Ducati Monster Forum

I ride a 01 M750 and absolutely love it. i am kinda new to riding (just over a year including winter) and i am just now learning about the 4 stroke vs 2 stroke battle. i dont know much but from who i talk to the 2 stroke sounds to be pretty awesome and worth the money. what are your thoughts on 2 strokes?

For old school dirt bikes, maybe. Or 125 MotoGP. :-\

2 stroke road bikes can be pretty lethal, especially to the inexperienced rider.  They have wicked power bands.

Two strokes offer more powerfrom less displacement, higher maintenance (rebuilding top-ends, bottom-ends), a VERY peaky powerband, and weigh less than a 4 stroke.  They are great in dirtbikes and snowmobiles.

Two strokes are also much lighter/simpler than their four stroke counterparts.

I can't imagine the 800 twin out of my sled in a bike chassis. Someone would surely die.

(http://motorbike-search-engine.co.uk/classic_bikes/kawasaki-h2.jpg)

many did.

those damn widowmakers.....

One happened to be a friend of mine.  :(

Nasty smelly ,tinny  horrible sounding things but very quick

I've got a soft spot for 2-strokes.  I learned to ride motorcycles on a 185cc 2-stroke dual sport.  That thing was stupid fun.  If I had the money, I'd have a GT750, one of those Kawasakis pictured above, a RZ350, an RD350, a Suzuki RG500... and the list goes on.  

Speaking of the RG500, I've only seen one on the road, ever.  I was at the Pisgah Inn, sitting around talking with some riding buddies.  We hear what sounds like the worlds biggest and most pissed off chainsaw.  Ringing, dinging and rattling along with a cloud of smoke rolls up this 500cc2-stroke.  Rubber balled up on the tires, not a chicken strip to be found.  I didn't know it at the time, but we got to witness one of the rarer bikes one might see being ridden like it was intended to be ridden.  At startup?  I've never heard such a noise.  I'm fairly certain women, children and emergency personnel were running for their lives.  I was just enjoying inhaling the wonderful scent of oil ~

Typically they use a lot of fuel, make a lot of smoke and noise and are a bit difficult to ride.

That being said, I would LOVE a KX500 motard.

JM

A good friend had a blue '72 H2 750 Kawi just like in that picture when they came out. It had Bill Wirges expansion chambers, carbs re-jetted and K&N pod air filters. It was like riding a motorcycle sized giant bottle rocket when the fuse was lit! [moto] I loved the door hinge in the middle of the frame! [laugh] It handled worse than the Z-1. But it was a make the beast with two backsing rocket in a straight line. I was riding on the back with him to the local 7-11 and he wheelied it unexpectedly and spit me off the back. Luckily we were going at parking lot speed so all I got was a little road rash and a sore back/butt.

It was too much for me. I preferred my R5 and RD350 Yammyhammers. They were light weight and for the time they handled pretty good. Some Dunlop K81 tires and a shock swap and you were good to go. [moto]

I spent last year putting a 1975 Suzuki GT550 back on the street.  I succeeded.  After riding a Monster, I can say that the Suzuki handles awful, the brakes (front disk) are definitely 1975 vintage, and it is heavy and underpowered compared to today's bikes.  ~480 pounds and a dyno test from an old magazine put it at around 35hp at the rear wheel.  I still like it for what it is.  It leaves me wondering what a modern 2 stroke would be like given 35 years of engine development along with a modern chassis and current suspension & brakes.

http://www.superstreetbike.com/features/1002_sbkp_2010_aprilia_rs250/index.html (http://www.superstreetbike.com/features/1002_sbkp_2010_aprilia_rs250/index.html)

PLEASE, Pretty PLEASE

Imagine a new RS250 or even RS500  [evil]

I've often wondered about an H2 motor in a modern frame...

then my buddy reminds me I'd have 75 ish hp that was a PITA to ride.

I'll stick with my Ducs for now.

I went off the road at over 70 mph on one of those H2 750's. It's amazing that I didn't die.  It wasn't the awesome power of the bike but rather it wouldn't turn and the frame was god awful flexie.

The H2 also had a penchant for going into a tank slapper at top speed for no reason at all.

Ahhh..the good old days. :P

You guys are seriously making me re-live some motorcycle riding moments I'd rather forget. [bang] Reference to previously mentioned door hinged frame of the H2!! :P [roll] Every time I tried to ride my buddy's H2 hard and fast it would always do something to make me stop and give it back ASAP. Made me appreciate my little Yammy 350cc twins even more.

Still, I'd love to take a ride on a stock H2 today just to remind me that it can be civilized if you don't do anything stupid on it. My friend's bike was a hot one and we tended to do stupid stuff at the time. ;D Can't believe we survived some of the shit we did. Wasn't it George B. Shaw who said "Youth is wasted on the young"? [laugh] [wine]

Nope...

It was my dad. ;D

 [laugh] I know it wasn't my Dad. He kept his comments to 3-4 words max. Shut up, sit down, eat your food, clear the table, mow the lawn, go to school... wordy, thought provoking stuff like that. [laugh]

Journeyman's story about the Gamma struck a chord. Wished I had been there to see and hear that. Never have seen one on the street and seen only one in a shop. Those were really cool scooters!

http://www.rg500.net/images/rg500/mvc-006f.jpg (http://www.rg500.net/images/rg500/mvc-006f.jpg)

http://www.rg500.net/images/rg500/kenny_roberts_on_rg500_01.jpg (http://www.rg500.net/images/rg500/kenny_roberts_on_rg500_01.jpg)

Made me dig around on google and find the RG500 Gamma website. Hope the above pics of KR Sr. on the Gamma comes through. Pretty neat. [thumbsup]

Just one more year and my two RG500 Gammas are considered "vintage" to the EPA.  At that point I'll be importing them into the US with little red tape and rebuilding them to their former pristine glory.    ;D

I learned to ride on an RG250, then graduated to an RZ350, RD500, and then raced RG500's against CBR600 Hurricanes.  It was years before I owned my first GSXR750 four stroke.  I can't wait to have my babies back with me.  The RG's are mental. 

Pics! >:(

I'm sure you'd be happy to let me ride one of the Gammas when you get them here. You would be happy to, right? ;D

There was a prestine 1984 Roberts/bumble bee RZ350 for sale last year at a local used bike shop. They are part of a local Honda Powersports dealership since they are not allowed to sell used bikes, only new Hondas. The used bike shop always has something interesting and the RZ was in unbelievably good shape. Totally stock, 100%! The tank, seat, front fender and assorted body pieces didn't even look five years old (much less twenty six!!) and had no dings or scratches. Amazing. It had maybe 4-4,500 on the odometer if I remember right but I wouldn't have been surprised to see no more than 500 miles on it.

I kept finding reasons to stop by and see if it was still there. They had lots of lookers but no buyers. I can't believe it lasted so long. They finally got rid of it via ebay motors. I hated to see it go but I was glad to see it finally gone so it would stop it's Siren's song! The temptation to buy it was growing with every visit. [bang]

My new sled engine's good for 150-155 HP bone stock.  ;)

so from what i read (at least the majority of the opinions) 2-strokes are just as awesome as i have heard. its a shame that they dont make them anymore. i would love to see what they could do with them these days. i have only had the pleasure to ride a 2-stroke once and it was a dirtbike. i still got a pretty good experience with a wonderful comparison to the 4 vs. 2. My father in law has his own t-shirt company online and he is a 2-stroke fanatic. take a look. good stuff if you like the 2-stroke. lets bring it back.

http://www.revanche2strokes.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=1 (http://www.revanche2strokes.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=1)  ;D

Emissions laws being what they are... the chances of production 2-stroke street vehicles are poor.

BRP makes a 800CC 147hp 2-cylinder 2-stroke engine though that seems like it would just be tits in a custom bike...

I've seen a CR500 Motard....I couldn't help thinking it was a 1 way ticket to hell...

Fixed it for ya  [evil]

JM

Giannis on our local DFW board had a Honda CR500 motard. Maybe that why he was sent back to Greece!!! [laugh] G-man, if you see this pipe in with the CR story!! [thumbsup] [moto] His posts about it sounded like a ball buster! Crazy man in a good way. ;D

Here's a pretty damn awesome custom that got posted here a while back.

http://thekneeslider.com/archives/2009/04/24/xj500t-jaybuilt-kawasaki-500-bellytank-triple/ (http://thekneeslider.com/archives/2009/04/24/xj500t-jaybuilt-kawasaki-500-bellytank-triple/)

Wow! Didn't see that the first time. That's really cool and well thought out. I bet it gets to it's gear limited 120 mph pretty damn fast! :o

That RD350 was one of the all time best ever bikes built.  I don't think Yamaha would be where they are today without it.

Ah, the H2.  Once going in an absolutely straight line doing about 80mph I saw a garbage truck pull out on the road about a half -- three quarter mile in front of me. I lightly applied brakes just to sort of settle down to coast speed. Doggone thing started pogo sticking on me. You would think I would have learned right then & there to get rid of the thing. But, noooooooo...............

I love 2 strokes. I used to build Yami RD based road racers (got some pictures somewere) they are quick and used to be easy to find parts for. to go really, really quick takes money and a lack of rational thought. I used to love riding my road RD on back roads under 60. They handle well enough (but I ran bigger comp-K metzlers) after you get over 80 things get scary. But nothing beats the crackle of an expansion chambers on a ported bike and the smell of burnt Yam-R is quite pleasant

Kawi triples are death on wheels. faster that the Yami but handle like they have a hinge in the middle somewere.

I started riding Ducatis because they were less maintenance. seriously

I am not without scars on my brain and my body, but I can live with them. I still feel a shudder in my spine every time I see a picture of a Vincent Black Shadow, or when I walk into a public restroom and hear crippled men whispering about the terrifying Kawasaki Triple...Hunter S. Thompson

  I drag raced both a 500 cc and a 750 circa '71 and '72. It was a blast.

I'd love to have an original '69 H-1. There was (is) a mechanic at Irving Kawasaki (in Irving, TX) that actually had the 1969 H-1 that belonged to Rusty Bradley. It was given to Bradley by Kawasaki and after he died my mechanic buddy bought it from Bradley's family. I spent years trying to buy it from him but he wouldn't budge. He knew the bike's history made it that much cooler. [thumbsup]

Here's a little sbkplanet story on Bradley for those not familiar with him. God only knows how good he would have been and what he would have accomplished. Makes me think about Cal Rayborn too. Sad.

http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2003-Aug/e/n030808b.htm (http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2003-Aug/e/n030808b.htm)

(http://www.twostrokeshop.com/RS500_4mid.jpg)

RS500GP. 130hp, 250-ish lbs.  [evil]

Anyone got $22K I can borrow?




http://www.twostrokeshop.com/Aprilia_RS500_2008.htm (http://www.twostrokeshop.com/Aprilia_RS500_2008.htm)

NOPE....but for less money, you can get a Bimota V-Due! 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bimota_V_Due (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bimota_V_Due)

(http://p1.bikepics.com/pics/2006/08/08/bikepics-651573-800.jpg)

http://raresportbikesforsale.com/1997-bimota-vdue-500/ (http://raresportbikesforsale.com/1997-bimota-vdue-500/)

My first bike was a Suzy T500.  A piece of shite but it was my first love.  Don't mean to sound like a greeny, but I am.  2 strokes are dirty, they foul the air and your ear drums. 

I'll see your 500cc 2 Stroke and I'll raise you with a 1100cc 2 Stroke  :o
http://www.twostrokeshop.com/TSS1100GP.htm (http://www.twostrokeshop.com/TSS1100GP.htm)

Ring a ding ding [moto] [moto]

Rusty Bradley was the sponsored racer at the Honda/Kwak shop I worked at. I started a couple of months after he died.

The people there were like zombies for a long time.

Another good friend of mine from those days, Andres LaScoutx (sp) broke his back on a factory (Canada) H1 race bike around the same time.

The Kwak triples were very unforgiving in both street and race trim.

Since Bradley was a local guy I have always wondered what he could have done. He could have been what Kenny Roberts became. Of course everyone's lives take all sorts of turns and twists but he was headed on a path of potential greatness. He was local legend material because of his abilities and his possible future. He certainly thought so. So did I. In the days of AMA amateur races he was dreaming of FIM World Championship races. And winning. A tragic loss for the sport. You can see why Bart (at Sammy White's Irving Kawi) won't sell that '69 H-1 to anyone. The story behind it raises its' value ten fold. [moto]

I owned an RD250, 350 and a 400 while I was in college. Fantastic machines, but like most things from our youth we remember then fondly. If I were to ride one now I'm sure I would freak out over the crappy handling and brakes, plus I remember my RD400 giving me some "Oh Shit" moments during the occasional tank slapper, and that was even with a steering damper.

Yeah, but some of that might rank in the "oh shit" fond memory catagory. Some "oh shit" memories don't make it there. [bang]

I keep thinking I'll find an old RZ350 like I used to race and restore it to it's former glory.

Still, I'd settle for a modern bike with similar weight and power. My race bike weighed in at an honest 290lbs (wet) and made an honest 60 HP on the dyno. Is it so much to ask?

I also owned an RD-400... but I never really loved that bike. Probably because it kept trying to kill me :)

You would have jumped all over the '84 RZ350 I posted about earlier. Completely stock? Since when did you ever see a completely stock RD/RZ? It was a jewel. Some days (like right now) I regret not scraping the money together and making room for it in the garage. Somebody out there got a real beauty! [thumbsup] [bow_down]

RZ350 Startup (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=138wYQ73suM&feature=fvw&safety_mode=true&persist_safety_mode=1#normal)

Nice horn sound but otherwise that thing hurts my ears.

Yeah you're probably right  [thumbsup]

Street legal, If your slick enough at the registry, you can slip it in as a no tag no insurance 50cc.
(http://motorcyclephotooftheday.files.wordpress.com/2010/10/captured2003-09-2600005.jpg?w=640&h=480)

Bee's nest.
(http://motorcyclephotooftheday.files.wordpress.com/2010/10/dscf0168.jpg?w=640&h=480)

RZ/RD
(http://motorcyclephotooftheday.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/tout.jpg?w=640&h=480)

(http://motorcyclephotooftheday.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/2010_11_21_bikepics-2102142-full.jpg?w=640&h=425)
(http://p1.bikepics.com/pics/2010%5C11%5C21%5Cbikepics-2102143-full.jpg)
Tis kinda seals the deal of most topics raised before.
RD 500 vs R6 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JAOOt0hDSOs&feature=player_embedded#normal)

(http://motorcyclephotooftheday.files.wordpress.com/2010/11/0042528225292.jpg?w=640&h=480)
http://kawaportal.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=2655&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0 (http://kawaportal.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=2655&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0)

(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_VDCGGBYmNCk/TQbYjcUFynI/AAAAAAAAReI/Zm9z_6UhEjY/s640/tony+racing+pictures+031.jpg)
Tony 's Nicosia's Kaw. H-1,Tony Set the AHRA World Record at Loins Drag Strip 1969 111.38 MPH / 12.61 ET it was the fastest St. M/C !

For those of you who don't know much about Tony he is the man who put the wow in Kawasaki.  He is a living legend in the Kawasaki Triples community.  Back when these were new bikes and Kawasaki was looking to make a splash he was the rider they turned to at the dragstrip.  Here's another page I have on him with some more great shots!

From the Wikepedia page:
It was the quickest production motorcycle at the time. When motorcycle journalists expressed some disbelief, Kawasaki suggested they take a new H-1 to the drag strip. Using a regular production model with only 7 miles on it, Tony Nicosia ran the quarter mile in 12.96 seconds at 100.7 mph for the press to witness (the official figure was 12.4 secs by Mike Wenzel - quite believable on a well run in machine). Tony Nicosia set many world records with Kawasaki triples over the following years, including some land speed records at Bonneville Salt Flats

Here he is in all his glory. Thanks Tony!

An early Pee Wee Gleason! [thumbsup] [moto]

Aprilia SXV550 is close....

Sorry, should have specified reliable / low maintenance and sportbike.

I've got a Duke at the moment and it's a great bike. I just would like something just a bit lighter in a sportbike (not supermoto) package.

 :o

wait...you want reliable and low maintenance and yet you want a 2 stroke?....hmmm...where is the sense there?

More info please.... [thumbsup]

http://www.rzrd500.com/ (http://www.rzrd500.com/)

http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=de&u=http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yamaha_RD_500_LC&ei=cxovTbCJNcP88AbpzrGeCQ&sa=X&oi=translate&ct=result&resnum=10&ved=0CEUQ7gEwCTgK&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dyamaha%2Brd500%26start%3D10%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN%26prmd%3Divns (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=de&u=http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yamaha_RD_500_LC&ei=cxovTbCJNcP88AbpzrGeCQ&sa=X&oi=translate&ct=result&resnum=10&ved=0CEUQ7gEwCTgK&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dyamaha%2Brd500%26start%3D10%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN%26prmd%3Divns)

My first bike was a 2-Stroke, when I lived in Sydney.  A Suzuki RG-250.  I always thought it was strange that they required you to ride a 250 for 12months in Australia, but allowed me to ride this 2 stroke suzuki, that had been modded by the guy before me, as my first bike.  I wonder if that has changed since 1999 when I lived there.  I thought this bike was pretty quick and in hindsight, probably not the best for my first experience on a motorcycle:  http://www.cyclechaos.com/wiki/File:1984-Suzuki--Yellow-2.jpg (http://www.cyclechaos.com/wiki/File:1984-Suzuki--Yellow-2.jpg)

Wish I could have it back now though, to turn into a little cafe bike in my shed. 

http://www.twostrokeshop.com/Aprilia_RS500_2008.htm (http://www.twostrokeshop.com/Aprilia_RS500_2008.htm)

here ya go...ready to rock and roll!

Silversled

http://bayarearidersforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=353588 (http://bayarearidersforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=353588)

Speechless... [thumbsup]

That's one hell of a project bike!! [thumbsup] [clap] [bow_down]

"My God. It's full of Win..."

WANT.  :o

 [bow_down]  Makes me rethink what I want to do to my RG500s.  I prefer the Gamma engine but this thing is dripping with awesome-ness    [bow_down]

Oh, HELL YA!  Squared

A couple bad ass old dudes owned this minty fresh 70's brown H-1 500.  Sweeeeet !
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=330519187515+&viewitem= (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=330519187515+&viewitem=)

Get 'em while you can. 2-stroke section of a junk yard going to scrap.

(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_VDCGGBYmNCk/TTxjBYch1QI/AAAAAAAAR4U/6hZLfttcmbs/s640/S0526.jpg)

At times that looks like my garage! [laugh]

CR 500 1988 -  First ride after rebuild! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aYbsQegmrN0&feature=related#normal)

This brings back some memories.

My first bike was
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v636/780monster/1968_T500.jpg)

Not the actual bike but the same color only faded with a ripped seat and rusty pipes.  After I owned her for a year or so I sold it to a fellow student.  She never road it so I bought it back.  Painted her metallic blue all pretty and custom like all the while she showed her true nature as a piece if shite.  The tranny ate gears.  The spark was bad.  I could never get it to idle properly.  It fouled plugs constantly.   But man, I was a kid and I had a bike, men feared me and women desired me. 

here's an interesting 2 stroke frankenbike...

http://thekneeslider.com/archives/2011/02/16/kr800-kawasaki-rotax-2-stroke-street-bike/#more-14302 (http://thekneeslider.com/archives/2011/02/16/kr800-kawasaki-rotax-2-stroke-street-bike/#more-14302)

Whoa.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=190501933975+&viewitem= (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=190501933975+&viewitem=)

my next bike will hopefully be an 85 yamaha rz350. i have the money i just cant find one close enough to where i live. if anybody knows of one for sale if the pacific northwest let me know.