Ducati Monster Forum

I purchased a Monster S4RS from a friend/customer of mine a couple weeks ago and wanted to share the rebuild with you guys.

Pictures and more information can be seen here - http://bellissimoto.com/CustomS4RS.html (http://bellissimoto.com/CustomS4RS.html)

And we have plenty of work to do, so stay tuned for plenty of fun updates.

excellant!  [thumbsup]
seems that everyone has got a project on! :)

gotta watch out for that plate, even if you hit a nice fat pot hole you could hit that plate~~ waiting to see waht you have next!

 [bang] you're gonnancost me more money [bang]

 [bacon]....MORE MORE MORE MORE!!!!!!

  [popcorn]

Thanks guys,

The next couple weeks will be full of big decisions regarding this project so if you have any opinions/ideas feel free to post up.

Here are some concepts/ideas I am wrangling with:

Forks: I can't seem to find an undamaged left Ohlins fork leg, so I will probably just sell the right side and add a set of the following: Marzocchi RAC 50's, Extreme Tech's, or if I hit the lottery - Bitubo RDH forks  ;D


Wheels: Carrozzerias are definitely in consideration, along with Marvic Assens, but I will probably wait until I return home from Milan's EICMA show this November before I make any concrete decisions.


Shock: Bitubo, Extreme Tech, or possibly FG Gubellini.


Exhaust: Different is a key... below is what we have been toying with yesterday:

(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/PA170001-600x481.jpg)

(http://bellissimoto.com/images/PA170006.JPG)


Supercharger?   [evil] I wish.

2 into 1 into  GP exhaust......I see coolness! [thumbsup]

I've built one like that before.

Either it's so loud you feel bad for people around you (and have the wear earplugs ALL the time)

or

it's so choked down to quiet it that it now feels like a S2r1000.


Looks cool though, but for me functional is fashion....

Obviously function is important, but I do not believe the Laser Dual tips will rob power.

If they are too loud for me, I could add a small db killer.


Will it be the final decision?

I have no idea, this is really just a brainstorming stage...

I'm beginning to think about a complete teardown...

Anyone here think its worth it to drop the motor and have the frame customized with some new paint/powdercoat/carbondry protec/nickel plate/etc...?

Seriously, if you guys have any ideas for the bike, lay em' on me.

What are your goals with it?

Suggestions are hard without knowing where your head is at, and your project budget is at? Do you plan to go all out on this like your concorso 1098?

Personally, I'ld love to see one of Pepe, over at radicalducati's tanks and seats on there. This involves a little frame altering (welding a new seat bracket, and tank stays).  With the dual tipped laser pipe setup low, (similar in vertical placement to the streetfighters stock exhaust), some pod intakes (I know, it's a horse or 2 down on power from an airbox on the 4vs).

Monsters, and naked bikes in general, look better to my eye, the more negative space they have.  Lots of space between the rear wheel and the frame. Lots of space between the tank and the motor. Negative space in the frame.  if you can see through it, it's sweet.

Black out the motor and the bodywork, red frame. Red Marzocchis up front.  Matching shock.

EVR, BST 5 spokes, Braketech Irons with the red buttons.

I like the low front look. Get rid of the headlight U bracket, for the LSL Headlight brackets, clipons, speedymoto top triple.  Reflash the ECU to get rid of the immobilizer, and forget the dash alltogether

^ yup, especially the red Marzocchis, but I'd go for the Mamba style BSTs. Full Beringer front brake kit in red: masters, rotors, and six pot calipers. Gloss black tank with matte black stripe.
I'd stay with the current frame and ditch the side panels then reroute all the wiring to clean it up. Riding House chin fairing, radiator covers, and rear mudguard painted gloss black. Lower the headlight & black the ring out, deactivate immobilizer, install Motogadget Motoscope Mini. Boomtubes. Black 999 front fender. Sargent seat.

Wheels: OZ or BST  both the lightest in their respective materials
Brakes: Full monoblock Brembo radial with CMC rotors
Forks: Marzocchi 50
Triples: CNC (you've got the source)
Frame: full paint (wetter look than PC)
Remove all extra body/panels
Seat/tail: CF Monoposto
Engine: Magnesium side cases
Rear shock: Marzocchi race unit
Tank: CF
Color scheme: TriColor with CF peaking through
Exhaust: QuatD 2 into 2
Air Filter: Pods
Heads: MBP
other obvious like slipper, etc. your normal touch


goal: light, powerful, functional, minimalistic styling

Is that the correct frame for an S4RS?  Pipes looks a little skinny.

If you're going crazy, fab up a GP-style exhaust!!!  One pipe at the top, one out the side.

Something missing about those pics...  Ah right where's your GF?  ;D

How bout this thing I found on your site  :P 
http://www.bellissimoto.com/BikeResearch.html (http://www.bellissimoto.com/BikeResearch.html)

I like the semi-blackout look. Nothing chrome or silver...

I certainly appreciate the great ideas you guys are throwing out there for me.

Here are a few of my goals/concerns/opinions:

Budget - I don't know what it is exactly, but it does exist.

Modifications I am willing to rule out:

Bike Research Carbon Fiber Frame - two reasons: I do have a budget, and I don't believe it was built to support a passenger.

Brembo Monoblock calipers - I'm happy with the oem calipers, and if I do change them (which I very well might, it will be to something like the Beringer, or Discacciati options).

Clip Ons - I shattered my right elbow while showing off on my kawasaki dirt tracker back when I was 18 and after riding a 1098 for the past 3 years I'm happy to return to upright bars (at least for now).

Its definitely the correct frame, but you are right about the GP style exhaust, it just might be out of my range of abilities to have one made that I would like.

As for pics with Amy... :)   I would probably wait until the bike is finished, but you never know!

If you are considering going down to the frame, maybe weld on some carefully placed bits for routing the wiring out of sight and reduce the number of ties wrapped around the frame.  I'd like to grind off the passenger peg mounts, but that is kind of a permanent mod.

I like that exhaust.

you have access to Quat D sourcing correct?
They have a 2 into 2 GP style for the HM, could be modified

I've never seen the 2 into 2, and a quick google search and checking their website has yielded me no results...

Can you post a picture?

As the owner of a black S4RS one of the things that bothers me the most is the black frame. It is such a signature element of the Ducati I hate that it is hard to see. At first I thought red would be nice but then I saw someone had gold anodized their swing arm, I am thinking the black and gold would look good as long as the gold was similar to the anodize on the forks, and not gold like the gold on a caddilac. Anyway just my 2 cents. I'd be interested to know how painful it is to get the bike down to the frame and back.

As far as the motor, there used to be a guy, I think it was on the old board, that would polish and knife edge the  crank. I built an MGB motor back in the 70's, without making a specific performance changes, just polishing and balancing all the internal engine components made a noticeable improvement in performance (granted the thing was seriously crude compared to the S4RS motor).

The other area is the radiator, again on TOB there was a thread where someone made a replacement that was more curved so it didn't present such a huge slab in front of the motor

"The other area is the radiator, again on TOB there was a thread where someone made a replacement that was more curved so it didn't present such a huge slab in front of the motor"

 [thumbsup]  and when you find it let us know, I'll buy one too.

Can we get a far shot of the whole bike with that laser exhaust mock up? Looks  [thumbsup]

http://www.google.de/imgres?imgurl=http://www.oppracing.com/images/cmsuploads/Large_Images/oversized%2520racing%2520radiator%2520banner%2520oppracing.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.oppracing.com/products/601-oversized-racing-radiators/&usg=__Vmk2Zpn7ewcNidd6OrSbVSRMFx8=&h=400&w=650&sz=255&hl=de&start=2&zoom=1&um=1&itbs=1&tbnid=wh6ymvGudHv0UM:&tbnh=84&tbnw=137&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dducati%2Boversized%2Bradiator%26um%3D1%26hl%3Dde%26rls%3Dcom.microsoft:en-us%26tbs%3Disch:1 (http://www.google.de/imgres?imgurl=http://www.oppracing.com/images/cmsuploads/Large_Images/oversized%2520racing%2520radiator%2520banner%2520oppracing.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.oppracing.com/products/601-oversized-racing-radiators/&usg=__Vmk2Zpn7ewcNidd6OrSbVSRMFx8=&h=400&w=650&sz=255&hl=de&start=2&zoom=1&um=1&itbs=1&tbnid=wh6ymvGudHv0UM:&tbnh=84&tbnw=137&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dducati%2Boversized%2Bradiator%26um%3D1%26hl%3Dde%26rls%3Dcom.microsoft:en-us%26tbs%3Disch:1)

I really don't much care for that.  I seem to recall another thread (maybe on TOB) where I believe someone chopped up the radiator and made it smaller so it wouldn't stick out so far.  I think it looked much better than making it bigger and as I recall the OP stated that it didn't have any overheating issues.

here are my thoughts if It were my project.Paint frame orange, dark tank. No sidepanels. No wires anywhere.Gp exhaust. Anodize fork legs black. BST rims. Speedymoto triples anodized Orange. No chainguard.Tailchop.Black bars. Black everything. You will have sweetness. [thumbsup]
Oh and just for fun I would leave on the fork reflectors.  [cheeky] [laugh]

(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2693/4309653434_f70574f120_b.jpg)

If you're going to go to the extreme with the bike.....

Randy did you get my email about the exhaust?

KTM already does that. When you sell your yellow bike, give it a shot.

Hey Raux,

I sure did, and it looks awesome, I'll be meeting with virtually every exhaust manufacturer a week from now at the EICMA show in Milan and will see who is up for building us something unique.

share it?

yeah i wish i could make it to Italy, timing is bad for me. I'll be there next year for sure.

I decided to go full monty and deconstruct it, here it is as of today (tomorrow should just be frame and motor after we test fit a couple parts)...

(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/PA260008c3-600x450.jpg)

I've got some solid ideas for it now though and when I get back from the EICMA show in Italy I will be ready to start the real fun!

I wish my garage had awesome hardwood floors!  [laugh]

looking forward to seeing what you come up with.

It's actually pretty kick ass, our shop occupies 2000 sq ft of space right in the heart of Knoxville's old city in a building that is about 200 years old and just has some really classy and cool character (or did until we got there).  [drink]

BellissiMoto,
That is a GENIUS idea of using a ladder as a lift/jack!
I have that identical ladder at home... I think I'll be using it to do some spring tension adjustments later today.
(I know that was in no way what you were showcasing, but thanks!)
 [moto]
Peace!

Just glad to help  [thumbsup]

Our last shop had massive steel I-beams that held up the 2nd floor, and we had some awesome steel cable ratchet lifts I would use to lift my bikes and it worked very well, so when we got to our new location and there were no I-beams to lift from I had to improvise.

Just waiting on a check for the yellow bike ........its going to Washington DC where the new buyer resides.

We finished the disassembly around 11pm last night, here she is now:

(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/PA290001-600x450.jpg)

(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/PA290002-600x327.jpg)

(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/PA290004-600x235.jpg)

whatever color combo you make, make the swingarm and frame the same color

+1   this always looks the best, in my opinion ducati should have spent the extra effort to do this.
Of course on mine they did  ;D

sorry it took me so long

(http://img13.werkenntwen.de/photo13/39b131191215e750a78fc5d45cdf19dd/l/2/l2izb5qnak5tt4pfcahtopo0w5d.jpg)

This was sent to me by
Chris Schimmelschmidt
DANIELE MOTO INTERNATIONAL OHG
info@daniele-moto.de | www.daniele-moto.de (http://)

Copy cats...

Just 2 weeks after I posted my idea of using the Laser Dual Tip GP Extreme mufflers on our S4RS, the guys at Radical Ducati released their 9 & 1/2 custom build with - how coincidentally, the same exact exhaust set up.

(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/radical-ducati-9-one-half-1-600x343.jpg)

Any updates?

Not a whole lot right now, I'm still waiting on a couple of the larger pieces to arrive, and some of the other concept ideas to be confirmed...

I also picked up a second project bike - a fairing less Ducati ST4 with only 1200 miles to turn into a streetfighter which will be significantly simpler than the Monster, and will probably be done first.

I'll keep you guys up to date though,
:)

Any updates?
I like that exhaust. I may have to pick up that tip and have something fabed

The frame and swingarm was dropped off at the painters yesterday, should be done next week.

I've also got a Bitubo XXF31 rear shock going on it, and am working on getting some custom triples made for the new front end.

There is also a slight chance of us adding a supercharger, but we've gotta find a competent machine shop to do some reverse engineering and custom adaptations from a 1098 supercharger kit we have in stock at the moment.

I'll start a new thread for our ST4 project bike later today as well.

No-Go on the Supercharger - the complete kit would run us around $7,000 to have produced, so I think I'll have to survive with around 150 measly hp for now...

The goodies are on starting to roll in...

Marzocchi forks and triple clamps arrived today!!!

(http://www.bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/Marzocchis_for_S4RS-600x385.jpg)

The frame made it back, and is seen here with the Marzocchi RAC 50 triples.

(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/PC290008-600x571.jpg)


Stay tuned, the real fun starts today!!

You need to start taking these pictures with the chick from the ads you sent out over Christmas.  Dayummmmmmm!!   [bacon] [bacon]

that's his wife.!
i was a bit shock when i see the xmas promotions tho,
not doubt those were nice promotions and products!

Even better!  A vendor who (in some way) SHARES THE LOVE!!!  Gotta love a man who appreciates his wife enough to use her for advertising!  Bellisimoto just went up two notches in my pantheon of esteemed Ducvendors. [thumbsup]

Yeah, she's a great sport about all of it, if not a downright supporter (you should see how mad she gets whenever I sell one of my bikes!), ohh and those X-mas pics where a blast to shoot.

Here are some pictures from today (sorry, no Amy pics though).


custom painted rear suspension link
(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/painted_sus_link-600x435.jpg)


Lyle with the frame and swingarm installed
(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/Shop_Monkey-450x600.jpg)


Suspension link installed
(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/sus_link_installed_2-600x450.jpg)


Bitubo XXF31 rear shock installed
(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/bitubo_shock_installed_from_back2-450x600.jpg)


Thats it for now... Marzocchi forks to get installed in a few days, along with a nice EVR slipper clutch and plenty of little detail items.

wheels/brakes/exhaust/general front end set up are still a mystery to me though...

please do sicom rotors so there will be a used set available at some point in the future. or at least so i can hear first hand reports on how well they perform and projected life.

no adj ride height rod? ncr makes a ti one... (i have the ncr alu one...)

I'm tempted by the Sicoms, really, I am, but I'm currently building two custom bikes and not trying brake the bank too badly - especially not before I know for sure what the next Ducati SBK is going to be like.

I think we will have to wait and see on that one... as for the ride height adjuster - I know, and trust me I'll be swapping it out, but Ive got to wait until I have the right one, and then I'll do it.

Looking good.  I look forward to checking this thread.

Presently we are just waiting on some more parts to arrive, and trust me, even though it will be too cold to really ride it for a couple more months - I'm still quite anxious.

I've got the same cold problem here, but not nearly as much to look forward to when it warms up.

Sorry it has been a few days since any updates, but trust me things are certainly moving forward!

We got the Marzocchi forks mounted:

(http://www.bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/P1270004-600x450.jpg)

Arrow Full System Headers:

(http://www.bellissimoto.com/images/P1270009_2_.JPG)

And of course the very best slipper clutch in the whole wide world:

(http://www.bellissimoto.com/images/P1280030.JPG)

(http://www.bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/P1280027-600x450.jpg)

So what color is the frame?

It's the Silver that matches the Silver stripe that goes down the center of the Black tank, headlight, and tail fairings.

Ok so new carbon BST wheels arrived today, throttle bodies and wiring should go back on tomorrow.

I can't wait for this bike to come together...  [moto]

It is going to be a trick getting the rear wheel on with the stand like that.   I guess nothing a little teamwork (or your a-frame) won't fix.

Aren't the T-Rex SSS rear stands reversible?

Ok guys, sorry about the delay, but we have been pretty busy here in the shop, and that means my personal projects get pushed back a little.

Anyhow, the custom Arrow/Compwerkes exhaust is currently in production, and should hopefully be finished in a week or two, and a host of other goodies have arrived and been installed:


Swapped Slipper Clutch Pressure Plate Colors (The gold top from before just didn't look right) -
(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/P2200015-600x450.jpg)

Shot of the installed Arrow Headers -
(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/P1270006_2_-600x450.jpg)

BST + Sicom Teaser picture -
(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/bst_sicom_close_up_2-600x450.jpg)

Maviryk Design Water Pump Cover / Slider, CNC Racing Alternator Cover, and EVR Clutch Slave installed -
(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/Slave_Pump_and_Alt_covers_installed-600x359.jpg)

Next up was the CNC Racing Billet Rear Brake Caliper Mount -
(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/CNC_Racing_rear_brake_mount_installed_1-600x484.jpg)

And some Cox Radiator and Oil Cooler Guards -
(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/Cox_Radiator_Guards_Installed_2-600x485.jpg)

The Sicom carbon rotors we showed in the earlier photograph are actually set up for 1098/1198's with Traction Control.

The ones we are using are the brand new, T-Drive version Sicoms, and they have arrived, and are now installed on the bike!

Pics coming soon!!

t-drive floating elements like new brembos?

previous version like normal brembo hp style ("conventional" full floating, i suppose)?

Basically... yes.

neato. lets see some pictures! (you know the roolz!)

February 23rd, 2011

We topped of the Marazocchi Triple Clamps with  CNC Racing's Bar Risers and an AEM Factory Steering Head Nut.

Handlebars are of the Rizoma Conical variety.

(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/P2200017-600x450.jpg)

February 23rd, 2011

Wiring was added, and a Maviryk Design 12 Cell Battery was installed to insure fast and reliable starting power, while removing a further 8.5 pounds of weight.

(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/P2100011-600x450.jpg)

February 28th, 2011

Guess what we have...

SICOM T-Drive Carbon Rotors!!

They weigh 780 grams each!

(yeah that's only about 3 pounds lighter than the originals!)

(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/P3030026-600x450.jpg)

And we are mating them up with:

BST 5-Spoke Carbon Fiber Rims!!

(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/P2160008-600x450.jpg)

March 10th, 2011

Shes starting to look like a bike again!

(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/P3040042-600x450.jpg)

March 10th, 2011

A Carbon Dry Front Fender is installed.

Now if only we had the fuel tank to install...

:(

(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/P3100059-600x450.jpg)

Next up, Brembo Monoblocs!

(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/P3080051-600x450.jpg)

That's all for now, stay tuned for more!

 [moto]

Carbon rotors on the street?

I know CMC rotors stop well cold....but the only experiance I have with a real carbon rotor had me sreaming at the top of my lungs untill they had some serious heat in them.

It's all about the bling bro. ;)

Well they aren't straight carbon, but actually a Dual Matrix Composite that seems to work very well in all conditions and don't require significant warm up.

Its okay, he has Bling Pro -No heat required (too much MW2?)

what tank is going on?   just painted stock or something that doesn't grow?

Are those calipers 108's or 100's?  Hard to see from here if they are the cast ones washed out by flash, or the billet ones.  And not sure if those are the dust-seal variety or the no dust seal and possibly ti piston variety.

I see the bling o meter stopped just short of nickel...

Are the rotors 320 or 330mm?


---  I like brakes for some reason.  I read about them a lot. I contact manufacturers and ask "why this and why that" much to their annoyance.

Here's an interesting set of tech notes I've learned recently...  Just focusing on two brands, Brembo and ISR, since both make monoblock 4 piston calipers for 100mm and 108mm radial fork bottoms (that is, euro and japanese), so are quite applicable to Ducs, and can include those with aftermarket forks.  (Accossato doesn't do 100mm...yet, Beringer doesn't do monoblock...yet, etc etc).

The normal Brembo caliper's pistons are nice... in that they are lightweight. From my findings, they are made from aluminum throughout the lineup. However this is not a good material selection for conducting (or rather, not conducting) heat... The Brembo upgrade to calipers with titanium pistons, then is not (obviously) for a lighter piston (they WERE aluminum!)... its primarily an upgrade for keeping the heat from getting into your fluid as easily (so great stuff for endurance racing), and they are 'harder' - less likely to nick and gouge and so on and so forth.    Coming back to piston material in a minute....

The OEM Brembo stuff comes with dust seals - great for keeping crap from the effected/used sealing surface area  and the pressure seal. Sure crap might rub and gouge and whatnot the most external edge of the piston by the pad backing plates, and chew on the dust seal, but not affect the fluid seal. Great! Except that the extra seal is absolute crap for piston retraction.  So in the GP calipers, those dust seals are not there. Great piston retraction means you can actually trail the brake off - y'know, progressively lessen your braking input, upsetting the chassis as little as possible, etc etc etc.

The other calipers that I have "lots" of first hand experience would be the ISR calipers. While they do make calipers for H-D and metric cruisers, their bread-n-butter is racing brakes (from riders in the small displacement GP class, to folks here in the US racing in various regional classes, be it WERA, CMRA, etc etc).

ISR chose to make their pistons from a highly polished stainless steel (not sure what grade, I can see if I wrote it down in my notes from my communication).  Why SS, when it is heavier? Because it transmits the least amount of heat of the three piston materials discussed here. So, while the downside is it is the heavier of these options, the upside is that it is very hard and transmits the least amount of heat.

Why does the hardness of a piston matter? Revisit the part above about improved pad retraction without dust seals, and you'd need to consider a piston that isn't going to gouge really easily where the gouge could interact with the fluid pressure seal (like when you ain't got no dust seals to keep them there pressure seals safe).   ISR calipers for Ducati motorcycles are billet monoblocs and have no dust seals.

Billet versus cast? Well aside from having to over-size cast parts for the same strength (and with more mass, more weight), the billet parts are more rigid than the cast pieces. For braking, a more rigid setup means the friction applied is translated into both more actual 'stop', and a more intuitive stop ('feel'), instead of some of that force getting used up by flex.   The transition from axial mount (like the OEM brembo goldlines - 40mm and 65mm mount calipers, and the GP calipers, 40mm mount) to radial mount calipers was for that big gain in stiffness. Likewise, the axial Brembo GP calipers were billet... and the higher end ones on the WSBK and GP bikes (and available for purchase, now much more reasonably priced since they are 'old tech') were monoblocs.   So the latest tech would be radial...billet...and monoblock.  Really polishing off the high-tech would be the radial fork bottoms in billet (again for stiffness and reduction in unsprung weight) but that's getting *REALLY* costly.

The most ridiculous calipers are those that are billet monoblocs that aren't just simple, conveniently milled billet calipers, but instead those with a 'reason' for their shape. I would expect to see more brake companies investing in the R&D to produce topographically optimized versions of each of their calipers.

stock paint on something that hopefully won't grow (i.e. the new (2011) replacement tanks are not supposed (key word is definitely supposed) to grow, and that's what Ducati claims to be sending me.

Now we could get into the part about why I've been waiting months and months and months for this tank to arrive, but I think the result of this delay is clearly visible in how it gives me reason to spend more money on the bike.

 [bang]

I needed 108mm spaced calipers to match the Marzocchi forks, and I got a screamin good deal on some overstock Brembo cast/forged 108mm monoblocs, so that is what's going on for now.

I am talking to Accossato, Discacciatti, and ISR though, so one of them might jump into the fray before it's too late.

Ohh and the custom ST4 we are building will have some KICK-ASS Beringer brakes on it that will probably make this bike a bit jealous...


Also the rotors are 320mm (can't get 330's in the T-drive set up), but I'm happy to use the 320's on the monster, I mean half the people with 1098's swapped down to 320's anyway.

i likely would swap the 330's for 320's if i didn't have have the jingle for the sicoms or braketech cmc's

are they casted for forged? i always thought thye were milled.

They offer both what they call forged (but are basically cast), and CNC milled.

Lets just say these were close to free, especially when compared to the cost of CNC monoblocks.

Yeah - the M4 100 that is on the 1098/1198/SF/evo, etc - I call that "cast".   M4 108 is the same thing, but 108 instead of 100

cant wait to see this thing all bolted together . . .  [popcorn] [popcorn] [popcorn] [popcorn] [popcorn]

Amazing!  Giving me a couple of ideas with mine!

I know, I can't wait to ride it!

Good news guys,

The tank has arrived at the dealer and is being installed on Saturday.

The new Handlebars have arrived, and the CNC Racing fork collars for the oversize Marzocchi forks should be here early next week.

Still to come:

Carbon Fiber Headlight Surround,

Black anodizing of the chrome headlight ring,

Comp Werkes Exhaust cans,

Carbon Rear Fender,

Carbon Radiator Side Guards,

Carbon Fiber Folding Levers,

Racing Chain,

AEM Factory Magnesium sprocket carrier and sprockets,

Titanium Cush Drives,

and more and more and more...

:)

killin me man.  new rule, no updates without pics!!!!  [drool]

+1000000000! so not freakin fair to tease us!!!

All motorcycle parts whether they be called "billet," "cast," or "forged" will have machining done to them, there's no other way to get the critical tolerances that are required for moving parts or for motorcycle assemblies other than to machine them. There's really only a few basic ways in which most motorcycle parts can be formed: stamping, extrusion, casting, forged.

I'm not exactly sure how something can be said to be ""forged" but basically be cast". Forging is a process in which metal is repeatedly pressed into shape and results in a much stronger part because the orientation of the molecules is tighter than it would be if it were cast and more irregular with no porosity (or very little). After a part is forged it will need to be machined to achieve the critical geometries. Casting is a process where a metal is heated to it's liquid state and then poured into a mold. This results in small pores within the hardened part and also results in the material hardening with more aligned grain structure, which means it can "crack" more easily. A forged aluminum wheel is lighter than a cast wheel because the material is stronger so the forged wheel can be made with less material than it's cast counterpart.

Parts that are called "billet" such as rear sets, clip-ons, etc, are parts that are CNC machined from solid chunks of metal, usually extruded rods or sheet. Extrusion is a continuous process where a raw metal is pushed through a die creating a new shape, such as a rod or sheet. The effect is similar to forging in that the extruded material will have minimal porosity.

There's two basic types of brakes, mono-blocks and non-mono-blocks or two part brakes. Monoblocks have two forms, those that are forged and then have the critical cavities and geometries machined into them, and those that are machined from solid billet. The latter being more expensive because there's a lot more machining involved. Two part brakes are easiest and cheapest because there's no complicated and time consuming machining to do. You machine the critical tolerances in from one side then bolt these two halves together. This results in a weaker brake structurally though.

Anyway, just figured I'd mention some details about this, even though no one asked ;)

Of course re: machining parts in some fashion!

And Yes, the m4's are called 'forged' - but it is basically the equivalent of having a 1-piece 'casting', with piston holes created later through machining - if you were categorizing it as either "the race stuff" or the current version of the latest "OEM common parts" - it would certainly be the latter.  While these calipers are called "forged", I would be interested to see what type of forging process they are put through, or if this nomenclature is coming from the marketing department.  They are not the billet monoblocks that Brembo makes under the Brembo "Race" or Brembo "HP" line. (Brembo also makes 2-piece billet calipers under the HP and Race lines as well - all rear calipers from Brembo are 2 piece - the OEM, the HP, and the Race lines). 

ISR's calipers are billet monoblocks, and after much petitioning (from ... me), some work is being done on coming up with rear caliper designs (billet monoblocks) for the 3 euro mounts common on Ducati (84mm normal, 64mm "Brembo Race", and 60mm old-world race - for mounts similar to those on the 851/888 race bikes and the Supermono)

Brembo calls them forged, but if you press them for an answer as to how they are forged, you will find that they are "gravity forgings" which basically means that they found a way to describe the process of pouring the molten metal into the casting mold from a pot a foot above it as some part of a forging process.

The reality is I don't buy into it, but truth be told, it doesn't really matter one bit. I've used these brakes in the past and they perform beautifully, so I have no qualms about using them now.

Though a set of Hard Nickel Plated Beringer Calipers is tempting....

Bwahahahahahaha     [evil]

Amen to both - bad ass brakes for sure - especially at the current price they can be purchased brand new - but a bit of a shame that advertising gets in the way imo.    I do wish they came with better pads from the factory on the bikes - something that will eventually wear!  I did something as simple as the EBC HH's in there and thought it an improvement over the brembo pads.   I'm sure something like SRAC's or XRAC's are even more 'brake', but didn't have any handy at the time.


I would love to have some nickel plated calipers, and I hear the Beringer monoblocks aren't too far down the line, but are still currently not available (from my last communications with the N.A. representative - much like how he hinted-at/alluded-to additional 4D applications in the near future)

And just to muddy the waters, increasingly you see parts that are "vacuum cast" (or 'vacural vacuum die cast') like the cases on the newer Ducatis.

In theory this gives you the strength of a billet piece with the cost closer to regular casting process.

As usual, Kevin Cameron explains it very well. (http://blog.cycleworld.com/2010/11/vacural-vacuum-die-casting/)

And I will add that this thread is, in fact, useless without pics  ;D

We had a set of the Beringer hard nickel plated billet calipers in here last week, problem was they were already sold to a customer, and I (for some unknown reason) am starting to feel slightly budget conscious.

If you need a set, we can hook you up with a great price and get them here in probably 2-2.5 weeks.

I've also been pestering Beringer to re-invent the 4D system for use on Radial brake applications for a couple years now and it sounds like we may finally be getting somewhere...

I dunno whats wrong with just carrying an anchor and 50 feet of chain. Seemed to work fine on motorbikes for years....... [laugh]

Ok, one of the front wheel spacers were off by approximately 1mm, but that will be corrected today, and the fork collars arrived, so we should get the gauges mounted today, along with the fuel tank, and there is a chance the Comp Werks cans will arrive today (though most likely they'll be here on Monday).

nice advertising on that ape. [bacon]

I'm sorry, this one went right over my head... can you explain that more?

Update time!

Brembo calipers finally were installed after we machined some caliper spacers, and Spiegler SS Brake Lines in smoke with Ti fittings supply the fluid -

(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/Front_End_-_Complete-600x450.jpg)

Some Carbon Fiber Parts came next:

Carbonvani rear fender -

(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/rear_fender-600x450.jpg)

Carbonvani radiator side covers -

(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/Radiator_siders_-_after-450x600.jpg)

Carbonvani headlight surround -

http://bellissimoto.com/images/Headlight_Cover_2.jpg (http://bellissimoto.com/images/Headlight_Cover_2.jpg)

More updates to come soon, she is almost ready to ride!

Man...the clearances on the piggybacks look close to the swingarm.  Make sure you check em before you go riding.

carbon coated/covered airbox?

Its really just the angle that shot was taken at, there shouldn't be any problems in use.

You got me, it's wrapped in 3m carbon vinyl (the stock plastic was ugly, and no carbon airboxes exist, so....).

Actually, if price is no concern...Riding House in Japan makes a partial CF airbox w/ ram air for the S4RS for about $500
http://www.riding-house.com/products/ducati/fiber_parts/dfm020.html (http://www.riding-house.com/products/ducati/fiber_parts/dfm020.html)

Heard that. Looks like there is one from Carbon4Us as well, but not for the ol' hotrod 900 Carb-onsters.

This right here is why I love this forum, and while I'm not too interested in spending any more money on her at the moment, just wait until next winter and I'm sure those will magically find their way onto my bike!

Any pictures of the completed exhaust yet?  Or better yet a sound clip?

Yeah I've been watching for a while and waiting to see what happens next.
I guess summer and riding has taken over, while winter sets in here tomorrow.  :P

Hey guys,

Sorry about the delays, but I've been super busy here lately.

Here's a teaser until I get the rest of the pics, vids, etc... that I need.

(http://bellissimoto.com/sitebuilder/images/teaser-600x391.jpg)

 [thumbsup]

 [popcorn]

Those shorts are totally inappropriate kit for riding in.

Just sayin' is all.

Nice boots though  [thumbsup]

Those shorts look perfectly appropriate to "ride" in.  (with some minor modification)

That is an awesome machine - but out of all that neat stuff I like the seat cover the best.

She doesn't always cover the seat...

(http://bellissimoto.com/images/1for_home3.jpg)

http://bellissimoto.com/home.html (http://bellissimoto.com/home.html)

Wow nice  [thumbsup]
both of them

cheezus crust that's his wife  :-[

IBTL

I'd like to hear how the bike sounds with the Comp Werkes cans. [thumbsup]

No worries, Amy wouldn't model for me if she didn't enjoy the attention (and technically I have yet to buy the cow [Dolph]), and yes, a sound clip is coming soon.

I don't get the argument?  You can't put your girl/wife up on a bike all bent over in skimpy wear and not expect some comments about it.  Don't want the comments, don't take pics like that....pretty simple.

actually, Randy doesn't have the issue. kinda don't understand the problem some people have with it. His girl is a model.

<mod hat>

Enough with the leg humping, guys.

Whether the person in question likes the attention or not isn't the point.

</mod hat>

I was referring to the post above his.  It's obvious he/she doesn't have an issue with it :)

 ???  I hope it is, the whole point of advertising is to get attention and nobody is disrespectful, so no worries. More pics, sound clips, video, etc... to come soon.

of the bike?    ;D ;D ;D

So is this a full CompWorks exhaust? Or Arrow headers w/a ComWork cans?

I looked at your site and noticed you have them listed for the S4rs but the page is only says for the new gen monsters.

http://bellissimoto.com/CompWerkesMonsterSR.html (http://bellissimoto.com/CompWerkesMonsterSR.html)

I would also love to hear the details of the exhaust.  That thing is absolutely beautiful!

-Jimmy

Those are arrow headers with different cans.

I was gonna give Randy a hard time (am now) because he implied Radical Ducati copied his GP cans idea.....so he copied my use a set of arrow headers and put different cans on them idea  [laugh]

The arrow headers are really nice pieces, and CHEAP.  I used to build stainless exhausts (among other things) for a living, and the materials would nearly cost me what I can buy a set of the arrow headers for, not to mention several hours.

That's what I thought.  Page 5 has the arrow headers listed:

http://www.ducatimonsterforum.org/index.php?topic=43497.msg835003#msg835003 (http://www.ducatimonsterforum.org/index.php?topic=43497.msg835003#msg835003)

Regardless, it looks good.  I'm a big fan of the CompWrks exhaust.

Exhaust looks like a full Arrow kit with the cans swapped out for the Compworks.

As I said on Duc.ms, I just hate BSTs. Stock wheels on this thing would be rad.

I like the Mamba style BSTs more than the 5-spoke style, but both perform far better than stock Marchis. All things considered, I prefer whatever performs the best at the end of the day regardless of aesthetics. The convenient thing about that philosophy is that usually the best performing is also the best looking.

With all the other top shelf goods on that bike the stock wheels just wouldn't suffice anyway.

I'll bet that bike rides like nothing else! What a beast!

Now for some engine work. Knife-edged crank! Hi-comp pistons! Pankl Ti rods! Ported heads! Box 'o whimsy! Superman cape!

 [Dolph]

Guess we just have different views... I don't think carbon wheels offer much benefit when weighing in how much more fragile they are for road use.

I'm also a designer though, so I have a hard time succumbing to what I consider to be poor design/aesthetics. Just saying... it's already a SSSA Monster... carbon wheels are the least of the worries in regards to form over function. That SSSA is heavy as hell (think 999 and D16). SSSA is purely an aesthetically pleasing Ducati-esque design feature to please customers. Keeping with that, I just would have gone with appropriately pleasing wheels. Forged Mag, etc.


Regardless, if I ignore the wheels this is a sweet bike!

The BST wheels are not fragile though. BST carbon is a fatigue-free and highly resilient material. Much more so than forged magnesium. I'd have no qualms whatsoever riding pothole-ridden streets with these wheels. Just make sure the tire pressure is where it should be and one shouldn't have any trouble.

Blackstone Tek has a special process by which they manufacture their product, and they have thoroughly engineered these wheels to be streetable and durable. They have a good warranty as well, quite forgiving. BSTs are badass. 

With all that expensive lightweight stuff that bike must feel like a Surly fixie in the corners.

Love the way it turned out. Silver frame against all the black/cf looks superb  [thumbsup]

Are those mag triples?

You sir are a lucky man

Huh.  I'm quite the opposite - I like the 5-spoke over the Mamba (despite them being slightly heavier so I read).  If you end up with a 749999/848/1098/1198 5-bolt rotor style wheel that's 5 spoke and you want to get rid of it, let me know. I prefer it over the 7 spoker.



Well that makes only one of us.   I love the set I have and if I had the money, would be all over a 2nd and even a 3rd set for bikes in the garage.   The only negatives I've heard that were remotely tied to science and reality (and it was quite remote, at that) were technical claims from a biased party - a Marchesini rep. - none of which I have found true in real world application.   Hard to trust any salesman's rhetoric who has a stake in the decision.


I've had my BSTs for a few thousand miles now and I bought them 2d hand. Not only have I not had any problems, my setup employes a lightweight aluminum front axle.  The environment is more extreme than most as North Texas may have among the worst road surface conditions in the country (orders of magnitude worse than Middle Tennessee).  Potholes galore, every pavement seam most closely resembles the beginning of a stairway, uneven bridge-to-road matings and random partial-lane low-spots from ground settling.   The wheels are fine. You can bounce the naked rim off a cement floor without braking it.

I don't believe a person's occupations don't really have any legitimate leverage or place in the discussion - it cannot 'better qualify' one to have an opinion on the factory's engineering choices or as-delivered looks than another.  To do such would require a ranking of occupations and the strength of their relation to the contested element's design or looks.  How does a designer's opinion of fragility compare to, say, an chemical engineer or a composite aircraft component tester? Likewise, aesthetics are subjective.   I don't like double-headlights, but apparently people do as triumph manages to sell their naked bikes somehow and there are even people who bolt them onto Monsters.

In my opinion, there's nothing wrong with a SSSA when looking at the totality of the product.  The benefits are substantial in the SSSA platform: increased ease of maintenance for frequent maintenance-related tasks makes them ideal for road going bikes, like this Monster.  I loathe chain adjustments and wheel alignment issues in the standard, non-eccentric DSSA designs used by most manufacturers. Whether or not it is the 'best' platform for race-only machines is something to be debated in the offices of Ducati Corse, HRC, among others. Comparing to what works in former generation / WSBK models (749/999) and prototype race bikes is misplaced. If that was appropriate, every manufacturer producing a wet-clutch road-bike would be in error, as clearly the dry clutch is superior - after all the dry clutch is what every manufacturer runs in MotoGP.  Likewise, the 916 was tested with a DSSA setup as well as the SSSA design and the SSSA was what was used when results of testing the DSSA were not satisfactory.  (Picture at bottom).

For more bickering regarding swingarms with a few nuggets of wisdom sprinkled in, as it is somewhat out-of-place in the midst of a person's build-thread (sponsor or not), perhaps try this thread: http://www.ducati.ms/forums/11-ducati-motorcycle-chat/63206-single-vs-double.html (http://www.ducati.ms/forums/11-ducati-motorcycle-chat/63206-single-vs-double.html)  You'll notice discussion of why the DSSA was employed on the 999, tire wear concerns, rather than flexibility concerns in the SSSA, change in head designers and contractual rights associated with the change, tunability of the partially cast/partially sheetmetal/partially forged DSSA in the 749/999 'good swingarms' and D16RR swingarms, changes in manufacturing capabilities and improvements for the 848/1098/1198 and much more.

Now, if you are such a fan of magnesium (note: you have conveniently forgotten the magnesium oxidation and fatigue issues in your criticism of carbon fiber wheels for road going bikes...) and will remain steadfast in belief that the additional weight of the SSSA is not overcome by the conveniences inherit in its design, it just so happens that there are off-the-shelf magnesium SSSA options - especially useful in higher output 4v applications such as this - because of their increase to overall wheelbase and resulting enhanced stability.   Beyond that benefit, they are also lighter and stiffer than the original cast aluminum 748-996 versions and tubular Monster S2/S4R versions.  There are also aftermarket, off-the-shelf aluminum and/or carbon fiber SSSA that are similarly more rigid and lighter than the OEM design.   The obvious counterpoint is "but those are costly" -  but this matters not - it is a "project" bike rather than a production-line model, and the owner/builder's choice in spending and budgetary constraints would be personal choices, rather than a manufacturer's decisions based on price-points and potential sales volume.   

Since it is up to the individual builder in a project bike, some builders may feel that the oxidation and fatigue issues in cast or forged magnesium components - be it swingarms, wheels, valve covers or engine case covers - interferes so substantially with the bike's road going purpose as to choose alternatives.


BOOM:

(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-zvP6ovoCrf4/TfPSAPHiBTI/AAAAAAAAHLY/MlGDVKG0NDk/s800/Ducati%252520SBK%252520w%252520DSS%252520racing%2525202000%252520011.jpg)

+1.   Its not similar to cosmetic or thin carbon fiber as used on mudguards or even bodywork/fairings.

HOLY SHIT.

I'll concede that you shouldn't worry about your BSTs failing or anything wild, and I brought up mag wheels just for the 'it's not stock' argument, I'm quite a big proponent of forged aluminum wheels.

But really, I think you're missing my point (and given my low post count, I don't think anyone cares to listen). My point is this: The bike is not being built to race, it's built as a very high-level modified product. I think it turned out great overall, I --based on an aesthetic preference-- just don't like the BSTs. Given that it is quite obviously built with aesthetics in mind, and given that the Monster SSSA is hardly advantageous performance-wise over a modern DSSA, I would have changed the wheels or kept the stock Marchesinis on there. They are in my opinion (can I have that?) one of the best designed wheels available.

I bring up my profession only in preface to my opinions concerning the aesthetics.

F'in hell, guess a guy can't have a differening opinion around here. I shouldn't even mention that I have an S4Rs and I love it and I love a lot of stuff on this one.



P.S. I like BSTs on DSSA bikes because they just look like 5 spoke Marchesinis. :P

absolutely have an opinion, just rubs me the wrong way if someone tells me their aesthetic preferences are mo-better because they are a designer or a grizzlybear or whatever.

^Not what I meant to imply, only that they may take precident over what is 'internet cool' because I'm a visual creature!

I think it's the rivets on the face that I have a huge problem with. And you can't really get away from how sex the split '10 spoke' Marchesinis are.

At the end of the day eveyone has their own preferences and that's what makes all our bikes different.

@ Lindz
Yo I like the stock Marchis! Really! But not the 5-spoker S2R style(which is what I have unfortunately). The S4RS style does look good, I agree.

However, I'd have to disagree slightly about your comment that the bike was 'quite obviously built with aesthetics in mind'. I'd say it was built with consideration for both performance and looks. The Brembo monoblocs and Sicom rotors right along with the Marzocchi front end/rear Bitubo shock kinda point to that. Those are extremely high-end high-performance items that aren't necessarily designed with aesthetic focus. Casual observers wouldn't know the difference.

What kind of designer are you? Don't say fashion. Or interior. Or handbag. [cheeky]

Your post count doesn't matter. Your 'differening' opinion is welcome here just like everyone else's.

BTW if you like the Marchi 10-spokers so much, have you seen the Carrozzeria V-Star and V-Track wheels?

+1

Fair game. I said 'with aesthetics in mind' for many reasons. Not least of which is stripping the bike out and painting the frame. The amount of work required for this and the fact that he wanted a specific color for it is rather obvious this was done in the interest of aesthetics (to great results, might I add). Also, it's a bike to promote your retail and parts business, not your race team or whatever so you obviously build it with a certain visual style to attract customers/attention (and thus why I understand the BSTs... look how many of you love them!).

I am a 'car designer' (though I've done much more than just that, incl. bikes), I just left Honda after 2 years working in Tokyo. It's obviously not all that I've done, but it's not fashion (though I'd love to do clothes... most everything is shit nowadays).

I updated that post, but here again is that picture of the DSS setup on the 996 era race bike getting tested before going back to the SSS:


(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-zvP6ovoCrf4/TfPSAPHiBTI/AAAAAAAAHLY/MlGDVKG0NDk/s800/Ducati%252520SBK%252520w%252520DSS%252520racing%2525202000%252520011.jpg)

God no, last thing I need to do now is add more power to this bike!

As for wheels, I don't like the 7 spoke Mamba's myself, I think they are too large and take away from the fact that this bike is rather naked.

The good news though, is that she is all finished up for now!!

(http://bellissimoto.com/images/DSC_0174c2.jpg)


Anyone who wants to pick up the custom CompWerkes/Arrow exhaust for their monster can do so here - http://bellissimoto.com/CompWerkesMonsterSR.html (http://bellissimoto.com/CompWerkesMonsterSR.html)

Beautiful!!!












Bike's not bad too! ;)

not bad either