So after the bike spent a while at the dealer, they said the random misfires may be the Nemesis ECU and told me to try the factory ECU. I swapped ECUs only to have it happen again a day later. I called them again and they suggested trying to bypass the kickstand switch and see what happens. Tried this yesterday and when I rode the bike today it happened twice more. Any more suggestions? There are no CEL either. Gauges stay on through the problems as well. Bike is an 07 S2R 800.
mis-fires purely at random? Or on acceleration; decleration or steady-state throttle?
Random...have happened at all throttle positions.
That is the ONLY problem I've had with my bike (same).
It happened only once - new plugs fixed it. Try that?
Check the 13mm engine ground underneath the rear brake reservoir. It only has to be a little bit loose to cause trouble. Free and easy and if it fixes it then bonus [moto]
I haven't. I am assuming though that that would throw a CEL? Also, wouldn't the dealer have checked that?
I'm gonna check that ground now. I REALLY don't think it is that as the gauges never lose power during this.
Quote from: hackers2r on November 08, 2010, 02:20:18 PM
I'm gonna check that ground now. I REALLY don't think it is that as the gauges never lose power during this.
Yeah, my guages never lost power either when I was having similar troubles but the engine ground was loose. Tightening the 13mm bolt fixed it. Might not be your problem but wouldn't it be great it it were?
Out of curiousity...that damn ground is filthy. I'm looking at cleaning it. Anything I should do before loosening this? But it was thoroughly tightened.
Wire brush the bolt with some WD40 and put a little copper antisieze paste on it if you have some. Also clean the wire terminator and ground point on the case. Get that connection spotless and corrosion-free so you can rule it out completely.
Dealer used the Ducati diagnostic computer on my bike when it was firing on one cylinder - code came back 'communication fail from ECU to coil'. After some headscratching he found the engine ground loose and tightened it. He then took the bike out and flogged it on the freeway, came back and pronounced it fixed.
This may not be your issue, but it goes to show how sensitive the electricals are.
Random misfires can be really difficult to diagnose. I had a repeatable cough from the airbox at ~3500rpm that was only solved after a valve adjustment. Could just as easily have been something electrical.
BTW I have the same bike as you, a year older.
Do I need to disconnect anything?
I don't see why you should have to disconnect anything.
In another post, it is mentioned that I should disconnect the negative terminal of the battery. Anyone? Or should I just unscrew, clean and reattach with bike off of course.
You should be fine.
Well I cleaned the connection as described and reattached. Just went on a ride and it is still happening!!! Any other ideas? Also, if it were spark plugs, wouldn't this be much more frequent? Thanks.
are you sure its electrical? have you checked for air leaks?
what happend between it running fine and now?
have you checked the wiring loom for any corroded connections?
Quote from: hackers2r on November 08, 2010, 05:20:30 PMJust went on a ride and it is still happening!!!
Sorry bud but I never said that was definitely the problem, only that it was wise to rule it out before you start spending money. It could be a host of different culprits. You should rule out all electrical connections first, because you can do that at home for free. You said the bike was at the dealer and they didn't fix it. Maybe you need a better dealer. Luckily the guy I go to when I'm stumped is a troubleshooter not just somebody who throws parts at problems. You need to find somebody like that, somebody who actually loves these bikes. One indication that a dealer is just such a person is the size of the shop and whether or not they also sell a multitude of other brands. My experience with dealers that also sell Kawasakis is that they don't know shit about the Ducatis.
Good luck with it, I know it's frustrating trying to nail this thing as I've had running problems before as well and they drove me nutz. Part of the experience I suppose. I will go so far as to guarantee you that it's something easily corrected however.
^I know...just getting really frustrating. It is getting more predictable though. Usually takes 15-20 min. of riding to happen. Only reason I'm continuing to go to the dealer is there is warranty left on the bike. However, if this isn't resolved shortly, I will be seeking help elsewhere.
Quote from: hackers2r on November 08, 2010, 08:03:43 PM
Only reason I'm continuing to go to the dealer is there is warranty left on the bike.
If the warranty is still there I would drop that bike off and tell them you'll stop by every day till it's fixed. If they are a dealer that just throws parts at a bike..... So be it. Your'e not paying for it.
Do you have another dealer in your area?
Did you check the plug wires? Maybe one is slighty broken.
I can't find the post where you actually fully describe the actual issue in detail.
Can you provide a bit more as to what is going on for those of us who don't know the full story?
BC.
Sure...so the bike seems to have an issue with intermittent misfires or stalling. Not really sure which it is. It has done it for a while but I hadn't really paid that much attention to it until recently when it did it mid-turn and almost put me down. To describe the actual problem, the bike seems to just not fire once but then keeps running. Almost like it cuts ignition.
Quote from: hackers2r on November 08, 2010, 05:20:30 PM
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Also, if it were spark plugs, wouldn't this be much more frequent? Thanks.
It wasn't for me. My bike would suddenly "stop" for a second or a tenth of a second, several times in a row or just once. I didn't really think it could be plugs, but it was my initial thought, so I tried it. It worked. Try it?
Just take it to Chris Boy
Quote from: hackers2r on November 10, 2010, 07:38:19 AM
Sure...so the bike seems to have an issue with intermittent misfires or stalling. Not really sure which it is. It has done it for a while but I hadn't really paid that much attention to it until recently when it did it mid-turn and almost put me down. To describe the actual problem, the bike seems to just not fire once but then keeps running. Almost like it cuts ignition.
Might be something completely different, but my 999 was, what I would have called "missing" and eventually starting some howitzer like backfiring. The shop went through all the electrical, went back to stock ecu, tore the motor down, etc. Turned out to be the throttle body was bad. Something about the butterfly valves were messed up and causing the throttle control sensor to tell the ecu that the throttle was momentarely closed. Like I said, quite possibly a completely different issue, but I thought it would be worth mentioning before you run up a huge troubleshooting bill at the shop. Excuse any misguided terminology, I am in no way, shape, or form, a mechanic.
Not my tab...bike is under warranty [thumbsup]
What about a leak somewhere along the intake tract? It could cause a lean condition which would result in the misfiring you are describiing. ???
But if it only happens when the engine is warmed up (after ~15min riding), then maybe the lean condition is caused by a faulty temperature sensor (overcorrecting)?
I know coils and ignition components misbehave when hot. If it is under warranty, it may be the best to leave it to the dealer, because it may take some part substitutions to see what is amiss. Sorry you are going through this and I hope you have it back soon. I've had misfires in a turn. It takes me many rides to get the confidence back.
The bike isn't running lean at all. Was dyno tuned and is running a perfect a/f according to the dealer. This is why I think it is something electrical.
Quote from: hackers2r on November 10, 2010, 07:38:19 AM
Sure...so the bike seems to have an issue with intermittent misfires or stalling. Not really sure which it is. It has done it for a while but I hadn't really paid that much attention to it until recently when it did it mid-turn and almost put me down. To describe the actual problem, the bike seems to just not fire once but then keeps running. Almost like it cuts ignition.
Okay, now I understand what is going on.
My S2R1000, which I sold to my friend a while back, before buying my 848, started doing the exact same thing last year.
He would be riding along, and then the bike's throttle would become disconnected from reality, and the bike would run like its not getting any fuel or ignition. Eventually the stalling stuttering became so bad, it started leaving him stranded places he didn't appreciate, one of them being the I-25 corridor in Denver, during morning rush hour traffic, in the left breakdown lane, right at 6th Avenue exit.
The cop told him to leave the bike, and let the tow trucks pick up the bike, because it was too dangerous for him to stay with the bike. Right after the tow trucks arrived, because they were blocking the left lane, a 5 car pile up happened when stupid people came flying up, freaked out, and slammed on the brakes, swerving everywhere. They took out a tractor trailer, too, it was that bad.
So, when I got to him and the bike, we brought it back to my place.
First thing I tested was the electrical supply to the fuel pump, because when I would turn on the ignition, I wasn't hearing the pump prime.
Electrical to the pump tested okay, so the computer was working fine.
So I told him to pick up another pump from eBay.
A week or so later, he got the new pump, we installed it, and the bike fired up, first try.
Its been running perfect since.
So, it might be the fuel pump giving you issues.
There have been a couple of posts that tell you how to repair the damaged wire that is typically the cause, if you want to give that a try first.
BC.
Well I've been riding the bike for about a week now after I got it back and this was their resolution. They kept getting a code for coils. Swapped out coils but codes still came back. Checked and cleaned grounds codes came back. Removed all electronic components, cleaned connections and reinstalled, codes came back. At this point, they disconnected the headlamp and the codes went away. Got a call asking if I messed with the headlamp and I said I only changed the bulb to a Hella 55/60 H4 so they ruled that out. They cleaned the connections of the headlamp, reattached and codes went away!? In any case, they replaced a few sensors in the process so good for me, but the problem seems to have been solved by the headlight connection. LMFAO!!! Unreal. Thanks for all the help guys.
Great - that's what I suggested - new plugs.... :P
Wait....
WTF, headlight??????
[laugh] [laugh] [laugh]
Scratch that...did it again!!! Bike is going in tomorrow AGAIN. #3. Lemon Law is creeping up. I REALLY want them to fix it though. Don't like the new monsters.
Mine might be on the market soon.
Quote from: hackers2r on December 06, 2010, 03:28:33 PM
Scratch that...did it again!!! Bike is going in tomorrow AGAIN. #3. Lemon Law is creeping up. I REALLY want them to fix it though. Don't like the new monsters.
Please, try the plugs, will you?
Wow...this is turning really ugly. I'll post details later on but what a mess.
Actually, I need advice regarding Florida Lemon Law. If someone knows about it, can you shoot me a PM? Thanks.