Ducati Monster Forum

Recently lost a lot of weight, down to 165 lb and probably will end up at around 160.  The 0.9 kg/mm fork springs are now way too stiff (they were actually a little too stiff even when I weighed 185), the bike is almost unrideable.

The spring-rate charts and on-line calculators all say that I should be using 0.8 kg/mm springs.   Tried to buy some springs from Race-Tech yesterday, found out that the smallest they have is 0.85 kg/mm.   Same is true of Traxion, I'm assuming that they get their springs from the same source.

Anyone know of other sources for fork springs?  Thought about checking Ohlins, but I'm wary that they will only offer a complete re-do of the fork internals, which I really don't want to pay for since all I need are springs.

Sounds like a stupid question; but, can a spring be modified somehow, to reduce the rate?

This is totally how I feel. :P

I had .85kg/mm installed @ 155lbs (in the flesh). It was perfect for canyon carving, but a bit on the stiff side for the potholes in nyc. so i can only inmagine .9 would be worst.

edit: I read your other post. What forks did you have prior to your S2R1k showas?

The S2R1K has always had S2R1K forks  :P 

Last year I had Race Tech respring & revalve  the forks for my weight.  I'm pretty sure that they don't know what they are doing when it comes to Monsters.  They probably have a pretty good handle on the SBKs, but they don't seem to realize that the weight distribution on a Monster is somewhere between a Standard and a Sportbike.  They seem to think that what works for a SBK will also work for a Monster.

I didn't realize how much better the forks could be until I covered some miles on that beat up old 996.

 [laugh] i mean, what are you comparing the S2R1k forks to? or what were you riding before you expeirenced ur S2R1k forks.

the 996 has a larger catridge size and better internals. What part number did racetech use for your forks? i had a local shop install racetech stuff in my forks. THey were experienced in what works and what doesnt (Steve and Jay at ECS if youve heard of them) and when i compared them to my old bike (95/m900 with a stock SBK catridge) they arent on par with each other, but pretty close. I really like them the way they are now in comparison. I remembered ICON PMed me a few times about which parts i used, im not sure if he ever got them installed.

My other rides are the 996 and an Aprilia RST1000.  In the 37 years of riding before buying the Monster,  I've owned a myriad of street and dirt bikes ranging from a Kawasaki 75 to a Hardley.  Seems irrelevant to me.

Some of the Race-Tech shops *might* know what they are doing, but the folks at the HQ in Corona are clueless.

You can't *safely* reduce the rate of a spring.

RaceTech must have recently changed their offerings, I've bought .80's from them in the past.

Did you call them or just look at their online availability?

I read your other post about how you didnt like your race tech setup. I think its great. But i dont have much to compare it to. So your past experiences will play a role in what you think is good.

I was in their shop, spoke with two different people. They are located just down the hill from my house.  I checked with Traxion as well, and they say the same thing.  Sonic Springs web-site also lists nothing for any of the Ducs less than 0.85.  I don't know of any other sources, and I'm thinking all of the aforementioned probably get springs from the same source.

There has to be a spring with the right dimensions and rate available, but it is probably not sold/identified as intended for this application.  If you have a P/N for the 0.8 springs, it would be greatly appreciated!

If thats the case your best bet is to break out the ruler and measure the springs you have in there now (or the stockers) and start making some calls. If you know hte measurements, then they can find something that is similar sized with the right spring rate.

you could always throw some clip ons and try to get closer to the 50/50  and use .85 [evil]. I like it and im lighter than you.

Ivan....... I think the obvious thing to do is gain some weight.  It'll be much easier & cheaper & you won't have to back the preload all the way out [laugh]

If you need any help gaining wait or having a fat guy ride it, let me know ;)

No clip-ons for the Monster, when I'm feeling that spry I ride the 996.  I've started doing what you suggested, I know the OD, the length, and the rate that I want, I've found some options.

I tore into my forks this afternoon, and there is still some preload that I can remove.  I can buy the 0.85s from Race-Tech, Sonic, whomever, and set the preload to the bare minimum.    This might get me close to where I want to be.  Progressive makes a spring that is the right dimension, but unfortunately its progressive, duh!   That still might be a last resort though. It starts out at 0.71 and increases to 1.16.   There are a couple of other places that I'll look into this week for straight rate springs.

im not a fan of the stock progressive springs. I rather the .85kg/mm and throw a few lead weights on the front.

Cheaper and easier without a doubt, but I feel so much better now. 

Nice work [thumbsup]

How did you do it ???

Only time I seem to lose weight is when I'm stressed & these last few years have been mellow [laugh]

At 165 the 0.85 springs should be workable for you I think.  The sag numbers should tell the story.  Maybe altering the compression setting will get you in a happier place?  Or dropping the oil level a bit?  Also don't fixate solely on the front...if the rear is out of whack or out of balance you can sometimes get the sensation of a harsh front end.  A good suspension guru might be able to make things right.  Having said that, I also find that my SBK is far more plush than my monster!

BK

Dr said that I needed to lower my cholesterol.  I've just been watching what I eat and exercising more regularly (read: everyday).

I can't even get anywhere near 20mm of sag with the 0.9 springs, I'd like the sag to be about 30mm to match the rear.  On top of that, I'm still losing weight and will probably be dropping another 5 to 10 lbs.   All of the on-line calculators and charts point to 0.8 as the correct rate, but I'm probably going to be forced to try the 0.85 with minimal preload.  So far, no luck finding anything lighter except for progressive rate springs, which I'm not enthused about trying.  

I'm not even to the point of worrying about oil level and compression damping, need to get the correct sag first.

The rear sag is fine at 30mm.  I had to back off some preload to account for the weight loss.  I'm sure I'll need to make more adjustments once I have the front end sorted.  Fortunately, I have a lot of adjustments and leeway at my disposal for the rear shock.

Try seeing what Ohlins has, I'm going to be putting an Ohlin's shock into my 848's rear shock.  So I will have a Showa unit with an Ohlins shock.  The spring is physically different from the showa one but it still works.

Gotcha.  Yep, sag first!

BK

After insisting that 0.8 springs are too light for my weight, I'm happy to say that Race Tech stepped up. [thumbsup]   

They took some dirt-bike springs (FRSP375046, these are 36.8mm dia, 472 mm long, and 0.46 kg/mm rate), and cut them down to increase the rate to 0.8 kg/mm.  They also revalved the fork, less rebound and higher compression damping (compression = CH32, rebound = RH16).  Internal preload is set for 8 mm.

For the first time in a long time, the fork actually compresses when I sit on the bike!   Haven't accurately measured the sag yet (nobody here to help right now), but as best as I can tell from the zip-tie it is right around 30mm.

Went for a short ride around the hood, did some ugly stoppies to see how much travel is being used, and so far so good.  Hope to get out to the twisties tomorrow to really shake things out.

This is supprising. I am between 150 and 155 most of the time and I can get the sag spot on with the stock for springs. I have raised the rear ride height as much as possible wich helped a bit but I am still adding preload.

The stock springs are progressive, at max rate they reach 0.6x kg/mm.  I'm not surprised that you can get the sag correct, given your weight.  The stock springs didn't work well for me, I had to run a lot of preload and the front never felt planted when I was riding hard.  I went from stock to 0.9, which proved to be way too much spring.

I see. I missed the swap to 0.9 somewhere. Must pay more attention and drink more coffee before posting.  [coffee]

 [popcorn]

Went to Palomar yesterday, by way of Deluze Rd (the back way into Fallbrook). 

(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2630/3937483582_0333ca64c2_o.jpg)

My suspension is finally working very well.  The fork is now compliant enough to deal with the expansion joints on the freeway, and there is enough spring to prevent bottoming when I land on the far side of the cattle grates on the east side of Palomar.  The only change that I made was to add 3 clicks of compression damping to tighten up the front when braking or going through roller coaster type hills.

 

Drag gin this back up, my forks get dropped off at Racetech for the same treatment tomorrow.  ;D

Say what?

Thanks Ivan for posting this.

Thanks also to the folks at Racetech, the tech took time to listen to my concerns, understand what type of riding I do and explained to me what to check on the bike before and after I reinstall the legs.

For the first time ever, even since new, the bike now drops on it's own weight, and then again when I get on it (never did this before). Looks like we're on the right path. Standing next to the bike I can now push on one bar and the forks will compress, never did that before.

What they found inside was some small plastic guides that were binding up with a washer and sending the washer off at an angle and stopping my forks from compressing unless enough force was put on them to overcome the binding. Which would explain why if I tapped the front brake everything would work a little better. There was a bit too much oil in both legs, and something about the rebound had 24 clicks of adjustment (should only be 14) and that the screw needed to be preset.

If this works , it may just get the 1k a bit longer stay in the garage.
 

My thread on here about my ktech 996 forks is exactly the same issue need softer springs than 9.0 etc seems only racetech can help with 8 or 8.5 springs... with 9 I get no sag at all