I have 400 and 600 grit metal sandpaper and a flat surface. Can you describe the process of sanding shims?
Thank you!
get some 220 and get back to me. ;D
seriously...those grits are unnecessarily fine for the job.
Get a diamond stone. After you get back to Nate, he'll tell you to use a figure 8 motion to avoid creating an uneven surface, and turn the shim occasionally. You'll have to take a few measurements to get an idea of how fast you're removing material.
Quote from: Dan on February 19, 2010, 12:55:53 PM
Get a diamond stone. After you get back to Nate, he'll tell you to use a figure 8 motion to avoid creating an uneven surface, and turn the shim occasionally. You'll have to take a few measurements to get an idea of how fast you're removing material.
actually I don't use a figure 8.
I push straight ahead and rotate the shim 90
0 every other push.
I find it to cut faster and still maintain a flat level surface...but I use 220 paper.
Quote from: ducpainter on February 19, 2010, 01:00:45 PM
actually I don't use a figure 8.
I push straight ahead and rotate the shim 900 every other push.
I find it to cut faster and still maintain a flat level surface...but I use 220 paper.
;D
Well. I do the same thing, but I was always told to do the figure 8 thing, so....
The stone is way easier to use than paper, and they last forever.
Quote from: Dan on February 19, 2010, 01:07:11 PM
;D
Well. I do the same thing, but I was always told to do the figure 8 thing, so....
The stone is way easier to use than paper, and they last forever.
I never prescribed to the do as I say theory.
I want everyone to have the opportunity to do it wrong like me. ;D
Quote from: ducpainter on February 19, 2010, 01:00:45 PM
actually I don't use a figure 8.
I push straight ahead and rotate the shim 900 every other push.
I find it to cut faster and still maintain a flat level surface...but I use 220 paper.
the way I've been doin it since 1966. [bow_down]
Never thought of using my diamond stone, that's a great idea. It's much smaller and easy to handle than my 12" square marble tile and sand paper. Almost any pattern should work if you rotate the shim often and don't press on one side of it excessively.
Scott
we were taught the figure 8 for not flattening round things, like valve balls
I do the push and rotate for anything flat, like shims
Always something new to learn around here. [thumbsup]
I'm curious, has anyone noticed any difference in the actual size when measuring a now "hot" freshly sanded shim?
Quote from: 2001cromo on February 22, 2010, 03:53:48 AM
I'm curious, has anyone noticed any difference in the actual size when measuring a now "hot" freshly sanded shim?
I don't move fast enough to get them hot. ;D
Quote from: ducpainter on February 22, 2010, 03:55:05 AM
I don't move fast enough to get them hot. ;D
LOL, but thankfully your wit is still quick ;)
Quote from: 2001cromo on February 22, 2010, 05:12:41 AM
LOL, but thankfully your wit is still quick ;)
Seriously, I don't think it's an issue.
If you're concerned you could always use some oil on the wet/dry as a lube.
It would get difficult to hold on to the things though.
I usually use WD-40 on wet/dry, no problem holding on to the shims.
Scott
Quote from: 2001cromo on February 22, 2010, 03:53:48 AM
I'm curious, has anyone noticed any difference in the actual size when measuring a now "hot" freshly sanded shim?
hasn't happened for me
*not with any of the matl we use here, anyway...
The coefficient of thermal expansion for steel is 0.00000645in/in/deg F,
the slight temp increase will be negligible with the desired tolerances.
Quote from: aaronb on February 22, 2010, 12:40:27 PM
The coefficient of thermal expansion for steel is 0.00000645in/in/deg F,
the slight temp increase will be negligible with the desired tolerances.
This is not what I wanted to see a day after my Heat Transfer exam... :-\
Yeah, try writing 'negligible' for an answer on your exam and see how that works out :)
Scott
Quote from: Dan on February 19, 2010, 12:55:53 PM
Get a diamond stone. After you get back to Nate, he'll tell you to use a figure 8 motion to avoid creating an uneven surface, and turn the shim occasionally.
I do, and advise other people to do this, but I've been thinking about _why_ I think it's the right thing... Best I can work out, it's because that's what my Dad taught me...
I've got no first hand or even second hand experience that shows that figure 8's are neccessary or better than any other sanding/grinding pattern. I can convince myself that the regular turning of the shim is quite likely to be a good idea though.
big (I'm still gonna do it the way Dad told me though...)
Quote from: bigiain on February 26, 2010, 01:15:09 PM
<snip>
big (I'm still gonna do it the way Dad told me though...)
As well you should. [thumbsup]
My dad didn't...and still doesn't know which end of a screwdriver to hold.
It's just the way I learned.
I think the figure 8 is a pattern that alternates pressure nicely. If you just go back and forth or even in circles you tend to put more pressure on the edges forming a very subtle high spot in the center. With all the change in direction of figure 8 I think it minimizes that.
But 'dad said so' probably holds as much water as any BS I come up with ;)
Scott
Am I the only one that uses a die grinder with a sanding disc on it and a set of mics to check?
Quote from: Monsterlover on February 26, 2010, 04:10:49 PM
Am I the only one that uses a die grinder with a sanding disc on it and a set of mics to check?
Yes
Why do you think that is?
Quote from: Monsterlover on February 26, 2010, 04:22:32 PM
Why do you think that is?
'cuz you're awesome...
or just don't care if the surface is flat.
Not sure. :-*
It's the awesome part.
For the record, the openers I did came out flatter than they came from the factory.
Quote from: Monsterlover on February 26, 2010, 05:30:52 PM
It's the awesome part.
For the record, the openers I did came out flatter than they came from the factory.
How do you know? [evil]
[austin powers]Allow myself to quote. . . myself [/austin powers]
Quote from: Monsterlover on February 26, 2010, 04:10:49 PM
Am I the only one that uses a die grinder with a sanding disc on it and a set of mics to check?
Quote from: Monsterlover on February 26, 2010, 06:31:08 PM
[austin powers]Allow myself to quote. . . myself [/austin powers]
I believe the gist of Nate's question was how do you know they
weren't flat from the factory"? If you don't know their flatness initially, you can't argue they are now flatter than they originally were.
AKA, you is wrong, biznitch :-*
I'd be shocked if there were even 10 folks on the board that could actually measure the flatness of a shim.
Good lord Mr I. . .
Note that I mentioned I use a set of mics to check flatness. . .
I just measure around the perimeter in 4 or 5 spots and note the largest and smallest reading in .0001"ths
When I was done the opener was .002" thinner and the variance between my low and high measurement was *less* than it was when I started.
Hence it was flatter than came from the factory.
How is this hard?
:-*
Quote from: Monsterlover on February 26, 2010, 08:05:57 PM
Good lord Mr I. . .
Note that I mentioned I use a set of mics to check flatness. . .
I just measure around the perimeter in 4 or 5 spots and note the largest and smallest reading in .0001"ths
When I was done the opener was .002" thinner and the variance between my low and high measurement was *less* than it was when I started.
Hence it was flatter than came from the factory.
How is this hard?
:-*
We're not on the same page-are you measuring a new shim or the one you took out?
The one I took out of the bike.
Why would you buy a new shim and sand to size when you can do that to the factory one for free?
I've only done a couple valve adjustments. . .
am I missing something?
Boy...
easy to tell it's winter
and that we've I've been drinking
;D
I would just like to point out that .0001" can change based on the 'feel' of the guy using the mic.
or if your eyesight is bad and can't read the vernier :D
True, that's why you have the same guy check before and after ;)
Quote from: Monsterlover on February 27, 2010, 08:58:01 AM
True, that's why you have the same guy check before and after ;)
yeah, but when you have inspectors for certain parts being made... sometimes it can be fun :)
You're preachin to the choir brother Teddy :)
Quote from: Monsterlover on February 27, 2010, 11:12:33 AM
You're preachin to the choir brother Teddy :)
aren't you supposed to be on a plane? :P
I was on one.
Now I'm waiting to see if they'll let me on the next one ;D
Quote from: Monsterlover on February 27, 2010, 11:26:40 AM
I was on one.
Now I'm waiting to see if they'll let me on the next one ;D
we can only hope. [laugh]
;D
Quote from: Monsterlover on February 27, 2010, 11:12:33 AM
You're preachin to the choir brother Teddy :)
I'm actually hoping to end my days as a fabricator :)
Quote from: Monsterlover on February 26, 2010, 08:32:45 PM
The one I took out of the bike.
Why would you buy a new shim and sand to size when you can do that to the factory one for free?
I've only done a couple valve adjustments. . .
am I missing something?
You don't know how flat the shim came from the factory, only how flat a used shim from your bike is.
So,,,, Yep ;)
Quote from: teddy037.2 on February 27, 2010, 02:30:42 PM
I'm actually hoping to end my days as a fabricator :)
I moved from machinist to distributor sales guy and I call on lots of places I used to work at.
I couldn't go back to a shop job.
Half for the freedom I'd give up and half for the health risks.
As a hobby though . . .
Bring it!
(this thread jack brought to you in part by the letter "Q")
;D
Quote from: Monsterlover on February 27, 2010, 03:40:38 PM
I moved from machinist to distributor sales guy and I call on lots of places I used to work at.
I couldn't go back to a shop job.
Half for the freedom I'd give up and half for the health risks.
As a hobby though . . .
Bring it!
(this thread jack brought to you in part by the letter "Q")
;D
If you're concerned for your health...
you should learn to paint. ;D
Quote from: Dan on February 27, 2010, 03:34:53 PM
You don't know how flat the shim came from the factory, only how flat a used shim from your bike is.
So,,,, Yep ;)
man not you too...
You make a good point. I'll give you that.
However, the shims are turned (probably on a Swiss style machine) and heat treated. No grind work.
I started at .0006" tir and got it to .0001 tir.
I'm calling it good.
Go ahead, say it. Say Kevin did a good job.
Now say it again, record it and YouTube it. Link here.
;D
The awesomeness just oozes out of your pores. How do you stand it? [laugh]
Quote from: ducpainter on February 27, 2010, 03:42:17 PM
If you're concerned for your health...
you should learn to paint. ;D
haha. At least you make an effort to protect yourself.
The last paint type project was spray in bed liner.
It got me.
A "little break" turned into a half hour nap.
In my driveway.
On the concrete [laugh]
and I was wearing a respirator.
Quote from: Dan on February 27, 2010, 03:48:44 PM
The awesomeness just oozes out of your pores. How do you stand it? [laugh]
lol [laugh]
wet wipes
;D
Quote from: Monsterlover on February 27, 2010, 03:45:32 PM
man not you too...
You make a good point. I'll give you that.
Actually, he reiterated my good point ;)
Quote from: Monsterlover on February 27, 2010, 03:49:13 PM
haha. At least you make an effort to protect yourself.
The last paint type project was spray in bed liner.
It got me.
A "little break" turned into a half hour nap.
In my driveway.
On the concrete [laugh]
and I was wearing a respirator.
apparently it was not an awesome respirator
Quote from: MrIncredible on February 27, 2010, 03:53:02 PM
Actually, he reiterated my good point ;)
he just said it better. You could have a career in politics ;)
Quote from: ducpainter on February 27, 2010, 03:55:10 PM
apparently it was not an awesome respirator
hmm. Now I'm questioning if I actually wore it. It's old. The filters are only good for particulate matter at this point.
What's more important was how UN-awesome the bed liner was.
Quote from: Monsterlover on February 27, 2010, 04:03:33 PM
he just said it better. You could have a career in politics ;)
Meh-life is easier all around if you just assume I'm always right ;)
Geez, it's not like you're a rocket scientist or something.
;D
We really make the beast with two backsed this guy's thread up [laugh]
Sorry OP.
Quote from: Monsterlover on February 27, 2010, 04:30:00 PM
We really make the beast with two backsed this guy's thread up [laugh]
Sorry OP.
useful info probably ended two pages ago...
Quote from: Dan on February 27, 2010, 03:48:44 PM
The awesomeness just oozes out of your pores. How do you stand it? [laugh]
+11ty billion.
I'd say this is the first thread in a while that's equally informative AND entertaining.
Scott
Always glad to help ;D