Ducati Monster Forum

Daddy likes.

http://www.ducati.ms/forums/showthread.php?t=81230 (http://www.ducati.ms/forums/showthread.php?t=81230)

(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4047/4371508243_e8c48f9398_o.jpg)

nice! Love the colors.

 [thumbsup] [thumbsup] [thumbsup]

687???

999/749 destroke combo. . .

someone please tell me those colors have something to do with a HEAVY paying sponsor.

As far as I can tell it's just the scheme the owner likes

just took a peak. they may be trying to match the colors on the NCR logo.

looks to me like a badly photoshopped 749r

thats the photochop he sent the painter


(http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4064/4372258514_0d22ceb773_b.jpg)

yeah, but that's what they are building.

they mentioned the motor on another thread.

they are destroking a 749 i think to fit racing regs in one series.

Yeah LWT i believe needs to be under 700cc, so it would go against the army of SV650's in the field.

Not the worst idea I've ever heard, I have to say.

It's cool but it is not the SV killer that they are hoping for. SVs that are built well have similar hp and weigh less. It also comes down to the rider. It will take a really fast guy to win those classes period. This not a new concept by any means. It's been done on a large variety of bikes including I-4s. Here is a pic of a destroked 900ss that is down to 677cc to fit into an ultralight class. This bike ended up so fast, it can beat a lot of SVs but again, it's mostly the rider. This bike is down to approx. 320 lbs. So yeah, it's cool but it is very expensive and far from original.

(http://i46.tinypic.com/2n8sc1y.jpg)

yeah but this is a 2V. the bike they are building is a 4V and should have more HP than that 677. plus Desmoworks will have plenty of lightweight parts to choose from. they are an NCR dealer. I expect them to get the weight way down, HP as much as possible with a 4V, 687cc, L-2, which even compared to the bike you quoted, is unique.

^

That's awesome

Yup, we're talking apples to oranges here. They are not built for the same class. I'm just using this as an example of how this concept is not new. It's been done on a wide variety of bikes, but all with the same goal of "bumping down" to fit a race class. It's even been done on 4-valve ducs before this one. It's a very cool project but it's an extremely expensive way to go about building a bike to be competitive in LW. I've raced an SV before that would give that bike a good run for it's money and it cost a hell of a lot less. I guarantee it also handled better than that 999 chassis will.
If I had that kind of money to build a LW bike, I would just buy an NCR with a 900 2-valve, (or some clubs allow the 1000 DS), and race that. It is a better chassis than the 999 and weighs a hell of a lot less with similar hp....just sayin....it's a very spendy way to go about it, and is not really worth it when they will get beat by fast guys on well built SVs. But then again, I race to win and when I don't win, I'm not satisfied. Having a very trick bike is great but winning races is better.  [beer]

go Toasty!

otay

I wondered if anyone would catch that.  ;)

I know you're not a fan of the Duc SBKs pre 1098, but 'handled better'?

Maybe turned in easier.

yeah i bet if they use that chassis, lighten it, and maybe even try to run 160 series tires, it would outhandle the others.

Let me set the record straight  ;D I'm a fan of pre 1098 SBKs but not for racing. They do not turn well. They hold a line nicely but the turn in is hard and they like to run wide. The 999 was a step in the right direction but was not good enough.

Yes, you can set up an SV that will handle better than a 999. Put a gsxr front on, good shock, race wheels and tune the suspension well. They already have a massive weight advantage. The 999 will be more planted but just turns in so slow. I've raced a very well built and very powerful SV that I guarantee would give that bike a serious fight.

Remember, as a racer I'm always thinking practical. I want more bang for the buck and this bike puts you "upside down" as far as bang for the buck...in other words, it's not worth the money to me. But, I don't deny that it is incredibly cool. [thumbsup] I'm just saying that I could win a race against that bike on a bike that costs way less. And I race to win...not do laps on a bike that looks cool only. Make sense?  [coffee]

If they lighten it a lot maybe but, I would not go to a 160 rear with their estimated 100hp. You need more sidegrip with that much hp. Even the sweet Dunlop slicks that are 165 width would be pushed. I guess that I should also mention that I'm skeptical of their weight shedding. That bike will still be heavy.

I agree that they are tough to turn...but not that an SV handles better...handling comprises much more than turn in. We can disagree about that.

I also absolutely agree that there are easier routes to take to have a competitive bike.

Anyone can do easy. :D

i'm kinda curious of the new monster frames and the weight comparisons. wonder if they would make good track frames since they have the Al rear subframes.

I'm pretty confident that his 687 motor would be quite reliable at 100 HP.

I haven't heard of much reliability with 100 HP SV's.

good point

Very true, but you could probably build two  SV motors for the price of this thing  ;)

Wait a minute, now you guys are thinking practical?  [cheeky] [laugh]

I could spend a kazillion dollars on this bike and have a very reliable motor...sure can't argue with that.

But with two motors it will be far too much displacement.  [cheeky]

 [laugh]

 [beer]

Well, you can look at it another way, here's your choice:

Would you like to ride this very trick Ducati?

Or would you like to ride a very trick SV that may drop the crankshaft on the ground at a most inopportune time?

<Please do not allow your vote to be swayed by the paint job.  [laugh]>

paint job is for desmoworks, check out the dw blog --> It stands out. To Raux, its that way because its not for a high-paying sponsor, it is a high paying sponsor.

And I disagree about the 999 chassis. If you don't like the turn in, tinker with the geometry, adjust the offset. Battle of tradeoffs. The bike that turns in well gets complaints of being 'twitchy' mid-turn, while the 'planted mid-turn' bike is "too hard to turn in". Sheesh.

This is why I stick to trackdays :)

it's easy to be consumed by the need to keep up/ go faster.

I have always said that racing is the process of turning money into noise.

Pretty sure that's still correct today [laugh]

I know of an SV that is making 90+ hp and has lasted for going on three years with that build. I know of others at 80 something hp with several years on them. Sure, when you build one, it's less reliable but that is hardly an argument for spending the many thousands on this track toy. As I said earlier, you can probably build two motors for the cost of this one.

While watching club races at Infineon (tons of Ducs racing), I was always under the impression that the guys racing Ducatis weren't exactly lacking in the $$$ department.   The "bang per buck" analysis is relative because there is no income limit...  If you've got the dough to throw at it, it doesn't matter that there is something out there cheaper. 

I would imagine when one decides to race a Ducati superbike they throw financial reason to the curb

Just ran across this thread so I thought I'd clarify a few things...

1. Rob Turner has already finished building his (motor to the same spec, but built by ducshop) and he has 103hp at the rear wheel.
2. It will absolutely be reliable as it is making LESS power than stock and is built to a much higher spec than stock. It is a 749R crank and Ti rods with 749S cases, cylinders, heads and custom made pistons (which the pistons are a long story in themselves).
3. Chassis is 999R with 27mm triple clamps, adjustable steering head, Ohlins SBK valves in the OE Ohlins forks, 749R rear link and shortened ride height adjuster with setup Ohlins rear shock. So the geometry will replicate the 749R which is pretty universally considered to be amazing.
4. The bike should be light in terms of the 749/999 series. Carbon air box, kevlar tank, race harness, race sub frames, will have carbon wheels and a ton of other things lightened up and everything not necessary removed.

So my thought is:
1. No SV will have a comparable geometry package.
2. Very few will make equivalent power and it's highly doubtful they will be as reliable.
3. This bike will have shed a fair amount of weight. I have no idea what a built SV weighs, but that is a bit out of my control... I believe in and ride Ducati... NOT Suzuki!

Really it is a project for fun that I'm doing in my spare time (just about finished now though). I only race a couple weekends a year if I have the time and the results don't drive me - just the fun.

Amen!

It's not about money though - it's about building something that is interesting to me. I've owned an SV and it was not interesting to me. I think it is fun to take a big pig like the 999R and try to make it something it is not...

Neat project.  I missed it first time around.


mitt

Me too.  That's pure pimpage, Anthony.   [thumbsup]   [moto]

You have any pics of it in its current state?  Or any build pics?

Crazy this thread.

What I've "learned" lol.

a 999 chassis is crap, and doesn't turn.

People are color blind

a 999r is a big pig.

 ;D

Hehe, okay, maybe a big pig is a bit too far - but it isn't the lightest bike around in original form!

I've been putting the images on my flickr account here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/desmoworks/sets/72157623470528684/ (http://www.flickr.com/photos/desmoworks/sets/72157623470528684/)

I'll get another update soon and add another batch of photos. It was supposed to be done for the Nashville round this weekend, but due us unexpectedly having to have some custom pistons made that isn't going to happen. Pistons are 3 weeks out at this point. The chassis is done, electrical done, bottom end built, heads built, etc... just need to "slap" it all together tune and enjoy.