Ducati Monster Forum

was discussed off and on a bunch in Sepang 2 test (http://www.ducatimonsterforum.org/index.php?topic=46634.0) but maybe needs it's own thread finally.

Here's a marginally scientific look at it.. interesting, as usual: http://motomatters.com/analysis/2011/03/19/honda_s_magic_gearbox_worth_a_few_hundre.html (http://motomatters.com/analysis/2011/03/19/honda_s_magic_gearbox_worth_a_few_hundre.html)

That's really interesting. Looks like Ducati needs to get to work on their gearbox!

Along with still trying to tame the slithering beast.

Conservative estimates at .2 seconds/lap! Very impressive, HRC.

"...based on or very similar to the Xtrac Instantaneous Gearshift System, which allows two gears to be engaged simultaneously, while driving only one."

I'm no tranny expert, but one gear being driven while two are engaged sounds a lot like an 'automatic' transmission where hydraulic/mechanical systems do the job of the driver (using a clutch and gearshift lever)...?

That's an interesting read.

And I'm not sure what the FIM says about it, but I would assume it's still a "manual" so long as the rider has to use the lever to shift, the clutch off the line, and so forth.

^
+1

racing sure does drive innovation.

That's cool 8)

Here's a pretty good guess of what technology Honda is using: http://www.sportrider.com/news/146_1104_honda_secret_motogp_rc212v_transmission_revealed/index.html (http://www.sportrider.com/news/146_1104_honda_secret_motogp_rc212v_transmission_revealed/index.html)

Nice detective work  [thumbsup]

Mind you, the whole point of disallowing double clutch systems was to keep costs down. Ironically, systems like this one are now becoming the system on choice on vehicles that used to use dual clutch systems (and it's just as expensive). And without the ability to handle downshifts under power or upshifts under engine breaking, I see an issue with using this on the street...

I wish Dorna would make up it's mind and either make an "unlimited" (except perhaps for weight, displacement and engine type) class where anything else goes.

Still, kudos to Honda for stretching the rules  ;D

Odd that they're patenting racing equipment.

But back in the day when I was at Yamaha R&D, I saw lots of wacky stuff that Honda patented.

This looks a lot like a revision of a Hodaka trans from 40 years ago.  :P

Maybe that says something about eliminating specific technologies for the reason of cost?  Teams tend to adopt even more expensive alternatives.

Yeah, there's a story from the '70s that when the AMA outlawed aluminum swing-arms due to the cost, some team simply went out and built a titanium swingarm  :o

Someone on another list wondered if the Honda design makes it difficult/nearly impossible to push start after a crash...?

there was a quote somewhere that said it does require 2 people to push start it after shut-off in that kind of event...

http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2011/Apr/110403rydernotes2.htm (http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2011/Apr/110403rydernotes2.htm)


modified for to take names out to not spoil anything....

Yeah, the rider in question was whining about mentioning the need for "two pins to push", post-race  ;D

http://moto-racing.speedtv.com/article/motogp-burgess-honda-gearbox-not-rocket-science/ (http://moto-racing.speedtv.com/article/motogp-burgess-honda-gearbox-not-rocket-science/)




 :P

Oz in "pin heads"?   [evil]  Hoho...Casey had better not need marshalling help in the future

so....due to the Jerez debacles/learning experience with bump starting the new system...you think they'll develop some sort of engagement system like the old compression releases for 2-strokes with a doohickey and a lever and a whachamajigger to make some sort of thingamabob dual pin release for those rare occasions....

Hard to believe Honda didn't think of that from the get go.

I don't think you really plan on crashing and restarting a race.

Wet race crashes are slower speed so you see a lot of guys try to remount, but the majority of dry track crashes result in a bike that is too banged up to rejoin, so restarting is irrelevant.

and most of the time in a crash if the bike is still running the riders scramble to get it turned off asap.  engines being limited 'n all.

if you look at the idea of how the stuff is clutching throught he counter shaft, its not really that different in a way from amazingly.....

internally geared bicycle hubs, those things have as many as 6-8 speed in them the shimano internally geared ones, granted this is with planetary gears, but the idea of clutching and enganging certain gears using a sort of sliding shaft system on an internal shaft is really done with bicycles not in a way.

its not 100% the same thing but you can definitely see where honda may have drawn inspiration from to make this new transmission design.

then again, remember honda literally files 100s of applications a year on different things, many of them will never see the light of day, and also who knows if this patented thing is even in the race bike, for all we know the race bike could have something totally different inside it.

for example the new vfr dual clutch trnasmission, honda/suzuki/yamaha have been filing patents on dual clutch motorcycles for at least the last 6-8 years and only finally just came out with something now.  trust me i know. [laugh]

http://www.motorcyclenews.com/MCN/sport/sportresults/MotoGP/2011/April/apr1511-honda-angered-by-illegal-clutch-rumours/ (http://www.motorcyclenews.com/MCN/sport/sportresults/MotoGP/2011/April/apr1511-honda-angered-by-illegal-clutch-rumours/)