accident 2-5 short (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wngvZwm83nw&feature=player_embedded#normal)
It's very hard. Although I'm sure there are things to say about his understanding of traffic.
I have never seen a crash test video done on a bike before let alone in real life. I suppose as long as your not crooked in between the cars when you get hit there is a crumple zone of sorts where you can survive and walk away. Glad hes ok.
Holy Crap.
Thank god he's fine. I probably wouldn't want to talk to her either, dang!
I have to wonder, even watching my mirrors if I could've escaped.
Trick is to not get wedged in there in the first place.
So class, what should he have done different?
He was hit about 1 second or less, after he stopped.
Hanging back and getting hit at a lower closing speed ( or maybe she slows with you instead if failing to stop)
Noticing she wasn't paying attention and changing lanes earlier (we don't know how long she was behind him)?
accidents happen. the woman apologized several times and was checking to see if he was ok.... better than most.
ape shit on this pregnant dog? nice. you know nothing about her except she made a mistake. a non-life-threatening mistake.
WOW :o
looks like everyone lucked out in this instance (considering the possibilities.)
He may still be injured and we don't know it, but wow that was awesome the way he popped up and landed on two feet. I wonder if he still would have popped up like that if the lady had been gong much faster or if he would have been crushed. Very scary.
Quote from: seevtsaab on February 06, 2011, 04:19:51 AM
I have to wonder, even watching my mirrors if I could've escaped.
Trick is to not get wedged in there in the first place.
So class, what should he have done different?
He was hit about 1 second or less, after he stopped.
Hanging back and getting hit at a lower closing speed ( or maybe she slows with you instead if failing to stop)
Noticing she wasn't paying attention and changing lanes earlier (we don't know how long she was behind him)?
He was behind a big car he couldn't see through or over, he waited with his acceleration and was caught in a bungee cord effect as he was catching up. It takes a lot of experience to avoid that kind of positions, but I think that's what he's missing. However - the lady crashing into him is to blame, but as always that doesn't help at all if you're hurt.
Video removed by user
:(
aww I wanted to see that
Me too. Must have been a good one.
Damn lucky on his part - his bike was pretty much devoured
(http://www.landoverbaptist.net/images/smilies/sinner.gif)
Quote from: alfisti on February 06, 2011, 06:59:33 AM
Video removed by user
:(
Try this link - biker lands on feet after crash.flv (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XiO1cVLmAT4#normal)
Quote from: Statler on February 06, 2011, 06:14:32 AMaccidents happen. ape shit on this pregnant dog? nice. you know nothing about her except she made a mistake.
Mistakes happen. In this case the mistake happened to result in a collision. Is driving without giving due care and attention to the task an accident? I think not. Its an offence (at least where I live it is).
Quote from: Statler on February 06, 2011, 06:14:32 AMa non-life-threatening mistake.
Really? Fortunately the mistake was not fatal.
Quote from: Statler on February 06, 2011, 06:14:32 AMthe woman apologized several times and was checking to see if he was ok.... better than most.
True.
Quote from: Statler on February 06, 2011, 06:14:32 AMape shit on this pregnant dog? nice.
A little harsh, agreed. But then I doubt any of us would be feeling too kindly disposed in the circumstances. Or are you proposing the victim offer her a nice cup of tea and tell her its alright... "accidents happen"?
Go ape shit? For what? Not using basic defensive driving techniques? The moment that first car slammed on it's brakes he should have passed on the left.
I'd love to respond to a collision where you (heman) are going apeshit on an old woman.
I would have gone pants-shit on myself it that was me! Hbliam, are old ladies given special exemptions when they aren't paying attention while driving?
i'm sorry but the term "accident" is way overused by people.
"accidents" are when they are completely and totally unavoidable, sort of like you have maintained your car well and suddenly the brakes don't work, now it might not be your fault as the driver , but it is the fault of the manufacturer and is not "an accident" for them, its poor quality control and they should be held responsible.
but how many "accidents" are due to manufacturer defects, and how many are due to user error? i would guess user error is probalby causing more "accidents" than a manufacturer defect. but hey i could be wrong.
personaly in my book there is no "old" exemption from being responsible, everyone should be responsible in my book, but hey we all have different opinions.
Everyones got their own opinion on what they would do/wouldn't do.
Maybe ape shit isnt the right term. But knowing my self, you better no touch me after something like that. Its my natural body response to get the make the beast with two backs away from the driver. call it waht you want, but to see that happen, stare at the driver, have her walk up to me and try to touch me is a big no no. In my eyes, Ive already identifed you as the bad guy. You just tried to hurt me. Regardless of it being a mistake or not. The severity of it hasnt allowed me to really realize what the make the beast with two backs is going on.
you touch me, dont expect me not to push you violently away from me and start asking what the make the beast with two backs were you thinking?
Quote from: Statler on February 06, 2011, 06:14:32 AM
accidents happen. the woman apologized several times and was checking to see if he was ok.... better than most.
ape shit on this pregnant dog? nice. you know nothing about her except she made a mistake. a non-life-threatening mistake.
Non life threatening mistake? The outcome of it was non life threatening, the mistake itself was pretty life threatening. Apologies don't make up for bad driving.In a situation like this, Sorry doesn't mean anything, even if it comes from the heart. you could have the best intentions, but the reality is she had a complete lack of situation awareness when making that "maneuver".
Quote from: hbliam on February 06, 2011, 09:22:29 PM
Go ape shit? For what? Not using basic defensive driving techniques? The moment that first car slammed on it's brakes he should have passed on the left.
I'd love to respond to a collision where you (heman) are going apeshit on an old woman.
Watch the video again. Left side was not a good choice. Especially when a lot of people tend to burst out from their lane when stopped. and if you watched closely the car taht rear ended him wasnt in his lane, she came from the left lane.
Quote from: Grappa on February 06, 2011, 10:02:35 PM
Hbliam, are old ladies given special exemptions when they aren't paying attention while driving?
Will she be found at fault? Sure. Do you need to scream or "go apeshit" on a elderly woman? Never.
Quote from: He Man on February 07, 2011, 12:16:17 AM
Watch the video again. Left side was not a good choice. Especially when a lot of people tend to burst out from their lane when stopped. and if you watched closely the car taht rear ended him wasnt in his lane, she came from the left lane.
I've been riding over 30 years and live in the State where splitting is legal. I know how to ride in traffic. The left side was the perfect choice. A soon as the vehicle in front began to slow a quick movement to the left would have taken him clear of all the crap to follow. Watching the video there is at least a four count before the next vehicle passes on the left. The moto could have changed lanes in half of one count.
I am sort of like you when I get hurt. I don't want to talk to anyone for a minute or two. I may even ask someone a bit less frail WTF they were thinking. Not someone's Mom/Grandma. People can disagree all they want.
Quote from: sbrguy on February 06, 2011, 11:05:49 PMi'm sorry but the term "accident" is way overused by people.
+1.
Quote from: hbliam on February 06, 2011, 09:22:29 PM
Go ape shit? For what? Not using basic defensive driving techniques? The moment that first car slammed on it's brakes he should have passed on the left.
OK so going "ape shit" is inappropriate..... but that the rider got rammed from behind by a driver doing something other that paying complete attention is NOT the riders fault. So yeah, yeah, we get the "be nice to old ladies" message - doesnt change the fact that kindly intentions or not she destroyed his ride and could so easily have caused serious injury or death. Get her off the make the beast with two backsing road please officer :-*.
Quote from: hbliam on February 07, 2011, 01:02:38 AMWill she be found at fault? Sure.
I should bloody hope so too [thumbsup].
Quote from: hbliam on February 07, 2011, 01:02:38 AMDo you need to scream or "go apeshit" on a elderly woman? Never.
Agreed.
I can't see the vid!!
Use this..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XiO1cVLmAT4
One person commented and said to remove it because insurance is not going to take your side. I don't get that. He did nothing wrong. Switching to the left or right is risky if you don't already know the lanes are clear. So he stopped, looks like he is checking the right to move there and got hit. He didn't slam on his brakes or anything.
I would of done the same thing and just moved to the side to sit down and get my helmet off. I would be pissed off as hell but keep my cool knowing I was not at fault. Just wait for the cop and maybe ask for her to keep her distance.
Hot damn!!! Good thing he's not injured (physically), at least from what the vid was showing. I think the guy was not at fault. The grandma was probably not paying attention to the road, and obviously at fault.
Quote from: hbliam on February 06, 2011, 09:22:29 PM
I've been riding over 30 years and live in the State where splitting is legal. I know how to ride in traffic. The left side was the perfect choice. A soon as the vehicle in front began to slow a quick movement to the left would have taken him clear of all the crap to follow. Watching the video there is at least a four count before the next vehicle passes on the left. The moto could have changed lanes in half of one count.
I am sort of like you when I get hurt. I don't want to talk to anyone for a minute or two. I may even ask someone a bit less frail WTF they were thinking. Not someone's Mom/Grandma. People can disagree all they want.
Since when was this his fault? Yes, he
should have passed on the left, but no one here was actually the rider. We can sit and speculate and say "I would have done this, or that, etc" but it happens. We can't all be perfect, otherwise no one would ever get hurt.
What if he changed to the left lane and gets nailed by another vehicle? I mean, we can't see the left lane right before and during the impact, but there's a chance the next vehicle would have nailed him. In fact, another vehicle passes by the instant we get a clear view of the left lane.
The guy's alive, let's not try to make the guy feel any worse about the situation. My heart broke when I saw the bike devoured.
(http://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash1/hs796.ash1/168631_1869127450638_1314642574_2186351_2906785_n.jpg)
my boss made a lil crashy yesterday
The motorcyclist could have gone to either the right or left as there was plenty of room on both sides; however, there wasn't any immediate need to...the cars in front didn't do an emergency type of stop, they just stopped from traffic or something. The motorcyclist shouldn't have had to worry about the car behind him not being able to stop in time.
I probably would have passed on the left since traffic was moving in that lane, but I don't see how the motorcyclist can be faulted in the least for not riding "safely". Bottom line, the old lady behind him wasn't paying attention and hit him. He's a lucky guy to walk away from that, and he'll probably remember to check his mirrors while stopping now. I wouldn't have went "apeshit" on her either, especially since she was abviously concerned about how he was. That's not giving her a pass for anything, but concern goes a long way and she was probably pretty shook up as is. I'm guessing she'll pay more attention in the future.
I never said the moto rider would be found "at fault". I said he should have passed on the left and went on his merry way. Basic moto riding skills.
Quote from: 671M900 on February 07, 2011, 05:23:50 AM
What if he changed to the left lane and gets nailed by another vehicle? I mean, we can't see the left lane right before and during the impact, but there's a chance the next vehicle would have nailed him. In fact, another vehicle passes by the instant we get a clear view of the left lane.
You can see the left lane is clear the entire time.
How hard? About as hard as any other wreck, whether it is your fault or not, where you go through the normal post-crash cycle
Holy shit, what just happened?
How... what... where?
Wait, am I injured? Blood? Pain?
I am going to walk around aimlessly for a couple minutes while bullet time wears off, and my brain reboots...
You could insert scream at the person you hit you because you are still rattled and scared shitless. In the case of an elderly woman, I hope I would have the presence of mind not to. And not because she didn't "deserve it", but because I will feel like a total asshole afterwards.
Quote from: bobspapa on February 07, 2011, 08:54:50 AM
(http://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash1/hs796.ash1/168631_1869127450638_1314642574_2186351_2906785_n.jpg)
my boss made a lil crashy yesterday
Damn. :o
Quote from: il d00d on February 07, 2011, 10:42:55 AM
How hard? About as hard as any other wreck, whether it is your fault or not, where you go through the normal post-crash cycle
Holy shit, what just happened?
How... what... where?
Wait, am I injured? Blood? Pain?
I am going to walk around aimlessly for a couple minutes while bullet time wears off, and my brain reboots...
You could insert scream at the person you hit you because you are still rattled and scared shitless. In the case of an elderly woman, I hope I would have the presence of mind not to. And not because she didn't "deserve it", but because I will feel like a total asshole afterwards.
you cant help natural instincts. I dont like any stranger putting their hands on me, let alone someone who just totally rear ended me out of no where cause they couldnt judge distances.
If i was in a car, it would be a totally different story. You just dont have the, Oh shit did u just try to kill me???? mentality if u get rear ended in a car, id just be annoyed more than anything.
Quote from: hbliam on February 07, 2011, 10:01:59 AM
I never said the moto rider would be found "at fault". I said he should have passed on the left and went on his merry way. Basic moto riding skills.
I love armchair quarterbacks.
Kidding.
Quote from: hbliam on February 07, 2011, 10:01:59 AM
I never said the moto rider would be found "at fault". I said he should have passed on the left and went on his merry way. Basic moto riding skills.
I didn't mean that he would be found at fault...rather that his choice to stay in that lane would be questioned. Poor word choice on my part there. I don't think his choice was necessarily a bad one (well, usually...obviously bad this time [cheeky]). There could be a variety of reasons why he wanted to stay in that lane, and traffic didn't jam on the brakes making it where he
should move over for safety reasons.
Quote from: He Man on February 07, 2011, 12:42:40 PM
you cant help natural instincts. I dont like any stranger putting their hands on me, let alone someone who just totally rear ended me out of no where cause they couldnt judge distances.
If i was in a car, it would be a totally different story. You just dont have the, Oh shit did u just try to kill me???? mentality if u get rear ended in a car, id just be annoyed more than anything.
Sure, and if you did end up unloading on the person who just hit you, I wouldn't fault anyone for it. Too much adrenaline pumping through the monkey parts of the brain. I just wouldn't put it on my checklist is all... [beer]
Quote from: bobspapa on February 07, 2011, 08:54:50 AM
(http://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash1/hs796.ash1/168631_1869127450638_1314642574_2186351_2906785_n.jpg)
my boss made a lil crashy yesterday
Holy shit! Glad my Gixxers don't look like that! :o Damn, I hope he's OK. [popcorn]
DAMNN
I may need to get a video camera to record rides in case shit like this ever happens to me.
To everyone arguing about going "apeshit" I can tell you that if some person who was clearly at fault and not paying attention almost killed me I would NOT be worried about being nice. I'm a nice person, but when someone almost kills me formality goes out the window.
I've sat on the sidelines for the first part of this to see how big an asshat I am, but I was involved in an amplified version of this several years ago.
Two friends, one on a CB750 and the other on a CB1000, and I, on my new Honda NT650 (Hawk), pulled up to a stoplight just north of Dalton, Ga. Ten or twelve seconds later a car collected the three of us from behind and totalled all three bikes. I remember waking up on the opposite side of the intersection in a ditch and hearing nothing but crying. Before I could even take inventory to see whether I was badly hurt or not, all I could hear was a female crying because "They're going to take my license".
Without thinking, I remember shouting "Will you please shut the f^@k up?", which elicited even more waterworks and louder crying.
Turns out the driver of the car was a 16 year old female who had just gotten her license that day. She was driving in excess of the posted limit, with her mother in the passenger seat, brushing her hair whilst driving, and didn't even know we were there until she hit us. No brakes. No nothing.
At least the lady in this video was more worried about the rider than herself, unlike the idiot that hit us. I was the first of the three of us to regain consciousness and still remember she was worried more about her license than whether or not she had killed three people.
When the deputy sheriff showed up to investigate she had the audacity to tell him that she thought we were going to run the light and she was going to run it with us. Another motorist who had been driving next to her told the deputy he saw her brushing her hair whilst looking in the mirror on the back of her sun visor. To me, the lack of skid marks before impact tells the truth of the matter.
I say scream away. Anyone who nearly kills you has no right to expect civility.
i think if nothing else this video shows us that everyone including us should tell everyone we know that they MUST pay attention 100% of the time when driving.
there is no "multitasking" when you drive, its called 100% of your focus should be driving and being aware of your situation the road. there is no excuse for giving anything less since you are handling what equates to as one of the most dangerous things you can do in your life.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2BccVeAurI&feature=player_embedded&has_verified=1&oref=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fverify_age%3Fnext_url%3Dhttp%253A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%253Fv%253De2BccVeAurI%2526feature%253Dplayer_embedded# (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2BccVeAurI&feature=player_embedded&has_verified=1&oref=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fverify_age%3Fnext_url%3Dhttp%253A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%253Fv%253De2BccVeAurI%2526feature%253Dplayer_embedded#)
+1!!! My family owns a trucking company and I worked there for 14+ years. I was the company rep for all lawsuits both cargo and vehicle accident related. I can tell you for a fact that cage drivers do at least as badly around 18 wheelers as they do around scooters. It's a damn fact!! >:( You wouldn't believe the shit I saw! I saw enough vehicle related deaths to last me and all of you a lifetime. :P And my standard line was always "well, if you have more than 4 wheels on the ground then it was obviously your fault"! It was ALWAYS the truck drivers fault no matter if the cage driver was driving drunk!!! It happened!!! My insurance carrier settled on a claim where the guy was drunk on rum and cokes while delivering newspapers and ran into the back of our trailer and broke both of his legs! Our truck/trailer was parked at a construction site for delivery in front of a security guard with traffic cones out and with safety flashers on!!! THEY SETTLED!!!!
Point is driving is not a secondary option. It is your one and only priority. Just like riding your bike. I have always said that ALL cage drivers should ride a motorcycle for at least 6 months before they are ever allowed to drive a car/truck. I'm sure it would cut down on over half of the distracted driver related accidents.
To answer the original question... pretty damn hard. So props to the guy that got hit for not killing the old lady
Quote from: Punx Clever on February 07, 2011, 08:01:42 PM
To answer the original question... pretty damn hard. So props to the guy that got hit for not killing the old lady
Haha. Best answer yet.
Quote from: hbliam on February 07, 2011, 10:03:44 AM
You can see the left lane is clear the entire time.
Maybe the left lane was about to turn into a "Left Turn Only" lane and he wanted to continue straight?
Dude did nothing wrong, armchair quarterback it all ya`ll want. Shit happens, and he got lucky.
Quote from: wbeck257 on February 08, 2011, 07:36:55 AM
Maybe the left lane was about to turn into a "Left Turn Only" lane and he wanted to continue straight?
Dude did nothing wrong, armchair quarterback it all ya`ll want. Shit happens, and he got lucky.
i dont see how people are saying the the left lane is clear either...
time line of video:
0.06: starts braking due to suv in front hitting brakes hard
0.07: full stop
0.08: car seen passing left lane
0.08: car hit him from behind
0.14: view of line of cars behind probably stopped due to the accident, note car in right lane too, probably hit the brakes and stopped there due to the accident.
i personally cant see how the rider could have done anything different... he couldnt go left, a car was right behind him on his left, there was a car on the right where he probably could have made a slightly dangerous cut to the right... in this case, i'd say the safest option is normally stop. he had approximately 2 seconds to notice that the car behind him was not going to stop in time and had to notice this while dealing with a unexpected and sudden stop from the cars ahead of him. to see how sudden the stop was, check out how much the suv in front of the rider pitches forward and rocks back on it's suspension.
if he was at a dead stop at a light and was checking his mirrors, then yes, he might have been able to avoid it. but in that situation, i dont think there are many people that would have been able to safely react fast enough to avoid everything. in that two seconds he would have had to check both mirrors to see if there was a clear lane and then determine if the cars moving behind him were far enough away to cut in without causing another accident which would have been his fault.
This is how i see it.
the left lane was a better choice of a lane, however it was not an escape lane, not at that speed and distance.
in NYC, people tend to stop dead cold and burst out of their lane if they see that either side is clear. if u gunned it to the left and the car came out at you, you would of rear ended someone else.
Like i said before, basic motorcycling 101 is built up of ur own life experiences. there is no rule to safe riding other then pay attention. People in jersey and NY HATE motorcyclist and you have to react differently due to that.
Quote from: He Man on February 08, 2011, 12:53:52 PM
in NYC, people tend to stop dead cold and burst out of their lane if they see that either side is clear. if u gunned it to the left and the car came out at you, you would of rear ended someone else.
yeah, thats why i almost never lane split in the city cept at red lights... the taxis are the ones that'll kill you asap... and anyone with a MA plate. haha
and yeah, the other thing that makes the situation even harder to read is the fact that the suv in front of him with those tinted windows basically blocked all forward view. no real idea of what could have been happening in front of him especially with a sudden stop like that... could have tried to speed past the car and just run into a 5 car pile up while gunning the throttle.
That video scares the crap out of me.
Quote from: strat10 on February 08, 2011, 03:31:55 PM
That video scares the crap out of me.
it should,
cars are after you. I never understood why so many people had trackbikes until after being taken out by a cager.. its crystal clear now.
A perfect example of why I am for lane splitting.
If karma was real, the old lady would have been hit by a bus when she exited her vehicle to survey the damage she had just caused.
And you'd be spontaneously punched in the face for wishing bad thoughts upon an older lady.
and youd be spontaneously punched in the balls for wishing emanon a punch in the face for wishing karma to hit the old lady with a bus. ;D
Quote from: emanon on February 10, 2011, 02:58:04 PM
If karma was real, the old lady would have been hit by a bus when she exited her vehicle to survey the damage she had just caused.
Maybe karma is real and he just jacked that bike.
Quote from: hbliam on February 10, 2011, 11:13:56 PM
Maybe karma is real and he just jacked that bike.
If that was the case he would be the one lying on the ground a broken mess ... and the bike would be fine.
Quote from: Betty on February 11, 2011, 01:15:39 AM
If that was the case he would be the one lying on the ground a broken mess ... and the bike would be fine.
[clap]
Quote from: He Man on February 10, 2011, 11:11:45 PM
and youd be spontaneously punched in the balls for wishing emanon a punch in the face for wishing karma to hit the old lady with a bus. ;D
Wait did you just wish I get punched in the balls? Gotta be careful because karma is a pregnant dog and it's going get you too. [laugh] This could be a never ending cycle of karma.