Ducati Monster Forum

Guys, i've done a search for this and can't seem to find a solution. (did find it on the US page, but no solution)

Anyway, i've been having some starting problems over the last four months. Only rarely though. Then about three months ago it started stopping on me mid-flight, as in cruising along southern cross drive when the engine just dies. The dash was still lit up, and the headlight still worked, but it was like someone hit the kill switch. I'd push the starter button while still rolling and away i went.

Had it serviced about three weeks ago, they couldn't find anything, and quite frankly they tuned it so well that it is like a new bike  ;D

About a week ago it took me a minute to start it, happened again a few days ago. Then, two days ago, stopped on me five times on the way home(One being under hard acceleration, changing lanes, which almost threw me off the thing!)  There's no pattern to it: It has stopped on idle at the traffic lights, slowing down, going faster......

Oh yeah, i noticed yesterday while trying to find the problem that i can't always hear the fuel pump 'activate' when i start it up. Started it three times in a minute and i only heard the fuel pump on two of those occasions.

Fuel pump relay maybe??
Battery??
ECU???


Need help  ??? Oh yeah: S2R 1000 05'

Hows about an intermittent fuel flow problem possibly caused by a faulty fuel pressure sensor that will normally shut down the motor when it detects a "low" pressure due to "low" fuel level??.  ;)

Also just for the exercise, during the service did they fiddle/change the fuel filter and did they check the fuel flow pressure with a proper meter, not just eyeball it ??  ???
 
Just maybeez??  ;D

They did change the fuel filter, but the problems had started before the service. It was Flywheels who did the service as well, so i'm not really thinking that they are the type to take shortcuts.

If it was a fuel problem and not an electrical, wouldn't the bike splutter a little more rather than just snap off?

Nup, when I ran out of fuel on the DS it just went bang, dead, nada, nuthing. As  was explained to me, when the fuel level drops to a set "low" level a sensor detects the lack of fuel pressure and shuts off the pump (as a fail safe to avoid engine damage??)
Apparently thats why on the later bikes you cant access all of the fuel in the tank!!  [roll]
When mine stopped there was still 1 or 2 litres left in it.  ;D

I was not inferring in any way that Flywheels stuffed it , but that there might be a slight pressure leak that is causing the sensor to activate and shut the system off!  ;)

Hmmm, how would i go about checking for it then? or do i need a specialist machine?

Made the comment about flywheels to just keep any nay sayers about the quality of the service quiet  ;D

The one that I have seen is an inline gauge that connects between the pump and the injectors and shows the line pressure!

Have a chat to the guys in your maintenance division ( Or maybe its outsourced??) and they should be able to show you the system they would use to check it on the cars. A fuel injection system is pretty much the same bike or car.   [thumbsup]

Maybe even a loose connector/nad or corroded connection in  the fuel delivery system. ?? (Just a thought)

Remeber the K.I.S.S. principle?? "Keep It Simple Stupid". Do all the easy shit first before pulling things apart.  [thumbsup]

Shoot me if this is stupid for saying...
Do Flywheels have the DDS?
I'm not too sure about it's full capability but it maybe worth taking it to a dealer and they can plug in the DDS and it could tell you something that you'll never even thought of looking.
Even much as some people hate taking their bikes to the dealer maybe it'll be worth the pain. You don't want to get skittled on S.Cross drive.

Sorry for not offering techincal advice but it may be really simple - just not so obvious.
 

Just checked my workshop manual. Here is a quick blurb of DDS capabilities:

DDS diagnosis instrument
In short, the "DDS" has the following functions:
-  Error reading (failures) for ignition-injection system errors stored in engine control unit memory and error deletion.

-  Parameter reading, such as engine rpm, coolant and air temperature, atmospheric pressure, throttle opening value, battery voltage, injection times, ignition advance values and so on.

-  Active diagnosis. Enabling of ignition-injection system transducers to check for proper operation and correct control signal (fuel pump, ignition coils, rev counter, injectors and so on). This function also allows entering the safety code for bypassing the immobilizer system.

-  Road test. This function allows you to store engine parameters within a preset rpm range. At the end of their acquisition, these parameters are then analyzed and displayed.

-  If connected to special feelers, the DDS can read voltage, current and temperature values as well as timing belt tension values and pressure values into oil and fuel circuits.

If you can get the diagnostic programming for the Ducs and have a laptop its an easy exercise to plug in and get the fault code (Standard fare on all modern vehicles, even the trains we work on!!) and then go to the area that pertains to that code. ;D

But its usually only a Ducati Dealer that can get access to the programming software??  [roll]

Thanks guys. Unfortunately i've come down with a mean flu today(well yesterday actually, but i thought i'd be good today). So haven't been able to look at the bike. I guess all i can really do is check the fuel lines and spray the crap out of the stand switch and hope it's one of those. If not, Frasers.....

yep i agree with six with these bloody computerize bikes there is a million thing that can cause that too happen right down too a lose wire or connector or the ecu its self , i would email brad too find out about what the mathis machine can do as far as fault findings or you could buy one of the units that the yanks use im looking into that my self best of luck and i hope its just something simple cheers bazz

the exact same thing happened to me, stopping mid way through a ride and sometimes not starting 
see thread "power surge issues"
took fly wheels two attempts and and fair few hundred dollars later
flywheels changed filters, spark plugs and tuned her but it still kept stalling
mine ended up being the engine temp sensor (it was dead) it was screwing up the o2 sensor which in turn was shutting down the engine if there was too much power going to the bike saftey procautions aparently
take it to someone and put it on the dyno and tell em to give it a big load of the throttle see what happens (not bad mouthing the boys at flywheels but they had basicly given up on it and told me to tow it back to fraisers when id reminded them it was under load it kept happening so they put it on the dyno one last time and reved the hell out of it and bingo)
at power mine bucked and jolted and a small flame from the pipes then the engine stopped but everything was still on took 4 seconds to refire back up
they changed the temp sensor and problem solved
tell rob it was andre's bike sounds like the same problem
hope it helps

Thanks for that bigfella, feeling a bit better today so i may venture into the 'shop' and see if i can fix it......  :'(

you can minimise your bill at the shop by checking all the electrical connections, especially the sensor plugs. if you have had water in one the corrosion that builds up may be obvious enough for you to know you have found it. otherwise, a quick spray of CRC 2.26 will clean the connections, add some dielectric grease and make sure you reconnect them firmly. At the very least it's good preventative maintenance, and you may find the problem yourself, otherwise you have saved the shop a job, yourself some cash and they can plug in the DDS and narrow their search, hopefully.


paul.

Ron once told me he had a similar problem on a Duke. He found the temp sensor on the front cylinder had water in the connections. Easy to get to and if you ride your bike in the rain or wash it too much this could be a problem.

Hope this helps you out Hugh!

Rob

See! _That's_ why I don't wash my bike! It's part of my pro-active maintenance regime! It improves reliability!  [evil]

big

Knew there was a reason why you didn't wash!!

Thanks for the heads up on the temp sensor.... Now where and what am i looking for? (i've never really ventured into the electrics of the Duc, only the mechanical bits)  It has been raining a lot over the last week, and i've ridden nearly every day in it(See, not made of sugar  ;D ) So, there's a good chance water is the reason.....

: Cleaned the kickstand sensor today wasn't overly dirty  :'(

Question:
When i was checking things today, I noticed a big arse fuse a little bit loose. Not sure what the fuse is for. If you stand on the right hand side of the bike, and look at the battery, it's attached to the left of the battery. In it's own black housing. Pulled the cover off a found a 40a orange fuse that was half way in it's slot(I'm not sure if i dislodged it when i took the cover off though....)

that is the main fuse for the bike.
make sure you have good contact between the fuse and the contact points, if you need to, use a small screwdriver to tweak them tight, if it was loose chances are that's your culprit.

paul.

Really!? What's the go with that one?

Ok, thats it !! Now I'm definitely paranoid !  [roll]

I ride the DS pretty well every day rain hail or shine, with no probs so far. But I've got the 40k service coming up and I'm going to check out all the sensors and connections that are in the water stream!  ;D

Just in case of course.  [thumbsup]

Possible fix guys.

Spoke to george at Flywheels, Again, he said it sounded like a fuel relay problem(He told me that last week, but i wanted to check all connections first)

Well, i went and grabbed a replacement($17). Plugged it in. Pressed start, and what did it do? Started first go, no delay. Did it again, started.

Put the old plug back in: Firstly didn't hear the fuel pump work(Unlike the first two times), then it just chugged along without starting. Tried it again, same result; no fire.

Plugged the new piece back in, started first pop. could be the goods.

I did notice that the points on the old plug were a little brown.....

 [moto]     Will let you know how it's goes after the commute tomorrow

It sounds like the self diagnosis and Q&A with Flywheels may have got the job done.
Hope it works for you, there is nothing worse than trying to diagnose a little gremlin.

Damn straight there matty! I really do hope that's the problem, as i'm nothing but anal with this bike and i'll be pissed if it's something else.

On another note: visited Frasers today-never been to the new store- nothing short of amazing. Sales department, Peter, is brilliant. Although the parts man needs a personality.

Karla's been looking at a 696 for the last 6 months. Looks like a white one may be in the garage by the end of year(She gets her full licence in November). Today's little road trip to Frasers helped lengthen the shopping list by a few thousand dollars  [roll]

shops that are willing to help diagnose problems with a customer are worth their weight in gold and should be supported as much as possible in all areas of their business. FLYWHEELS (sydney) do their share as do EUROTWINS (brisbane). I for one support eurotwins with tyres, batteries, services, parts etc, without looking elsewhere cause the $10 more i might pay for a battery is nothing compared to the amount i save from the helpful advice and support i get when i have a small issue that some shops want you to "drop it in and we'll get to it".


paul.

Have you checked the little air censor behind the headlight , been told a simple bug can play havoc  [thumbsup]

Did you not know that it is a requirement when you go for a job with Frasers? [puke]

The parts/spares guy at Ducati Melbourne....is.......frickin fantastic!

I know....I nearly fell off my perch!

if your talking about bob he,s a legend  [thumbsup]

I certainly am...I kept wanting to say...."I don't get it, you know what's going on AND you work for NFI????"

He's a legend!

Cherish Bob with love.

My spare parts bloke John is a little hard to draw a conversation out of him. Straight to the point! I suppose I am lucky that he does know my name! [popcorn]

Funny though, when you go to the other side they talk for hours about chrome and belt drives and chrome and saddle bags and........do I need to go on? [coffee]

Pffft...make the beast with two backsen fairy.  ;D