Are titanium bolt kits worth the investment to shed some lbs or are there any other small suggestions to get closer to 300 lbs? Already chopped the tail, removed belt, sprocket, chain, and side covers. Thanks.
300 lbs is a pretty ambitious goal. If you weigh all the things you mention removing you might have cut 3 or 4 lbs maximum. Some good spots to start though would be going with a full exhaust system as this will get rid of the heavy cans and udder. A light weight battery like a Yuasa 7S or one of the A123 setups can save you around 4 lbs. Going to 520 chain and sprockets from 525 will know a few more lbs off. A lightened flywheel is good for another couple of lbs as well. After that I would go with mag or carbon wheels. Beyond there each lb gets more and more expensive to shed.
Quote from: pennyrobber on April 20, 2010, 11:33:16 AM
300 lbs is a pretty ambitious goal. If you weigh all the things you mention removing you might have cut 3 or 4 lbs maximum. Some good spots to start though would be going with a full exhaust system as this will get rid of the heavy cans and udder. A light weight battery like a Yuasa 7S or one of the A123 setups can save you around 4 lbs. Going to 520 chain and sprockets from 525 will know a few more lbs off. A lightened flywheel is good for another couple of lbs as well. After that I would go with mag or carbon wheels. Beyond there each lb gets more and more expensive to shed.
A full exhaust will save you over 10lbs.
unless your have done all of the above, the weight savings w/ Ti bolts is not worth the $$$$. Ti bolts will help you save those last few ounces.
Also, remove passenger pegs, delete fly screen, those stupid side covers under the seat,
+1 to 300lbs being an ambitious goal, good luck.
keep us posted.
Personally I think Titanium bolts are nice for unsprung weight (Anything on the end of the forks or swingarm) but not cost effective for anywhere else.
Having said that, they do weigh less and if your willing to spend the money, there is a lot of hardware on the bike that can be replaced.
300 lbs would be quite something. My race bike is just under 400lbs (wet) and it's got everything removed that is safe to remove.
You'll be happier if you spend the money on the unsprung parts than lightening the rest of the bike. 520 chain/ aluminum sprocket for rear, lightened brake rotors,rotor/caliper bolts, a pair of those new Michelin Power Pures (lightweight tires!!!),wheels (but stock are pretty light anyways).
Out of all those, the 520 chain with aluminum sprocket will be the most noticeable to you.
Lightweight batteries can save a lot of weight but that usually equates to poor battery performance.
I'm not sure on the Monster, but sometimes aftermarket rearsets can save a pound on the bike.
Already have a Full Arrow Titanium exhaust, bike already has 520 chain and sprockets, pass. pegs are long gone, tail chop is already done, side covers are long gone as well. I had the fly screen gone but it actually makes a considerable difference at high speeds so back on it went. I'm in the process of eliminating some more lbs from the seat, more on that later. Will look into a LW battery setup.
you will need a titanium FRAME to get to 300 lbs. NCR built a hailwood replica with a Ti frame that was still 316lbs.
The only titanium part that really has a decent money/weight-loss ratio is the rear shock spring. Can lose a couple lbs there. If the stock showas have steel cartridges, the aluminum cartridges would drop a couple pounds. Light flywheel is another 2 lbs. Aluminum carrier discs probably 2~3lbs. Cheesed rear disc 1 lb. Light wheels, 10~15lbs. Alloy cam pullies 1~2lbs. Alloy tensioners .5lb. Rear sprocket 2~3lbs. ETI fuel cell if available, else aluminum tank 7~9lbs. Lightened primary gear, 1lb. Cut off stock steel subframe and have alum iinum frame welded up, 7-10lbs.
The sky is the limit
The only limit is your imagination
Bring money (all of it) <----This
+1 on what everyone else said. A couple of suggestions from the frame perspective:
Stu's Al rear subframe:
http://ducatimonsterforum.org/index.php?topic=34302.0 (http://ducatimonsterforum.org/index.php?topic=34302.0)
These guys make some super light frames too:
http://www.radicalducati.com/index.php?page=diciembre-2006 (http://www.radicalducati.com/index.php?page=diciembre-2006)
Good luck!
Actually made by TELAI DM for rad
english version
http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=es&u=http://www.radicalducati.com/&ei=NGjOS8WMB4vkswPA1qivDg&sa=X&oi=translate&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CA4Q7gEwAA&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dradical%2Bducati%26hl%3Den (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=es&u=http://www.radicalducati.com/&ei=NGjOS8WMB4vkswPA1qivDg&sa=X&oi=translate&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CA4Q7gEwAA&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dradical%2Bducati%26hl%3Den)
For a mere 6 grand
(http://radicalducati.futurnet.es/uploads/images/Noticias/noticias/diciembre_2006/6.jpg)
300lbs? You definitely have a challenge ahead of yourself!
Major areas to start with:
1) frame -- replace it with something lighter (and stronger)
2) smaller battery
3) BST wheels
4) carbonfiber discs
5) throw your singlesided swingarm away -- go doublesided (aluminum swingarm and wheel lighter s singlesided)
6) minimalist rearsets
7) hog out the triple clamps thinner
8 ) machine the engine cases to remove a few pounds
9) lighten all the internal engine rotating parts (revs faster is a nice perk)
10) carbonfiber seat w/rubber pad
11) carbonfiber fuel tank
12) toss the headlight/tailight away
13) toss the kickstand away
14) buy lots of magnesium engine case parts
15) lighten the clutch
16) minamalist rear brake caliper
17) titanium rear spring
18) weigh your tires -- big weight difference between brands
That gets you to about 305-308lbs range.
a) then titanium bolts that are drilled for lightness
b) start measuring things on the scale to the gram -- it will have to become a disease
c) when doing #8/#9 above -- lighten every single part as possible within the engine. Trimming of fins allowed as well as removing weight from cranksaft. Machine off belt cover castings. Machine off anything that isn't mandatory to make it run.
d) remove the starter (and allows a smaller battery) and either bump start it or get a rear wheel racetrack starter setup.
Alex Ortner built what he called the GPDUE many years ago. 900cc based Supersport. He literally weighed and massaged every single component of the disassembled bike and started from there. He ended up machining aluminum parts ala engine plugs, etc in delrin plastic. He succeeded in cracking the barrier.
I've built a few bikes in the 320lb range (with my own frame) -- 340 is pretty easy and isn't too stupidly expensive. But 300 is the holy grail for all Ducatista...
Item #1 and #2 to buy? An accurate scale to weigh the larger parts and a smaller postal scale to measure down to the gram.
And if you posted weights as you go -- we'd all appeciate it!
Well I did say it was a goal...lol...not sure how long it'll take me to get there but those are my eventual intentions. Framewise, after doing some research, that aluminum frame pictured is a bad idea for street use, they even state it on the mfg. website. I know Mark has spoken of frames but he has said he won't really do frame production, so there goes that idea. Other than that, haven't seen any other frame options. Currently working on the smaller A123 type battery. Wheels and suspension mods are on the schedule this summer. LW seat is also currently in the works. Has anyone actually come up with an accurate way to weigh the bike? Seen stuff involving leveling the bike while on a bathroom scale and that sounds plain risky. Any others?
I use 2 bathroom scales. $19 at Harbor Freight. I bought them to weigh my car (2 scales per wheel) and they work great because they're designed for fat people (aka Americans). Just need 1 scale per wheel on the motorcycle.
Excessive attention to detail results in this:
http://shop.durbahn.de/shop/en/home (http://shop.durbahn.de/shop/en/home)
Track only bikes, but .........take a look at the 1098. Not cheap by any means.
Those bar-end weights, if you weigh them you will be supprised. And they come off for free! Ever use the horn? Its another pound for free. The little stupid deflector with it's two steel bolts under the lower triple, gone! Mirrors, change those for cheap lightweight plastic bar-ends or something.
You, might as well sell your bike and get one of these. [cheeky]
http://www.ncrfactory.com/eng/html/15.00.shtml (http://www.ncrfactory.com/eng/html/15.00.shtml)
Can't believe that NCR848 costs as much if not more than a Desmosedici!
CF wheels [thumbsup]
how much weight savings would be belt drive from a buell?
What do YOU weigh? It's probably easier and cheaper.
As Mark posted, there are some big dollar "firsties" to get the weight down.
Here's the ones I find to be significant:
Lighten/balance crank + titanium con-rods.
Lighten flywheel or nichols flywheel
Lighten clutch internals
Lighten primary/driven gear, oil pump gear, timing gear, timing belt pulleys, sprag gear
Magnesium engine side cases, carbon fiber valve inspection covers (NCR)
Wheels (forged mag or cf)
Select a lightweight tire
Lighten rotors, billet calipers (ti caliper pistons)
Note: 25mm cartridge kits are heavier than 20mm cartridge kits. (And arguably worse performing, see: http://www.traxxion.com/20mmvs25mmcartridge.aspx (http://www.traxxion.com/20mmvs25mmcartridge.aspx))
CF/Kevlar tank, front mudguard, remove rear mudguard, Ti shock spring, carbon fiber or ti steering damper (or remove it).
Replace most non-structural bolts with aluminum.
Remove starter, and alternator [evil]
With all of the parts listed here and the amount of work involved you are well over 30K in parts alone. Labor is at least that much if you are not able to do all of this work yourself. [beer] enjoy the bike as is.
so $40k+
hmmm another 10-30 depending on condition and you can have a D16
If you people bring rationality into modding you'd never bother in the first place.
Quote from: MrIncredible on April 26, 2010, 03:26:40 PM
If you people bring rationality into modding you'd never bother in the first place.
I would agree on principle. But perhaps the goal of < 300lb is too ambitious, given the time/money/engergy required.
If I was going for your goal of lightening the bike, without regard to some arbitrary # goal, I'd focus on some key areas such as wheels, tires, rotors, rotor/caliper bolts, calipers, axles.
You can find titanium front axles, rotor bolts, caliper bolts, and rear rotors.
You can find lightweight aluminum rotor carriers for the front, billet calipers
You can find magnesium or carbon fiber wheels and choose tires carefully.
If you were on a superbike, I'd say a mag swingarm and eccentric hub. I suppose billet fork bottoms are lighter than the cast ones.
So the upcoming mods are the following:
LW battery
LW flywheel
LW belt rollers
Have a question regarding the flywheel. Anyone have experience with either the Nichols or DP product? What are opinions? They are about the same price. Also notice that Nichols has bolts for this as well. Are these needed? Thanks.
The brakes and wheels are coming later this summer.
I have looked some into the flywheel and there are probably several threads on the matter. I decided to go with machining my stock flywheel (via Ducshop). I have heard stories of the aluminum flywheels having there spines destroyed. No first hand experience but enough risk to help my decision.
Why remove the rightside front disc brakesetup? thats like 5lbs right there.
rear brakes gotta be another 3lbs.
run the bike low on gas, thats another 5lb.
im only partially kidding. ;D
if you are fast enough, you can take the entire front wheel off.
Quote from: a m on April 27, 2010, 04:57:39 PM
if you are fast enough, you can take the entire front wheel off.
Well if your going to do that, then you might need the rear brake. :P
Quote from: He Man on April 27, 2010, 05:18:45 PM
Well if your going to do that, then you might need the rear brake. :P
If you are that good you could just engine brake all the time....
Start with anything that moves,wheels etc...
I would figure what the power/weight ratio of your bike is now and what it would be if your bike weighted 300lbs., and then try to either come up with a combination of lightening mods and power increasing mods to achieve that ratio, or simply buy a more powerful bike that would be closer to that ratio to begin with and lighten that. just my $.02 [beer]
Like an 1198. Buy one of those and lighten it.
you could always become a vegan.
Drop your bodyweight.
I am a small Italian who weighs 148lbs so if your a guy who is a hefty 180 and could afford to lose a few I already have 30lbs on you.
Nope...already down to about 146 lbs. Good suggestions so far. However, I will not be replacing the bike with an 1198.
You can take the fairings off and stick on a Monster headlight.
I think it would be cheaper and easier to start with a bike that weighs under 300 lbs and make it street legal.
Why do you want it to weigh 300 lbs?
Scales are for fat girls and boxers.
I have no idea what any of my bikes weigh.
My suggestion would be to stop weighing your vehicles. You may love it more then a girlfriend but there is nothing more depressing then an anorexic Ducati.
light weight means less work to ride in the twisties, less power needed for quick acceleration.
do you put chrome and tassles on your ducati? ;)
yea, but the tassels are carbon fiber so they make me go faster.
I am personally amazed at how far people will go to save weight to go fast. For about the same price you could have bought an R1 that has blistering performance.One things that gets me laughing is the very successful business owner who weighs 300+ lbs has to have a bike that weighs nothing and then can't figure out why he got passed by a vespa.........with Betty White riding it. Answer........because Betty White was riding it! [laugh]
Just sayin'.........