How do you do it?
Slow intro or let them whine it out?
Quote from: trouble on July 12, 2009, 07:43:11 AM
How do you do it?
Slow intro or let them whine it out?
beats me
I think ours is crate training us
rarely come morning is she still in the crate
at some point in the night she has hornswaggled one of us into letting her up on the bed
we're weak
Quote from: Mother on July 12, 2009, 07:47:45 AM
beats me
I think ours is crate training us
rarely come morning is she still in the crate
at some point in the night she has hornswaggled one of us into letting her up on the bed
we're weak
sounds like our yellow lab...
Quote from: trouble on July 12, 2009, 07:43:11 AM
How do you do it?
Slow intro or let them whine it out?
A little of both. You can try to get him/her to go in after a toy. Sooner or later it will become their little fort.
Quote from: Mother on July 12, 2009, 07:47:45 AM
beats me
I think ours is crate training us
rarely come morning is she still in the crate
at some point in the night she has hornswaggled one of us into letting her up on the bed
we're weak
We're very weak.
At least we've got company. [laugh]
Quote from: trouble on July 12, 2009, 07:54:10 AM
We're very weak.
At least we've got company. [laugh]
let her whine it out.
give her a toy, make sure the crate is large enough to move around a bit. If she is sleeping in the same room as you, put her in the crate 1/2 hour before lights out and make sure she does her yard business prior to going in the room.
Do not let her out because of the whining, every time you break down, it just makes it all the harder the next night. .... and in the morning, only let her out when she is not whining ;)
and tell her she's a good puppy when she gets in the crate all by herself [thumbsup]
Get a size appropriate Kong (or several. We got a bulk discount at petedge.com). Fill it w/ peanut butter, cheerios, yogurt, etc and then freeze it. Get the dog in the crate and give a treat, then lob a frozen Kong in the crate. As the dog gets more comfortable w/ the crate, s/he will need less distractions in the crate and you can pack less and less into the Kong, giving the dog less activity time.
A lot depends on the breed. Our greyhounds were crate trained since birth and are generally pretty lazy. More hyper dogs need to be "uncharged" with either activities or lots of exercise. A tired dog is a happy dog and the more tired they are, the easier the crate will be.
Beer to knock 'em out, then duct tape.
Paula will probably chime in with something useful.
The book "Don't shoot the dog" is excellent for properly training a dog.
Quote from: bobspapa on July 12, 2009, 08:02:41 AM
let her whine it out.
give her a toy, make sure the crate is large enough to move around a bit. If she is sleeping in the same room as you, put her in the crate 1/2 hour before lights out and make sure she does her yard business prior to going in the room.
Do not let her out because of the whining, every time you break down, it just makes it all the harder the next night. .... and in the morning, only let her out when she is not whining ;)
and tell her she's a good puppy when she gets in the crate all by herself [thumbsup]
+1 Worked like a charm w/ our Lab.
Some dogs are "dirty", they don't mind sitting and sleeping in their filth, just like BP. If your dog is like this, then you have issues. Other than that, let them whine and take them out on a schedule. You HAVE to stick to the schedule while they learn.
Quote from: duccarlos on July 12, 2009, 11:27:35 AM
Some dogs are "dirty", they don't mind sitting and sleeping in their filth, just like BP. If your dog is like this, then you have issues. Other than that, let them whine and take them out on a schedule. You HAVE to stick to the schedule while they learn.
I only slept in my filth once
Quote from: bobspapa on July 12, 2009, 11:47:34 AM
I only slept in my filth once
All those other times were other people's filth!
Grace actually does really well in her crate at night and only whines when she needs to go out and relieve her tiny bladder. I've only been letting her sleep with me when I know I'm getting up in a couple hours.
We started by crating her while we were home for short periods and I think that helped. But she still has accidents when we go out and leave her for too long (she's still to young to be left for a long time).
Good luck trouble!
Quote from: ZLTFUL on July 12, 2009, 11:53:15 AM
All those other times were other people's filth!
ala the wet-spot
We started by feeding ours in her crate so she got used to it.
Then she was put in there about 45 min-an hour before we went to bed so she was used to it.
She very quickly started going in there on her own to sleep, lay, etc.
The only trouble we had was morning...5 am she would wake up and cry. Not because she needed to go outside, but because she had decided it was time to wake up.
She has managed to find out how to get out of the crate during the day when no one is home. After 6 months of her being well behaved in her crate, we quit using it because she sleeps longer when she's not in it. Now, she sleeps on the floor in our bedroom from 11pm-8 or 9 am without making a peep.
Well, it sounds like you have gotten lots of great advice already. [thumbsup]
Start off with shorter periods of time and gradually increase it. When the time is up, let them out (you can use a timer). NEVER let them out when whining as you will just be training them to whine.
To make it more fun in there, the kong toy works great as rxb described. You can just google "kong recipes" and find lots of suggestions. Smearing the inside with peanut butter is simple, but you can fill it with cheese and microwave it, or the freezing also works well.
Feeding them in the crate is also a good idea, as is keeping toys in there. If you have an old t-shirt you can also put that in, they like to have something that smells like you.
Quote from: duccarlos on July 12, 2009, 11:27:35 AM
Some dogs are "dirty", they don't mind sitting and sleeping in their filth, just like BP. If your dog is like this, then you have issues.
If your dog is like BP you definitely have issues. [cheeky] [laugh]
This typically happens either if the crate is too large for them (you can put in a temporary barrier), or if they came from somewhere that didn't let them out of the crate frequently enough. You can work through it but it is definitely much harder.
Quote from: somegirl on July 12, 2009, 02:03:52 PM
If you have an old t-shirt you can also put that in, they like to have something that smells like you.
Idk that anything with a sensitive nose would want something that smells like trouble.
Quote from: bobspapa on July 12, 2009, 08:02:41 AM
let her whine it out.
give her a toy, make sure the crate is large enough to move around a bit. If she is sleeping in the same room as you, put her in the crate 1/2 hour before lights out and make sure she does her yard business prior to going in the room.
Do not let her out because of the whining, every time you break down, it just makes it all the harder the next night. .... and in the morning, only let her out when she is not whining ;)
and tell her she's a good puppy when she gets in the crate all by herself [thumbsup]
but not so big that the dog feels ok messing in the extra space...
thats all i got.
Some good idea have been mentioned already. This is what worked for me when I was crate training my dog.
You want to make sure that the crate is viewed as a positive environment by your dog. Crates should never be used as a form of punishment. I crate trained my dog as a puppy which made things much easier. If you are working with an older dog it may take a while longer. Dogs are den animals so they "want" to spend time in an area like a crate.
Start out by just leaving the crate somewhere that your dog can investigate the thing on it's own terms. Maybe throw one of his/hers favorite toys in there so when he/she wants it they have to go inside to get it. One real key is to never force the animal into the crate. You want to have them trained so they go in on there own. My dog will go into his crate whenever I ask at will, but he also knows that if he is going in there that means I am leaving. Which bums him out a bit.
After your dog is comfortable with the crate in the environment you can start working on teaching them to stay in it. Start by having your dog do a sit stay inside the crate with the door open. For maybe 30 seconds to a minute. Then increase the time your dog stays inside. As your dog gets used to being inside slowly start to close the door. Depending on your dog these steps could take a few days to a month.
Once I got my dog used to being inside the crate I wanted to extend the period of time he spent in the quickly. To do his I would work with him after a long play/walk session. Like most puppies he would play hard for a while and then crash even harder. I used this to my advantage by getting him in there while he was tired and getting him to fall asleep inside, with the door open. The first time I had to lay next to the crate for a few minutes till he passed out. Then I would slowly and quietly get up and go about my business. I found for the first week or two that he wouldn't freak out as much if when he woke up I was close by. Say sitting on the internet at some forum about motor bikes for instance. He got used to playing and then when we came home going in his crate to sleep.
I started closing the door once and a while. It is very important not to cave once the whining starts. Very important. I found what worked for me was letting him out when he least expected it. You want to send a clear message that you are letting him/her out, not that he/she can come out when they want. Consistency is key here. If you cave to the whining once or twice I guarantee the dog will notice and use it against you as much as possible. Sometimes I would keep him in his crate for five minutes sometimes an hour. I let him know that whining wasn't going to get him anywhere. I would only let him out when he was calm and sitting. If he whined I would tell him he was being bad. It took him a few days, but he picked it up rather quickly. I also won't let him run out of the crate. I would open the door and leave it open for a few seconds and tell him he could come out. He will sit in there now with the door open and won't come out unless I tell him it's ok.
All of this is pretty simplified and it took some trial and error on my part to figure this out. Also what worked for my dog and what would work for your dog could be two different things. If you are working with a puppy it should be much easier to use some of these methods as they are naturally looking to you for directions. Good luck and if you have any questions just shoot.
#1 thing that helped with the crate when our dog was a puppy? A ticking clock. Yep, an old school alarm clock that ticked, ticked, ticked, ticked... Someone suggested it as my dog wouldn't go to sleep unless she was in our bed. Friend reminded us that the puppy had been lisenting to mom's heart tick before she was born and then mom's and sibling's after. So I got a clock, wrapped it in a small towel and put it in the crate. Checked in later and she was curled up against it sleeping like a baby. I also found her sleeping on a pile of clothes next to the dryer once. Yep, the dryer had a semblance of a heartbeat type sound as well.
Thanks everyone for the advice.
I used it and she loves the crate ......so far. :)
Spent the whole night in there and went out this morning and did her business. [clap]
Did I mention I'm smitten with her? ;D
Thans again. [thumbsup]
Another Kong trick for the crate...fill with quality wet dog food and freeze overnight. It'll keep them busy for quite a while, and it's healthy if you use a good wet dog food. [thumbsup]
Other than the already good advice here...remember that pups have smaller bladders so need to go out more often. 1 hour/month of age is a reasonable rule for how long they can hold it. Also make sure to give them a bit of water in the crate...not a big bowl of it though as they'll have to go more and/or they'll just end up playing in the bowl. [cheeky]
+1 on all the advice so far. Tiger loves her crate.
Slight threadjack - I want to start leaving her out of her crate when we leave the house. I hate locking her in her crate. My GF moved in recently and it is really her dog. It had some early chewing issues, but doesn't now. I have a securely fenced yard and plan on putting in a dog door so she can go outside whenever she needs to go. If we started allowing her out of her crate when we weren't around, we could leave her for longer as she could attend to her own exercise and other outdoor needs and my neighbors could come feed her and give her people time for weekends away. That isn't possible with the crate because I just can't leave her in her crate for more than 5-6 hours without feeling terrible. Currently she goes to a cage free kennel when we leave town.
Any thoughts?
Quote from: angler on July 13, 2009, 08:59:30 AM
+1 on all the advice so far. Tiger loves her crate.
Slight threadjack - I want to start leaving her out of her crate when we leave the house. I hate locking her in her crate. My GF moved in recently and it is really her dog. It had some early chewing issues, but doesn't now. I have a securely fenced yard and plan on putting in a dog door so she can go outside whenever she needs to go. If we started allowing her out of her crate when we weren't around, we could leave her for longer as she could attend to her own exercise and other outdoor needs and my neighbors could come feed her and give her people time for weekends away. That isn't possible with the crate because I just can't leave her in her crate for more than 5-6 hours without feeling terrible. Currently she goes to a cage free kennel when we leave town.
Any thoughts?
I leave my 2 dogs out all the time. They also have a dog door so they can go outside whenever. It works very well. My lab/pit mix has been roaming the house since she was 1 year old without destroying anything. They mainly just sleep, but according to our neighbors (retired and love to watch our dogs over the fence) they come out every so often and wrestle around. They both also like laying in the sun on nice days...especially the Dane.
Within the last year or so have limited them to one room which is attached to the door with the dog door. They didn't hurt anything, but the Lab gets on the couch when we aren't home, no matter what we do. She'll lay on an upside down chair we put on the couch...just so that she's on the couch. :o Can't be comfortable! [cheeky] She never hurt anything, but having a dog on the couch all day every day makes it dirty and severely limits its life span. Their room now just has their beds. [thumbsup]
I'd say start with leaving your dog out for short periods...like a trip the the store. Gradually increase it to a few hours to see how she does. Eventually you'll work up to all day. That's how I did it anyway.
It also helps to give them planty of exercise when you are around so they don't have a bunch of unused energy. My dogs get 2 walks per day, everday, any weather. It gets old some days...especially when the weather sucks...but a bored dog is a destructive dog.
Also be sure your fence is secure and your dog isn't an escape artist. Very important.
Personally I prefer leaving dogs out with a dog door (if they can handle it). I always worry about a fire or something and the dog trapped in the crate if I'm gone. :-\
My doberman was a make the beast with two backsing nightmare.
She shit, just pissed, she rolled in it, she jumped in it. and She make the beast with two backsing whined. She never stopped.
God damn worst 6 months I have ever experienced.
I've crate trained 2 labs with no problem.
make the beast with two backsing Greta [roll]
but.........
she did turn into a great dog, so we did something right. The most loving dog I've ever been around and probably the most loyal.
Quote from: cyrus buelton on July 13, 2009, 12:56:04 PM
she did turn into a great dog, so we did something right. The most loving dog I've ever been around and probably the most loyal.
could be the xanax
[cheeky]
;D
[laugh] [laugh] [laugh]
That was a good one [thumbsup]
Quote from: cyrus buelton on July 13, 2009, 12:56:04 PM
My doberman was a make the beast with two backsing nightmare.
She shit, just pissed, she rolled in it, she jumped in it. and She make the beast with two backsing whined. She never stopped.
God damn worst 6 months I have ever experienced.
I've crate trained 2 labs with no problem.
make the beast with two backsing Greta [roll]
but.........
she did turn into a great dog, so we did something right. The most loving dog I've ever been around and probably the most loyal.
We have had much the same experience with Darmah. She goes absolutely bonkers mad when she gets put in the crate, and has ever since she was a pup. Doesn't matter what you do to try and train her for it, she just isn't game. Must be a doberman thing. Great dog other than that though.
Some of those behaviors could have been learned while they where puppies at the breeders. I'm just guessing you didn't have the litters yourselves. Some breeders are pretty bad people, pumping out dogs and if they kept your dogs as puppies in crate the dog could have all sorts of issues/flashbacks/whatever when you try and put them in there. Or they could just be nuts..... ;D
Quote from: DRKWNG on July 13, 2009, 04:11:45 PM
We have had much the same experience with Darmah. She goes absolutely bonkers mad when she gets put in the crate, and has ever since she was a pup. Doesn't matter what you do to try and train her for it, she just isn't game. Must be a doberman thing. Great dog other than that though.
I don't even want to get into the potty training...............
ugh.
Quote from: cyrus buelton on July 14, 2009, 05:05:28 AM
I don't even want to get into the potty training...............
ugh.
No medication for that?
[laugh]
JK, I'm now done with that joke. Sorry to hear about the stuggles with housebreaking, hope it's easier over here.
How old was Greta when you got her?
Getting a dog tired out does wonders for making them more pliable. Some breeds are much more difficult to wear out than others.
Quote from: trouble on July 14, 2009, 05:41:16 AM
How old was Greta when you got her?
She was only six weeks.
I believe that was the problem with a lot of the issues we had raising her.
And we didn't get her from a puppy mill.
It was a local breeder who had done a few litters. By far not a professional, but not some hack.
Greta's Dad's bloodline is quite good. Her Mom, though, is just a regular dog.
I have her pedigree somewhere, let me find it.
A good breeder should not have let a puppy go at six weeks. Things can be done completely unintentionally that can harm a puppies development down the road. Just sayin
our last boxer wasnt crate trained (got him used) and it was a royal pain to put him in a crate, and usually resulted in bruises :P
with our new one we started crate training from day 1...and it is definitely worth the effort.
any time you put her in the kennel (cage style, also doubles as her bed)...she is like ok time for bed.
no fuss or anxiety
Watson loves her crate
Dinnertime (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KW9AVoEMNFM#lq-hq-vhq)
Well, so far she loves the crate.
Goes in at night maybe fusses for less than a minute, and it's lights out.
Wifey says she goes in there when I'm not home and sleeps.
Quote from: trouble on July 14, 2009, 04:07:46 PM
Well, so far she loves the crate.
Goes in at night maybe fusses for less than a minute, and it's lights out.
Wifey says she goes in there when I'm not home and sleeps.
[thumbsup] [thumbsup]
OK, this little 4 month old is peeing every two hours.
Is this the norm?
Quote from: trouble on July 17, 2009, 07:45:18 PM
OK, this little 4 month old is peeing every two hours.
Is this the norm?
water cut-off time is 7pm
overnight she's fine
during the day we're taking her out every two hours and she's going.
Quote from: trouble on July 17, 2009, 07:57:07 PM
overnight she's fine
during the day we're taking her out every two hours and she's going.
Why not wait till she asks to go?
she dosen't ask. :-\
;D
Two hours seems kinda frequent to me anyway.
I'd stretch it about 15 mins between walks...
and bump it up after a few days if she's OK with it.
You'll find her limit. ;)
Mostly it's if she naps and we're not looking when she get up it's pee time.
It's only been a week so far.
She's still a baby.
Quote from: trouble on July 17, 2009, 08:09:16 PM
Mostly it's if she naps and we're not looking when she get up it's pee time.
It's only been a week so far.
You should always take them out immediately after a nap. It's an easy way to train them that outside is the place to go...even if it's a lot when they're a pup. Ah...the joy of puppies! ;D
Another good method is to hang a bell on the door, then ring it every time they go out. They'll quickly learn to ring the bell when they want out, so you don't miss it. My parents did this with their pup and it worked really well (they used a small string of Christmas sleigh bells). [thumbsup]
Quote from: Triple J on July 17, 2009, 09:38:42 PM
You should always take them out immediately after a nap. It's an easy way to train them that outside is the place to go...even if it's a lot when they're a pup. Ah...the joy of puppies! ;D
Another good method is to hang a bell on the door, then ring it every time they go out. They'll quickly learn to ring the bell when they want out, so you don't miss it. My parents did this with their pup and it worked really well (they used a small string of Christmas sleigh bells). [thumbsup]
+1 on the bells. We trained Tiger to ring a string of bells hung by the back door.