Ducati Monster Forum

Hello all
On Friday while at the stay upright course my bike (2004 Monster 1000Sie) started running like it was on one cylinder. Matty suggested it was the fuel, I had been running Ron98. So I have drained the tank filled it with Ron91 cleaned the spark plugs, the front plugs were black and the back plugs looked a brownie bronze. The bike still feels like its running on one cylinder. Can anyone help or should I just take it to a mechanic?
Thanks
Don

Hey Don,

    Just try some new plugs first, I cleaned mine as well when I did the same thing on 98 Ron but it didn't do much.
If new plugs don't fix it then maybe you'll need a trip to the Mechanic.

Hope she gets healthier
Matty...

Did you have any tuning done when you installed the exhaust? Maybe that has something to do with it ???

Firstly, I wouldn't run 98. I have been told time and again that it will foul your plugs. Gowanloch's and Frasers told me run 91.

Definitely change your plugs, do the most simple and basic checks first before running to the mechanic, a $10 plug could end up costing you $500.

Hope you get it going. [thumbsup]

Hey Don as we discussed at the course my S4R Testastretta doesn't like 98 fuel either. I stick to 95 and have run 91 as well. But she is happiest on 95 being a 4 valver.

Agree with all the above re plugs first.....

Just one other little check. When was the last time you change the fuel filter?????

read your owners manual it tells you in there what octane you should be runing it all depends on compression ratio my s2r 1000 runs best on 98 and i get another 40 ks to the tank ,change plugs then hook timing light up to make sure you have spark , other wise youll have to see a doctor  [bang]

Firstly thanks all for your input.
I will go get some knew plugs today and  then check with a timing light and get back to you.
The hand book suggests using Ron95 or better so ill have to drain the tank again.
I am up for an oil change now going by the last owner, he change the oil every 3000km is that over the top or about right?
Once again your help and knowledge is much appreciated.
Don

Have put new pipes on (only) but havent had a tune up since then.
It may sound like a stupid question but where would I find the fuel filter on my bike.
Regards
Don

My bike was 'running' the same after I foolishly ran out of fuel, then left it two days before re-filling.

It was like that for about 2 weeks - I wasn't riding it 'cause I'd lost my license. Anyway, I finally pushed it into town to get it checked. They had it for a week before they got to it... and it started fine, ran fine. Never worked out what happened.

Oh, and while I was pushing it home, I got pulled over!

Good luck.

in the fuel tank [thumbsup]

Does that mean I have to take the fuel cap off to get to the fuel filter. Sorry I'm a builder with little mechanical knowledge

MMM, so what fuel should I be putting into the S4R?

The local Ducati dealer mechanic told me to run the Caltex Vortex?  I think that is 95 RON?

So what do others run in their S4R Testastretta engines?

Bret

Yeah I think you're on the money there Brett.

Big T says he runs 95 in his and that is what it likes best. 

Hey Brett I do indeed run Vortex 95. Have tried 98 and it runs okay but have noticed that round town it does splutter and backfire a bit. Have also had to put in 91 a few times on rides when nothing else was available and it ran fine.

But 95% of the time I now run Caltex Vortex 95. Remember I have a full open exhaust, open air box and DP ECU..... Not sure how the standard setup goes with 91, 95 & 98.....

Big T,

I have the Termignoni full system, open airbox and DP ECU on the bike now and they reckon that Caltex Vortex is the fuel to use.

I have been running that since I got the bike in January without any hassles.

So will stick with it.

Cheers


Bret

no youll have to remove fuel tank completley ond turn it up side down and take the complete fuel injection pump out its not a big job but be for you do that you need to buy a new oring and oring grease some times oring is ok but have found they generaly dont like be disturbed cheers bazz , ps when you fire your bike up arfter deing out of fuel dont try to start it straight away  turn your key on let the fuel pump run till it stops turn key of and repeat this step again , this is to purge all the air out  [thumbsup]

don't bother with a timing light, it's all controlled by the ecu so you can't change it anyway. i run 98 in both mine and have never had an issue with it, if it is fuel related it's probably a clogged fuel filter or a dead plug, both of which can occur from any grade of fuel. yes, the filter is inside the tank, but it's not too hard to replace, just don't drop anything in the tank!!!


paul.

Thanks for the information.
Could i pick your brains and ask
1) Where, (if you know) would I get the parts at a reasonable price? I have had a look at Moto Wheels and the price of the fuel filter is $15 but the shipping is $79US.
2) I have had a look at a manual and there seems to be two fuel filters, is that correct, if so would you recommend changing both? What has your experience been in the past?
Regards
Don Elder

Don before you go pulling the tank off and changing fuel filters, what is the situation with the plugs?
As I said I did this twice before I learned about fuel and didn't need to change fuel filters or anything.
Have you tried new plugs yet?
Try the first step first then think about fuel filters.....

If I have missed a step and the plugs didn't work then sure move on and try the next thing.

yeah mattyvas is right, try the plugs first, they're much easier to change than the filter!!!
if it's a steel tank you take the filler assembly out, i think the plastic tank has the bottom entry type assembly like the superbikes.


paul.

loony the timing light is the yoused to make shore that theres nothing wrong with spark for each cylinder watch the timing light as bike is reved to watch for electrical break down,taking a plug out turning the engine over see if there is spark is not reconmended

hello again
 I have tried putting new spark plugs today, no luck. So then I tried the timing light and i have spark on the back two plugs but no spark on the two plugs on the front cylinder. What do you suggest now? New leads or is it a new ECU?

Now, I'd go to the Mechanic's shop.
Try Gowie's as you have been to before.
Or you could go a little further up the road to Fly Wheels.
Here is there address FlyWheels (http://www.flywheels.com.au/contact.html)

check your connections at the coils, could just be a wire has fallen off. i wouldn't think it's your HT leads, both wouldn't fail at the same time, but if both plugs on the front cyl are supplied from one coil i would guess either it has failed or there's a wiring issue central to that.


paul

Perhaps you could swap connections to coils or leads to see if the problem swaps from front to back cylinders.
Might help with the troubleshooting.

they beat me to it but be fore you do any thing if you have access to a multi meter i talk you through testing the coils  [coffee]

just put knobby's on it and go off rd ;D

I thought Id give you an update where I'm up to. I checked the coils swapping them and checking them with a multi-meter and they are ok. So now we think it is the pick up on the stater, does that sound right?

now its time for the doctor [bang]

Come on Bazz20 don't give up now, how hard can it be? What do you think Ducmeister, loony888 and matty?

Sorry Don, my mechanical mind ends about here.
I am creative when it comes to the camera and thinking up new ways of bling to ad.

but if it were me I's be heading to the Dr for some advice and a fix.

Well, if you've checked that all of the wires are connected and the coils and leads have checked out OK, I think it's going to get a bit more in depth from here. ??? 
Sorry mate but I'm with Matty now.  Head for one of the suggested shops and see what they say.  They can probably stick it on the machine and find out pretty quickly what's wrong with it.
Hope all goes well (and is not too expensive).

As far as I know, a bad coil will give you a dirty spark, orange instead of blue.

What was the resistance reading on your coils? If you can remember? No, don't worry about that, you checked both.

Now, from what I can think of in my tin brain, the flux capacitor is stuffed.

Take it to a mech, you have something wrong with the ignition somewhere.


Did you mean the pick ups in the stator or starter?

If your pick ups are out of whack, that may be another problem.

I'm guessing now.  ???

Did you post this in the Tech thread?

I didn't check what the spark colour was, just put the back on the front and the front on the back and the coils both work on the back, but not the front.
I thought working back, the next thing would be the pick ups on the stater. i am open to all suggestions and i did start this thread.

sorry don but modern coils work or they dont your problem is more deeper it could be as simple as the firing atom to induce coils to stator but its only guesing from here without hooking up to the computer and let the computer do a dianostic check , most likley the ecu would have picked up the fault and will tell computer a code error so don its off to the doctor sorry mate without the bike here i cant do any more cheers bazz [bang]

Thank you all for your help
I have contacted Gowanlocks and Flywheels and they think it has someting to do with the ECU so its off to fly wheels for a lie down and a bex. Thanks once again eveyone
Don

thats good some times its as simple as just resetting the ecu  [thumbsup]

Shit this is bad luck Don! :-[

When you get to this point it is either pickups or the ECU.

If you want to look at the pickups you need to remove the left engine cover which need a special tool to pop off the crank bearing.

I had a mate with a RGV250 which did the same thing. We found the pickup had broken its mount and was too far away from the magnet that trigers the spark.

I would think it would be the same thing.

ECUs are pretty tough to blow so I would would think it is ok.

There is several connections to check for corrosion too.

The pickups have a plug on the left side of the bike.

I will check the wiring diagram for you to see if there is any more connections.


Rob

thanks rob that would be great. My brother still stands by it being the pick ups as well

OK looked at the wiring diagram and there is one plug from the pickups. Then the wiring goes to the ECU. Then the wiring comes from the ECU straight to the ignition coils.

From what it looks like there is only one pickup to fire both cylinders.

The only other part of the bike causing this problem is the magnet for the first or second pulse is missing.

You may have lost the magnet.

Anyway the best way to check this fault is to disconnect the pickups, put a meter across two of the three wires (one wire is a screen), set the meter to 5 volts dc, then kick the bike over and see if you get two or more pulses per revoloution.

If this is too hard I would recommend taking the bike to the mechanics.


Rob

Hey Bazz.

Did you have the Ohms info for the coils?

Oh and yes modern coils do have three modes of operation, working, half working and not working, previous experience with bosch eletronic coils.

Cheers.

Madalf.

crikey madalf, that's some threadmining there, 2 and a half years!!!

Yep I noticed that.







                                    Mmick

or very bored  [coffee]

Digging deep as always.

Reckon thats bad, we still haven't had a coil checking procedure yet....

I think Suzyj or DucmonRob would be the best to give you that procedure, both have been a bit absent lately.






                                Mmick

Roll Call!

Just got back from sunny QLD! ;D

Will look at the proceedure but in general the primary is measured accross the wire terminals and the secondary is measured from the spark plug lead to the ground which is the metal core of the coil. The secondary resistance needs to factor in the resistance of the spark plug lead if you are testing from the plug back.

Suzy can probably do a wonderful sketch to show the workings of a coil.

Rob