Is the clutch pack for a 620 APTC the same as the non APTC wet clutch? I was speaking with CA Cycleworks and we determined that although the Ducati part # is not the same... that the part itself could be. The difference in part #s could be just as simple as a difference in the number of plates. So... any info at all concerning your experience with replacing the clutch pack on an APTC wet clutch is welcomed. Aftermarket, OEM, otherwise?
Also, I want to increase the amount of clutch pull at the lever. Yes, I said increase. The 620's APTC clutch has such soft springs, that although the clutch is virtually effortless to pull, it has always seemed to have a lack of positive engagement to me. I'd trade a bit of lever pull effort for a bit more bite. That being said, I've heard that I can swap some stiffer 750 non-APTC springs into my 620 APTC clutch and have a nice blend of slipper + more bite. Please let me know if you have any FHE.
Thanks.
The clutch basket and discs are of a smaller diameter. The springs may be able to be swaped but no other parts will transfer. I swaped the entire clutch from my APTC 620 for a 800 SS unit, would never go back with the improved feel and lack of clutch slip.
I scored an 800 SS clutch assembly. Waiting for it to arrive. Can you please describe your experience with swapping the APTC for the 800 SS on your 620? Is there anything I should pay extra special attention to, or is the swap pretty much direct? Please let me know.
Thanks
It was a bolt in swap. The bolt on the clutch drum is going to be difficult to remove if you don't have an impact. The primary gear on the crank should be replaced at the same time as the primary gear built into the clutch drum, ducati only sells these as a pair for alot of money. I elected to risk it on mine, just make sure to check the the gears for rough spots on both. Good luck with the swap, hope you injoy the new clutch.
You must have scored the "other" 800SS assy on ebay, right? ;) I got mine from ebay 2 weeks ago. The lever pull WILL be stiffer. I swapped out the slipper in my '06 S2r for the 800SS and after 150 miles I like it much more than the stock slipper.
Quote from: Dave328 on September 05, 2009, 02:06:57 PM
You must have scored the "other" 800SS assy on ebay, right?
yep
Any issues with the swap besides what cap posted about?
Quote from: rule62 on September 05, 2009, 11:48:10 PM
yep
Any issues with the swap besides what cap posted about?
Mine bolted right in without any issues. The gear on my basket was perfect. Only hiccup was not having the clutch holding tool to tighten the hub nut. Good thing I'm an auto tech and have the impact needed.
Wait -- you're swapping out an APTC clutch for a plain non-slipper type?
Why?
Quote from: ducatiz on September 06, 2009, 08:25:38 AM
Wait -- you're swapping out an APTC clutch for a plain non-slipper type?
Why?
Some of the issues in the 2nd paragraph of my 1st post. Lack of clutch feel, slipping when I don't want it to slip, not enough bite. Confirmed by Cap and Dave. Then, when pricing a set of plates... the APTC was $326, the non APTC came in at about $200. IMHO the APTC wet clutch was more of a gimmick or a way to compensate for the somewhat "ham-fisted" clutch technique of a new rider who may have chosen the smaller bikes, than a real advantage.
Quote from: rule62 on September 06, 2009, 08:48:48 AM
Some of the issues in the 2nd paragraph of my 1st post. Lack of clutch feel, slipping when I don't want it to slip, not enough bite. Confirmed by Cap and Dave. Then, when pricing a set of plates... the APTC was $326, the non APTC came in at about $200. IMHO the APTC wet clutch was more of a gimmick or a way to compensate for the somewhat "ham-fisted" clutch technique of a new rider who may have chosen the smaller bikes, than a real advantage.
gotcha. I haven't had much problem with mine, even after riding for a long time on older bikes, but the plates might make me change.. i have at least 2 or 3 regular clutches lying around..
i'm confused too. people pay serious $$ for dry slipper clutches and you are switching from a slipper to non-slipper?
With the right oil and good plates it seems the APTC clutch would be a bonus not a drawback of the smaller bikes.
A dry slipper clutch is a different beast. Adjustable and awesome. The cheaper APTC stock set-up on these smaller bikes is not everyone's cup of tea... at least not mine. The lightened flywheel I've got helps enough with down-shift rev matching. I think I'd rather manually slip the clutch with my grip on the lever than have the mechanism do it for me. Please don't get me wrong, I'm not knocking the APTC. I just don't care for it.
The APTC is not a true slipper clutch. A true slipper uses a ball and ramp setup that is tuneable thrugh spring pressure to decouple the engine from the clutch during decell. The APTC relies on alot of slop in the basket with a ramp plate to take up the clearance on accell. When, and in many cases if, the APTC slips it is putting extra wear on the clutch plates. It does all come down to rider preferance, and with the increasing number of bikes ducati is installing this clutch into I do beleave I am in the minority in not liking it.
Does anyone happen to know the specs for the thickness of the plates? metal / friction / overall stack? I received the whole clutch assembly from an 800SS. The plates all "look" like they're in good shape, I just want to check to see if I really need to buy a new clutch pack now, or if this one's still got life left in it.
If you did get the set from ebay, he sent me some close up pics of the clutches. To me they looked almost new/plenty of "life" in them. The frictions looked to have the same amount of wear as my slipper discs with 3400 miles.
Swapped the APTC for the 800SS unit today. Man what a difference. More lever pull. Really grabby. YAY!
Put the bike in 6th and stood on the rear brake to get the nut loose. Worked like a charm. (Along with another friend holding the rear wheel.)
As an aside... the 800SS unit was shipped with the clutch pushrod. I compared it to the one that came stock on my 620. The 620 was longer. The side that goes into the slave, with the o-rings, had some extra length. I did not use the one that came with the 800SS unit. I kept the stock clutch pushrod, and it works like a charm.
Anyone need an APTC with a worn clutch pack???
Quote from: rule62 on September 26, 2009, 11:02:53 PM
Swapped the APTC for the 800SS unit today. Man what a difference. More lever pull. Really grabby. YAY!
Put the bike in 6th and stood on the rear brake to get the nut loose. Worked like a charm. (Along with another friend holding the rear wheel.)
As an aside... the 800SS unit was shipped with the clutch pushrod. I compared it to the one that came stock on my 620. The 620 was longer. The side that goes into the slave, with the o-rings, had some extra length. I did not use the one that came with the 800SS unit. I kept the stock clutch pushrod, and it works like a charm.
Anyone need an APTC with a worn clutch pack???
what is the main purpose of the switch? both should be able to put down the power of the bike. what did you gain/lose?
My APTC in my s2r slips also, mostly when I go from cruising to WOT it on the freeway. :(
Quote from: DarkStaR on September 26, 2009, 11:13:26 PM
My APTC in my s2r slips also, mostly when I go from cruising to WOT it on the freeway. :(
i only had that problem when my oil didnt match the ambient temp and load i had on the bike.
Quote from: Raux on September 26, 2009, 11:07:55 PM
what is the main purpose of the switch? both should be able to put down the power of the bike. what did you gain/lose?
I did not like the way the APTC delivered power or the lever feel (both effort and friction range). My APTC started slipping when applying power, not only when ham-fisting a down shift. When I went looking for a clutch pack for the APTC, the only one I could find was the OEM for over $300. I didn't want to spend the dough to replace a pack on a clutch that I didn't much like in the first place. I found an entire 800SS clutch assembly for half that price. Now I've got a regular old clutch. It grabs better, doesn't slip when I don't want it to, and has better lever feel with a wider friction range that allows me to slip it manually. And replacement clutch packs can be found readily from many manufactures for under $200 bones.
...and I've read a few posts about APTC clutch baskets failing and really causing problems.
oko a mod to put in the back of my head.. great... thanks for making the money list longer
How much of a difference did this swap make to the amount of power it felt like the bike was putting down?
I've got a 620 with stock clutch, and it just doesn't seem to have the pep it should - even with a 14t front sprocket. I know that it's not a "big" engine, but it especially seems to struggle at freeway speeds when you really get on it...
The amount of power didn't change, just the delivery of it. There's a more direct link between the engine and transmission now. A more direct link between what my left hand is doing and what the bike is doing in response. And no more wondering when and how the clutch will engage (or not) when I'm banging through the gears on a spirited straight-away.