Ducati Monster Forum

I might have a couple small parts that I want to get coated black (probably matte or semi-gloss finish).  Usually the shop I use charges a minimum, so if you combine a batch of parts it can be really inexspensive.  Like under $10 for each of us if you have a couple small parts.

Post up...let's talk...  :)

can he do any prep work first? need my swingarm smoothed and then PC.

I think they can do minor prep, rough sandblasting, etc.  If you want a nice finish you might want to do some/most of the prep yourself.  Also, a swingarm is big enough I don't think it's something that would see much savings going in with other parts.  I use Arizona Powder Coat.  They have pics on the wall of some very nice show quality projects, but the quality of things I have had done with them are just OK.  The finish is durable, the price is right (cheap!) and they are perfect for small parts, which have been great for the several things I have had done. 

What type of parts would qualify as small? A few parts I can think of off the top of my head at this late hour that I am interested in is the swingarm (clearly not small), the subframe (also likely not small), the rearsets, and maybe the cans, though I am not sure on that yet. Let me know if any of that meets your requirements.

I want to warn anyone that is powder coating structural components on their bikes, power coating negatively impacts fatigue life. So, make sure not to power coat structural welds which are normally stress concentrations. The reason that it impact fatigue life is due to the increase in surface roughness due to the sand blasting of the surface. Increased surface finish roughness creates locations for fatigue cracks to initiate.

The rearsets are along the lines of what I had in mind.  As long as we want the same color... Not sure if standard powder coating would hold up to the exhaust cans, you should look into ceramic coating for that.  I'm pretty sure there is a place in town that does ceramic coating specificaly for exhausts. 

The colors I'm thinking about are matte/semi-gloss black (for my passenger pegs) and possibly a silver/aluminum color for some brackets if anyone is interested in that.  I might also have a need for gloss black soon if anyone would rather have the gloss finish. 

When are you planning on doing this D?

Now I need to go and check to see what I could take off of my bike that could be powder coated!!  [evil]

Damn, I was going to powder coat my frame. I guess I better start putting the bike back to gether.

so the frames aren't powdercoated?

My father was one of the first pioneers to bring powder coating to the US.  The EPA regulations were written off of his shop and his process control.  It was originally developed by Nazi Germany during WWII as a steel tank coating process.  Some of the first gun/transformer systems were the size of a VW bus.  Now they are down to an 8oz handgun (use certain polymer plumbing to generate the required KV of static electricity). 

I will say this from looking at most powdercoat work... no shop in this valley does it correctly.  When done correctly it is the strongest coating you can have.  If not done properly it is one of the worst.  If you do not have proper adhesion you can have pockets form under the surface, which will draw moisture and cause corrosion.  Also, they do not properly cure the material.  To do so the surface temperature has to reach a certain point, which is specific for the powder you are using.  I can go on about this all day but bottom line is... just use a rattle can of rustoleum.  You will get just as good adhesion and durability as powdercoat jobs in this valley; and save some money in the process.  Plus, if you happen to scratch the part (which proper powdercoat should not scratch off... one of our quality checks involced a coin scraping as hard as you could press against the surface with no marring) it is not a big deal... just respray it.

And yes, Ducati does not use powdercoat on any parts.  Nor does any of its suppliers (wheels, suspension, etc.).

Hmm....I can tell you the powdercaoting I have had done is WAY more durable than any spray can or even some professional conventional spray jobs I have seen or done.  THe finish isn't as "nice", as in if you are looking for a show car gloss I haven't seen that with powdercoat, and that's not what I would use it for.  Swingarm?  Perfect application.  Pegs, brackets, etc...also perfect.  I'm not doubting your expertise, just noting my own first hand observations and the use of powdercoat industry wide. 

By the way....my frame fell apart on the last ride....got a couple rock chips near a weld.  ;D

Wait, what about your frame?  ???

Yeah...I'm thinking on sandblasting all the paint off and then take it a little further to save some weight on the metal too before re-coating.  I'll weld 'er up with my little 110v Harbor Freight line-feed welder, tell the powder coater to go extra thin on the paint (save weight), and then extra hot in the curing process to help with paint adhesion and heat treat the metal.  Sound about right boys?

 [thumbsup]  [coffee]  [drink]  [puke]  ???  [thumbsup]  ;)     

 ;D

Are you saying that part of your frame broke? What do you mean "my frame fell apart"? Did it happen on the way back last Saturday?

Show some photos. I want to see your broken bike.  [popcorn]

You know, I've heard that it's good to ride with only a half tank of gas in order to save weight too.
Also, definitely take off your blinkers - they add some serious unnecessary weight.
I'd also recommend changing your tire air while you are at it. I hear that Perelli is now selling some X-tra light tire air.

I don't know exactly whay happened...I guess the rock chips negatively impacted the fatigue life of the frame due to the increase in surface roughness near the structural welds.  Parts of the trellis frame just fell off completely near the head tube.  I almost crashed but it didn't happen until I went over the little curb pulling into my driveway.

Again... ;)   and ...  [thumbsup]        [laugh]

The problem is that you didn't have any speed holes drilled into your frame ahead of time. That would have increased not only the structural integrity in the frame, but also would have helped you go faster. I've also read accounts where rocks end up not hitting the sensitive welds, but instead, they actually go through the speed holes thus avoiding any problems!

Speed holes?

Hmmm ... you know ... I did get hit in the helmet with a small rock on the I-17 on the way back last Saturday.

Maybe some speed holes in my helmet would help ... but then isn't my skull at risk? Maybe some speed holes there too then?

I thought you already had speed holes in your head?
 [cheeky]

racers use nitrogen. helium would be lighter. maybe fiber locknuts instead of steel? i got it...
start your bike at home and leave the battery there!  D hee hee G.

Now this is the kind of thread that makes sense.
My hands are burning from rust prevention acid trying to clean out the rust (on the vfr fuel tank) when now I hear that I should just let the rust work its way through and their you have it, A lightened bike....natures speed holes  [thumbsup]

Muffler bearings... what about the muffler bearings?

...and cross-drilled brake hoses?

http://kalecoauto.com/ (http://kalecoauto.com/)

Sorry man but I have to call BS. I am sure your father is a great guy and all, but I doubt he is a Nazi defector and introduced powdercoating to the US. Also, you shouldn't run around knocking all the powdercoat shops in a city of 4 million people just because your non-expert opinion thinks the few that you have seen don't "look" correct. I seriously doubt you can tell whether proper adhesion has taken place by a quick visual inspection.

Also, sandblasting sure enough adds surface roughness and surface roughness can effect fatigue strength. That said, the frames on our bikes are quite strong and really don't suffer that much from the load cycling they are subject to. I have known many motorcyclists that have tons of miles on various bikes and I have never heard of a frame cracking from fatigue. There were stories about first gen. Hyabusas that had this problem but that was due to faulty welds. In the end, these bikes will put up with more than you think.

How about powdered-sugar coating?  mmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Ok... call BS all you want.  We DID test samples from several shops.  And I have tested several sets of race wheels that have had surface finish failure.  Do you have a paint MIL gauge?  Do you know the proper testing procedures?  Taken a coin to any items you have had coated?  Have you inspected the work from these shops?

How dare you insult me in a way of making reference to a Nazi defector.  I was making reference to the timeframe and the techonlogy base.  It is known in several arenas that the germans were ahead of us in technology during WWII.  I am not saying that he was THE guy to do so but when he started using powdercoat in this country there were only 2 colors available and they were from Switzerland.  He had a local chemical company in KC analyze and duplicate the material and helped with the development of other colors and the wrinkle texture process. 

You might want to ask more questions before running your mouth in that manner. 

Powdered toast?  mmmmmmmm

...and what about that movie "Powder"?  Didn't that pale kid wear a coat?  and a hat?  ...and then there was all that lightning and stuff.

Why would I know some ASTM, ASME, etc. testing procedure for something that I don't work on. And having tested a few samples doesn't qualify you to be able to verbally bash every shop in town. And by the way, I said I doubt that he was a Nazi defector. Nothing to get your skivvies all in a tangle over. Additionally, I will continue to "run my mouth" in whatever manner I see fit.  [thumbsup]

The new 1100 will need A LOT of black powdercoating (amongst other changes).  I'll have to post up a similar thread when that day comes.  SOON!!  I know Tom Hull uses a guy for powdercoating.  Who are you using Deitrich?

The WHAT WHAT!?!  Sweet!  Have to see it soon.  What did you do with the 'ol 620?  

I use Arizona Powder Coat.  Because they're cheap.  I let the fear of adhesion, corrosion, and cracking frames fly in the wind.

"Frames in the wind... powder coated frames in the wiiiiiind."

Awesome IZ, if anyone here deserves a new bike it is you.  [beer] To the next 50,000+ miles.

Is powdered milk the same as powdered coffee creamer?  How do they tell the difference between powdered milk and powdered creamer?  Do they take more water out of the creamer than the milk?  I mean... they're both powder.  This is all so confusing.

Are you sure some other "powder from back in the day" hasn't affected your thinking?  ;)

+1 on Monster Dave's timing question -- we've got a rusty old early 60s Vespa in the garage that I haven't yet laid a wrench on, but I can think of a number of bits off the top of my head that could use freshening...

Well.... The only advantage to combining parts is if we want things the same color, or if you want me to be the parts taxi. :)  (I ususally drop off/pick up parts on my lunch break.)  I will have a small handful of parts that I want to do in the near future.  I'll be looking at gloss black in probably about 3 or 4 weeks realistically.  The matte black parts I am ready to go anytime.  I'm flexible.  If you have something that might fit the bill let me know and we'll coordinate. 

Also, if anyone wants to see examples of what kind of finish quality to expect you can see parts on my bike or Pennyrobber's bike that we have had done.

Got that from earlier in the thread; are you still thinking of alu/silver as well?  I'll look the scooter over tonight and see what on there will look good in matte or gloss black.

One thing it will need at some point is a lot of re-chrome work done (if we want to shoot for stock, which isn't necessarily the case) Do they even do that in the U.S. anymore?

oooh, I can pull my top tripple off my CB-1 and get it re-blackened!

hm. I'll have to get the Hawk back up before doing that though.
Can't stand to be without a bike for that long!  :)

I've got a bunch of little things i'm looking to get done....and if they'll be around 10 a piece then i might have to bring some up your way! im thinking.....triples, rearsets, chrome headlight ring, headlight bracket, swingarm....exhaust brackets.....maybe a few more bits.....are wheels considered small?