Doubled the scheduled maintenance interval with the 11 deg 1198 engine so they say.
http://www.ducati.com/news/multistrada_1200_arrives_with_more__strada__between_major_services/2010/02/04/index.do (http://www.ducati.com/news/multistrada_1200_arrives_with_more__strada__between_major_services/2010/02/04/index.do)
Now that's pretty cool. [thumbsup]
Nice find [thumbsup]
I had heard, from several media outlets, the interval was longer. Hearing it from Ducati directly ends the speculation on how long "longer" is.
More [moto]
I hope they changed something in the motor. The 7500 on the wifey's 695 is pushing it, IMO.
Quote from: MrIncredible on February 05, 2010, 09:15:06 AM
I hope they changed something in the motor. The 7500 on the wifey's 695 is pushing it, IMO.
RTFA ;D
"Doubling the mileage between valve clearance inspection has been made possible with the introduction of a new valve seat material combined with improved combustion efficiency and temperature management designed into the Multistrada's new Testastretta 11° engine."
Quote from: sally101 on February 05, 2010, 09:23:11 AM
RTFA ;D
"Doubling the mileage between valve clearance inspection has been made possible with the introduction of a new valve seat material combined with improved combustion efficiency and temperature management designed into the Multistrada's new Testastretta 11° engine."
Reading articles smacks of effort.
11 degree overlap seems pretty tame compared to some of the other 4V motors
Quote from: 1KDS on February 05, 2010, 04:11:50 PM
11 degree overlap seems pretty tame compared to some of the other 4V motors
No fooling, the tamest one I know of is the S4/S4R/ST4s at 29 degrees.
I bet my lawnmower has more overlap. I don't see how overlap affects valve adjustment intervals. The valves are still opening and closing at the same speed. Milder ramps maybe?
maybe the different materiels for the valvetrain mean less wear meaning less adjustment in the long run?
Note that 11 degrees refers to the valve center lines and not to the overlap of the valve event's themselves. . .
I guarantee this engine has more than 11 degrees of overlap ;)
Also-
I <3 this motorcycle!!!!!!!!!!!!
Quote from: Monsterlover on February 06, 2010, 05:58:05 AM
Note that 11 degrees refers to the valve center lines and not to the overlap of the valve event's themselves. . .
I guarantee this engine has more than 11 degrees of overlap ;)
It actually does refer to valve overlap
QuoteDoubling the mileage between valve clearance inspection has been made possible with the introduction of a new valve seat material combined with improved combustion efficiency and temperature management designed into the Multistrada's new Testastretta 11° engine.
So called because of its minimized 11° of 'valve overlap' - the interval of crankshaft rotation during which both the intake and exhaust valves are open at the same time
(http://ducatiseattle.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/Ducati-Seattle-Misc-shots/11-degree/781646382_Boaks-S.jpg)
Quote from: Monsterlover on February 06, 2010, 05:58:05 AM
Note that 11 degrees refers to the valve center lines and not to the overlap of the valve event's themselves. . .
I guarantee this engine has more than 11 degrees of overlap ;)
That is what I thought until I looked at the website. I would like to see the whole valve timing diagram
Hmm.
Interesting.
Well. . .
With only 11*. . .
it's ripe for a turbo or supercharger [evil]
Here's the whole slice of text:
With the arrival of the new Multistrada 1200, Ducati will reach a significant milestone in the company's engineering history by extending the periods between major services on the new model to an owner-friendly 24,000km (15,000 miles).
Doubling the mileage between valve clearance inspection has been made possible with the introduction of a new valve seat material combined with improved combustion efficiency and temperature management designed into the Multistrada's new Testastretta 11° engine.
So called because of its minimised 11° of 'valve overlap' - the interval of crankshaft rotation during which both the intake and exhaust valves are open at the same time - the new Desmodromic power plant not only transforms the world championship-winning 1198 configuration into a super-smooth 150hp motor for sport touring, but also improves fuel efficiency, emissions and cost of scheduled maintenance.
-------------------------
I've yellow texted the two statements that I think are relevant.
I'd like to see what the lift and duration numbers are as well.
Less overlap also means that the valves spend more time in contact with the seat, which should transfer more heat to the valve seat (with its special "new" material) and keep them cooler than in the 1198.
I think overlap is independent of the time the valve is closed as it only describes the relationship of an intake to an exhaust valve.
As mentioned above the duration number is what counts. Or rather 360 degrees - the degrees of duration should equal degrees of cam rotation the valve is closed. Which could be converted to time at a given rpm.
^^^^^ Wow, could you dumb that down a little for me.
Don
Overlap is when both intake and exhaust valves are open (this is for a short period of time)
The amount of overlap is just how long both are open at once. The reason engines have it is because someone figured out that if you open the intake slightly before the exhaust starts to close, the exhaust gasses rushing out (think momentum here) actually pull in some fresh intake air. It helps get more air in to the cylinder.
Duration is how long a valve is open. 360 degrees of duration would be a cam lobe that is perfectly round (as in it would never close) Since valves have to close the duration is never 360 degrees. More duration = valve open longer. Less duration = valve not open as long.
Note that duration is measured from the instant the cam starts to open the valve to the instant it returns to fully closed.
I probably just made it worse, huh ;D
Quote from: Monsterlover on February 06, 2010, 11:31:16 AM
Overlap is when both intake and exhaust valves are open (this is for a short period of time)
The amount of overlap is just how long both are open at once. The reason engines have it is because someone figured out that if you open the intake slightly before the exhaust starts to close, the exhaust gasses rushing out (think momentum here) actually pull in some fresh intake air. It helps get more air in to the cylinder.
Duration is how long a valve is open. 360 degrees of duration would be a cam lobe that is perfectly round (as in it would never close) Since valves have to close the duration is never 360 degrees. More duration = valve open longer. Less duration = valve not open as long.
Note that duration is measured from the instant the cam starts to open the valve to the instant it returns to fully closed.
I probably just made it worse, huh ;D
But its measured by crank rotation so 720 degrees would be a perfectly round cam.
That i did not know
:)
This is crap..i do not trust those service intervals at all even if they come from DUCATI its insane ...Same as VW and Audi with 20,000 mile oil changes and services which lead to lots of new engines being required .....all a plan to sell more spare parts or new vehicles .
DO NOT FALL FOR THIS BS. 7500 -8009 miles is OK but 15000 a recipe for disater.
20K mile oil changes? Where are you getting this? First change at 5k, then 10k, then 20k, 30k, 40k, etc...
AFAIK 10k is about the longest factory recommended interval, which is about twice as long as I would run it.
I don't know about doubling the service interval for valves, but cut the price in half and you can call me a customer.
Oh sweet Multistrada, I hear your siren call, but the dusty wallet is a shrew that cannot be tamed.
Quote from: Speeddog on February 06, 2010, 07:37:52 AM
So called because of its minimised 11° of 'valve overlap' - the interval of crankshaft rotation during which both the intake and exhaust valves are open at the same time - the new Desmodromic power plant not only transforms the world championship-winning 1198 configuration into a super-smooth 150hp motor for sport touring, but also improves fuel efficiency, emissions and cost of scheduled maintenance.
I assume you are implying that this is all emissions related?? The tech presentation they gave said they did this to make the motor less peaky and give more power across the rev range. You can always throw the 1198 cams in there if that's your thing...
Quote from: jerryz
DO NOT FALL FOR THIS BS. 7500 -8009 miles is OK but 15000 a recipe for disater.
Many people have claimed they can increase the interval by using better quality seats and collets... Sounds like this is exactly what they did. Do you have some technical reason why 15k is impossible?
The interesting thing I see is that for the majority of buyers won't hit the first valve service before the warranty runs out.
Quote from: NAKID on February 08, 2010, 03:25:06 PM
The interesting thing I see is that for the majority of buyers won't hit the first valve service before the warranty runs out.
I think this is going to be a part of it - There's some gambling in all of these decisions - cost / benefit analysis - how many miles will really be put on the bikes
Was the seat material something other than is commonly used in Asian bikes? Does a Desmo valve contact the seat with that much more force than a sprung valve?
If the closers are too tight, I'd say yes.
The closers will never tighten up.
uh, they surely can be set too tight.
Quote from: NAKID on February 08, 2010, 03:25:06 PM
The interesting thing I see is that for the majority of buyers won't hit the first valve service before the warranty runs out.
Not to sure about that. Target audience isn't the current monster or SBK owner but rather touring riders who in general ride a lot more. Question is whether the real touring riders will bite.
on a side note:
Ducati Multistrada 1200 spotted testing (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ta4HQ_U6eUg#normal)
finally a normal sized rider to show us how big the bike is
Maybe it's because I'm vertically challenged, but I wouldn't call someone that flatfoots a bike with 850mm seatheight 'normal sized' :-\
I can flat foot it. . .
Quote from: Monsterlover on February 25, 2010, 02:34:49 AM
I can flat foot it. . .
Yes ,but like Travis you are also an Ent and therefore nowhere near what we humans call normal sized.
here is the thing i'm thinking,
many people have said that the first or second valve checks at 6 and 12k miles are the ones where you have to change the shims bc the collets are work hardending, then the intervals can be spread out to 10-15k bc many have found that the numbers dont change as much in general.
now maybe ducati is saying ok, do the intervals at 15k miles basically skip the 1, 2 intervals and change shims then. now maybe your bike after 6k miles still runs right but bc the valves are not "perfect" but only slightly out, then it won't affect things too much. maybe most people wouldn't even know the difference bc its so gradual, then when you get to 15k, all the shims are out of spec but now you change all of them, but your collets are now work hardened and then the next interval at 30k miles very littl has changed.
just a thought on my part, who knows none of knows for sure until someone gets one of these things and put the miles on it and does it a couple of times.
maybe the minimized 11° overlap compensates the valves being out of spec somehow?
A bit more tech info here:
http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2010/Mar/100330multi3.htm (http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2010/Mar/100330multi3.htm)
Quote from: NAKID on February 06, 2010, 06:51:25 PM
20K mile oil changes? Where are you getting this? First change at 5k, then 10k, then 20k, 30k, 40k, etc...
My renault while living in France had either a 30k km or 20k km oil change interval right in the manual. It was insane.
And yes, I think the 15,000 miles ducati is advertising is BS. You can make incremental changes in engineering, like gaining 10 or 15% at a time. I have never experienced a design evolution that gains 100% like they are claiming.
mitt
Mitt, I can see your logic and agree with it.
However, think about how many miles the test bikes get ridden. Isn't it possible that while testing the new engine design they discovered that valves stayed in spec consistently longer?
Enough so that they could extend the service intervals?
/devil's advocate :)