My wife read an article about this show about how sketchy it was a few weeks ago.
Well......we decided to check it out the past two weeks.
holy shit.........this might be the most disgusting and self exploiting child show ever.
It makes me sick to watch it.
These parents are turning their 4yr olds into whores. It is so disgusting.
I just had to vent as this is just an awful show and am appalled it is on TV.
I have already wrote the network with my thoughts which are far worse then I have posted here.
[bang] [bang] [bang]
prudes
I think your disgust is as justified as it is misdirected. Is it the show that is exploitative, or the parents? That is, do you think these pageants would exist without a television show about them? Also, how well do you think the show "Perfectly Well-Adjusted Toddlers Participating in Healthy Activities With Their Emotionally Stable Parents" would do?
Quote from: il d00d on February 10, 2010, 06:43:57 PM
I think your disgust is as justified as it is misdirected. Is it the show that is exploitative, or the parents? That is, do you think these pageants would exist without a television show about them? Also, how well do you think the show "Perfectly Well-Adjusted Toddlers Participating in Healthy Activities With Their Emotionally Stable Parents" would do?
+1
Kids pageants are creepy as hell, but they were certainly going on prior to being on TV.
What percentage of the programs viewers watch it just to be morally outraged, or feel normal by comparison, or a million other shaded reasons that are something other than sincere appeal? I know folks who listen to Rush Limbaugh
just to be angry. If there wasn't an audience, it wouldn't be on television (and I guess if it's a season 1 show it might not be for long. I dunno.) A show like that has to draw a substantial following of people who are simply inclined to watch the strangest things that modern media has to offer. A hundred years ago they'd have gone to sideshows.
Is it the networks job to act as a moral guardian, when Bringing The Weird is profitable?
what's worse?
Toddlers and Tiaras
or
Girls gone wild
which one do you think has a more damaging impact to a young female?
Quote from: Mother on February 10, 2010, 10:38:13 PM
what's worse?
Toddlers and Tiaras
or
Girls gone wild
which one do you think has a more damaging impact to a young female?
Parents aren't pressuring/forcing their daughters to participate in Girls Gone Wild.
I assume. :P
Quote from: zarn02 on February 10, 2010, 10:59:50 PM
Parents aren't pressuring/forcing their daughters to participate in Girls Gone Wild.
I assume. :P
true
just a discussion point
Obviously shittin with u on the Prude remark. The show is bad.
Yes, the fault lies with parents, viewers and society in general. Writing letters to all those parents, the audience and a good portion of the rest of the world is quite a task. Writing the network is doable, enough letters and the show is history. Good on ya, Cyrus!
Quote from: il d00d on February 10, 2010, 06:43:57 PM
I think your disgust is as justified as it is misdirected. Is it the show that is exploitative, or the parents? That is, do you think these pageants would exist without a television show about them? Also, how well do you think the show "Perfectly Well-Adjusted Toddlers Participating in Healthy Activities With Their Emotionally Stable Parents" would do?
My disgust is more at the network and the parents. I can't decide which.
These pageants aren't new.
Jean Bene-Ramsey was one of these "toddler beauty queens" or whatever you call them.
It isn't the kids fault, I realize that. It is the parents fault for pressuring them. If you watch the show, the parents get all sorts of worked up and pissed off when their kid doesn't win.
Quote from: Mother on February 10, 2010, 10:38:13 PM
what's worse?
Toddlers and Tiaras
or
Girls gone wild
which one do you think has a more damaging impact to a young female?
There isn't even a similarity, so I am not sure what there is to discuss.
Girls Gone Wild consists of consenting 18 year old adults (ok, most of the time, I know there is some legal troubles for the owners for having some 17yr olds on there, but majority are of legal consenting age).
They agreed and signed off to be filmed doing god knows what they do; I've never seen girls gone wild, but heard about it.
Parents are forcing make up and glamour on these poor little girls. It pisses me off.
Quote from: howie on February 11, 2010, 04:04:10 AM
Yes, the fault lies with parents, viewers and society in general. Writing letters to all those parents, the audience and a good portion of the rest of the world is quite a task. Writing the network is doable, enough letters and the show is history. Good on ya, Cyrus!
I got some canned response from the network. I am sure nobody will ever read it, but it was worth a shot.
You going to cry in a corner cause the world isn't the pretty place you thought it would be?
Quote from: cyrus buelton on February 11, 2010, 05:31:35 AM
There isn't even a similarity, so I am not sure what there is to discuss.
Girls Gone Wild consists of consenting 18 year old adults (ok, most of the time, I know there is some legal troubles for the owners for having some 17yr olds on there, but majority are of legal consenting age).
They agreed and signed off to be filmed doing god knows what they do; I've never seen girls gone wild, but heard about it.
Parents are forcing make up and glamour on these poor little girls. It pisses me off.
I suppose the similarity can be with your comment of turning girls into whores
the idea that a dressed up 4y/o is a whore vs an 18y/o video'd in a sex act
the discussion point is what does the most damage?
taking an 18y/o girl and showing her that its ok to act in that manner in order to secure approval of males
or
playing dress up with a child who desires the same approval from her parents?
The reason I draw the comparison is I am similarly disgusted with GGW as you seem to be with T&T
Quote from: Mother on February 10, 2010, 10:38:13 PM
what's worse?
Toddlers and Tiaras
or
Girls gone wild
which one do you think has a more damaging impact to a young female?
It could probably be argued that one leads to another...
Quote from: hoyden on February 11, 2010, 05:54:20 AM
One could probably argue that one leads to another...
I agree
but I wonder if the need for approval from the parents overides the need for approval from boys later in life
Quote from: duccarlos on February 11, 2010, 05:51:08 AM
You going to cry in a corner cause the world isn't the pretty place you thought it would be?
I know the world isn't a pretty place.
I am about the most pessimistic person around; you should know that by now.
In my perfect world, the douchebags I work with wouldn't leave a drop of coffee in the pot; they'd take 2 seconds to make another pot.
Re: Girls Gone Wild - Yeah, I can see your disgust with it. I think most of the shit that goes on there is too much alcohol leading to dumb decisions.
Actually, I have seen it once. I saw a clip once that a friend from college showed me, as he and a bunch of other guys I know were in the shot when this girl was flashing the camera or some shit like that.
Quote from: Mother on February 11, 2010, 05:56:41 AM
I agree
but I wonder if the need for approval from the parents overides the need for approval from boys later in life
"overrides" or creates?
I'd wager that unmet needs from parents (particularly the father for a daughter) become the desire for attention from boys later on.
And often unhealthy attention (see: GGW....)
of course, my armchair psychoanalysis could be totally off.... :)
Quote from: Mother on February 11, 2010, 05:56:41 AM
I agree
but I wonder if the need for approval from the parents overides the need for approval from boys later in life
I think we could call them both bad feedback loops and call it a day. Personally, I think sexualizing girls at a young age has a little more to do with any permanent damage done. They are forcing these kids to go through the motions of acting like adult women when they don't have any notion of what that means.
As far as the show goes, it is likely there are as many people who feel the way you do about it Cyrus, so I think the net effect of any exploitation on the part of the network is a wash. Sure they are getting advertising dollars, but they are also generating a lot of outrage in the process. So "misdirected" was probably an overstatement - good for you for telling it like it is [thumbsup]
Having never seen the show...
What is the network's angle?
exploitation or documentary?
also, why is it assumed that the kids are being forced?
my friends daughters of that age eat up the idea of playing dress up like mommy
From what I have watched here is my take:
we have watched the show twice before rendering an official opinion: last night was the second and last time we will watch.
Basically each week they follow like 4 girls and their parents who are "prepping" them for the pageant they have entered.
They interview the parents about the clothes they wear, they interview the girls about how they want to win (while they have rollers/curlers whatever the make the beast with two backs you call them in their hair).
For God's sake, last night one of the little girls went to a dentist to get an implant put in because she lost a tooth (hmm...natural life occurrence) the week before the pageant, so the Mom took her to get the implant so it wouldn't hamper her chances of winning.
So the day of the show, they dress in these expensive dresses (I recall last night one cost >1,000$.........that was more than my wife's wedding dress....but then again, she got lucky and ended up getting one for 60$, but that is a different story all together. It was from Jessica McClintock....special order dress that the original person never wanted....odd size, so they couldn't sell it <my wife has a rather "large" chest....so shopping is hard for her). Anyway.
So they put all sorts of makeup on these girls, blah blah blah........they pick the winners. Parents get pissed off, the kids cry, etc.
By the end of the day.....the little girls are asleep on the floor or chairs, etc.
I assume they are being forced because of how the parents act. They yell at their child, they do this, they do that.
You'd have to watch a show to get the idea.
I am not sure what the angle is...........I guess documenting child pageants?
http://tlc.discovery.com/videos/toddlers-and-tiaras/ (http://tlc.discovery.com/videos/toddlers-and-tiaras/)
You can watch clips.
Note: they even spray tan these girls...........
Disclaimer: I have never watched a second of the show. The promo commercials piss me off.
I have a cousin who 15 years ago put her daughter into these "pageants" she is now 17 and the biggest spoiled brat b*tch I have ever met. cute and knows it.
Quote from: Mother on February 10, 2010, 10:38:13 PM
what's worse?
Toddlers and Tiaras
or
Girls gone wild
which one do you think has a more damaging impact to a young female?
The difference is simply a matter of time.
Quote from: cyrus buelton on February 11, 2010, 07:07:08 AM
my wife has a rather "large" chest....
Understatement of the year.
The show sucks...as do almost all "reality shows". I've never watched it...only seen clips on The Soup...but you can tell it sucks, and the people on the show are most likely dirtbags exploiting their children.
That said...not all pageant kids are like that. I went all the way through school being friends with a girl who consistently won the Cinderella pageants in elementary school (I think that was the pageants name...not positive). She was a normal kid, and turned out just fine from what I remember in High School. Of course...they'd never show a normal family on a reality show...you only see the wackos.
I don't think pageants are bad as a whole. Just like any activity, it depends if the kid is interested in the activity, and if the parents support/regulate them (as opposed to pressure/force them). I played little league baseball and wrestled beginning at age 6. I enjoyed it, but there always was one kid every year that absolutely hated it, but was forced to play by his parents. Same thing IMO.
another tragedy is that these kids lose their childhood. They're so busy being small adults, they don't run, fall down, laugh 'til it hurts, all the things being a child entails. That's also when they learn socializtion, so what're they learning? ( I'm guessing that all stimulus is toward them - not a thought on their own, and everyone doing things for the so they never learn to do it themselves)
lots of reasons to boycott the show.
Quote from: Triple J on February 11, 2010, 09:42:02 AM
The show sucks...as do almost all "reality shows". I've never watched it...only seen clips on The Soup...but you can tell it sucks, and the people on the show are most likely dirtbags exploiting their children.
I have nothing to add. I don't like pageants...I won't let my daughter enter them (if/when/whatever). I think they are probably okay, except when taken to the extreme. Such as, the people on that show.
I, BTW, have never watched it....I've also only seen clips on the Soup.
I just wanted to say, I thought it was funny that someone else here was also a Soup watcher [laugh]
Quote from: Le Pirate on February 11, 2010, 10:39:25 AM
I just wanted to say, I thought it was funny that someone else here was also a Soup watcher [laugh]
The Soup rules! Might be the best show on television. [thumbsup] [laugh]
Meh-probably almost every show out there, reality and otherwise, exploits in some way.
Quote from: cyrus buelton on February 11, 2010, 09:19:09 AM
That's probably true.
I keep wondering how you pulled that one off ;D
Quote from: metallimonster on February 11, 2010, 11:15:28 AM
I keep wondering how you pulled that one off ;D
I'm a nice guy, what can I say ;D
(http://images.fanpop.com/images/image_uploads/Olive-little-miss-sunshine-44166_1280_1024.jpg)
Quote from: DuCaTiNi on February 11, 2010, 01:51:06 PM
(http://images.fanpop.com/images/image_uploads/Olive-little-miss-sunshine-44166_1280_1024.jpg)
[laugh]
love that movie!
Quote from: duccarlos on February 11, 2010, 05:51:08 AM
You going to cry in a corner cause the world isn't the pretty place you thought it would be?
Hey, it works for me! [bang]
Quote from: minnesotamonster on February 11, 2010, 02:42:02 PM
[laugh]
love that movie!
Probably gonna get ragged on.....
but that movie was make the beast with two backsing hilarious. My wife made me watch it and I actually enjoyed it.
Just looked it up on IMDB as I thought it came from Sundance, but did not.
Also didn't realize it won some Oscars.
Quote from: cyrus buelton on February 12, 2010, 05:35:40 AM
Probably gonna get ragged on.....
but that movie was make the beast with two backsing hilarious. My wife made me watch it and I actually enjoyed it.
Just looked it up on IMDB as I thought it came from Sundance, but did not.
Also didn't realize it won some Oscars.
I think movies "go" to Sundance; they come from there.
Quote from: NorDog on February 12, 2010, 05:38:12 AM
I think movies "go" to Sundance; they come from there.
Sorry for my improper terminology.
Update:
was just having this conversation with my employees.
one of them grew up with a girl that was in these fashion shows for several years.
1. She turned into a pregnant dog
2. Turned into a pyscho
3. Started on Crystal Meth
4. Is currently in prison
Correlation does not imply causation.
Quote from: cyrus buelton on February 12, 2010, 06:26:41 AM
Update:
was just having this conversation with my employees.
one of them grew up with a girl that was in these fashion shows for several years.
1. She turned into a pregnant dog
2. Turned into a pyscho
3. Started on Crystal Meth
4. Is currently in prison
Yeah, but I heard she was voted "Miss Cell Block" at the Ohio Reformatory for Women.
This thread is far more entertaining than that show ever could be.
Quote from: NorDog on February 12, 2010, 06:58:08 AM
Yeah, but I heard she was voted "Miss Cell Block" at the Ohio Reformatory for Women.
I actually think she is in the Kentucky Prison system
Quote from: MrIncredible on February 12, 2010, 06:50:47 AM
Correlation does not imply causation.
You know, I think that universities should require everyone to pass logic.
Especially anyone going into a, uhm...
social field.