59:00 PM
eh, I'm with you guys. This is mind boggling! I was at stand still, opened throttle and bang. Distance covered is at most 6 yards and i couldn't have reached more than 20 miles/hour if I am doing the math correctly.
Whether it is a wall or a car, same thing would have happened! May be the joint is designed to provide some sort of a crumbling zone for safety or there is an issue with the welding!
hmm, coming to think of it again, I should sue Ducati, not my neighbor [laugh]
so, you were sitting on the bike facing a wall 6 yards in front of you, pinned the throttle/dumped clutch enough to throw you off, the bike then proceeds to go into the wall?
but, to answer the question, and for insurance purposes, I believe the bike is totaled. Repair cost is going to be damn close to its value. that thing is f'd
i think its done...
most insurance companies will total a bike out for waaaaaaay less damage.
Glad you are ok. Please get some more practice before getting on that next bike. :o
I had a rough time with the clutch on my 696 at first too. Takes lots of practice and patience. The space between not engaged and completely let out is tiny, and there is a lot of play there considering they are not adjustable. Better at it now, but still have a slight tendency to stall when cold in the morning.
May I suggest some aftermarket levers? Will help a bit with reach and stalling issues.
Quote from: MonsterMI on February 11, 2009, 06:34:43 AM
Glad you are ok. Please get some more practice before getting on that next bike. :o
I had a rough time with the clutch on my 696 at first too. Takes lots of practice and patience. The space between not engaged and completely let out is tiny, and there is a lot of play there considering they are not adjustable. Better at it now, but still have a slight tendency to stall when cold in the morning.
May I suggest some aftermarket levers? Will help a bit with reach and stalling issues.
I think he needs some other stuff before he gets levers. ;D Good suggestion though.
You know, My Dented Gas tank just cost the insurance company about $1,500. On the 696 they have done away with the $1,500 tank ding problem. I wonder if the 696 steering stem has a designed in shear characteristic to avoid the rather expensive, motorcycle hitting wall & bending the frame problem. It looks like a very clean break, & yes I see that light rust.
Putting in a designed shear point in a steering stem would be like putting a designed sheer point in an aircraft wing.
Bikes don't have crumple zones. ;D
Quote from: Norm on February 11, 2009, 09:56:37 AM
Putting in a designed shear point in a steering stem would be like putting a designed sheer point in an aircraft wing.
Apples & Oranges. The shear or fail point on the older monsters seem to be the steering head coming off. If you design the steering stem to fail at that same amount of force, that steering heads come off & forks bend, and then make the frame out of larger tubing with more weld area, as well as slightly more robust fork tubes, you effectively have the same thing. Now having all that stuff stay together isn't going to make the rider stay on the bike & not crash. Crashing is already a done deal. The question is, for a given force of front end impact at the front wheel (Which has leverage on the steering head)
Do you want.
A) Bent forks & damaged Frame.
B) Have to buy new steering stem.
I'm just saying its possible to design it, I don't know if they did or not.
(http://blog.kornemuz.com/images/200707/20070722_stoppie_crash_moto.jpg)
who says bikes dont have crumple zones
[laugh]
first, it looks like the stem necks down just before the break, typical of a tensile break - weird.
second the frame looks damaged by mishandling of the bike after the wreck (assuming the bike didn't slide at all after you hit the wall). i can see black marks where the two main tubes bend towards the head tube.
i think it will be totaled, take the cash, get a new bike, and forget about this one.
Quote from: MendoDave on February 11, 2009, 02:38:43 PM
Apples & Oranges. The shear or fail point on the older monsters seem to be the steering head coming off. If you design the steering stem to fail at that same amount of force, that steering heads come off & forks bend, and then make the frame out of larger tubing with more weld area, as well as slightly more robust fork tubes, you effectively have the same thing. Now having all that stuff stay together isn't going to make the rider stay on the bike & not crash. Crashing is already a done deal. The question is, for a given force of front end impact at the front wheel (Which has leverage on the steering head)
Do you want.
A) Bent forks & damaged Frame.
B) Have to buy new steering stem.
I'm just saying its possible to design it, I don't know if they did or not.
maybe it's alittle of both. maybe ducati 'fixed' the steering head failing by beefin it up. they are using larger diameter tubing for the frame. by doing that it caused another problem. steering stem failure.
Quote from: Raux on February 11, 2009, 07:12:29 PM
by doing that it caused another problem. steering stem failure.
only a problem if you hit a wall while accelerating ! :-*
bike dropped at the dealer. Insurance is awaiting the estimate from the dealer to decide on next steps.
couple of more pics for the head.
(http://i44.tinypic.com/2cgizo.jpg)
(http://i41.tinypic.com/2jbk9x.jpg)
HOLY CHIT dude. if anyone says the 696 doesn't have power... you're proof that in just 6 feet the bike can do some serious acceleration. i don't think this is anything to do with a weak component, this is a seriously hard crash. glad you had your gear on (helmet mainly).
OK, now we can see the triple cracked. No support, there goes the stem. Like I said before, on throttle crashes are bad, even at low speeds. Many decades ago, when I drove a yellow cab, I got to witness this in real life. Kennedy Airport, taxi hold. Cabs moving at a slow (walking pace) rate of speed. One driver hits the gas instead of the brake. Result? Several cabs mounted each other.