Ducati Monster Forum

I'm considering a PC3 (was great on my previous bike) but I've read so so reviews for the S2R. Apparently it's a given that one should get a custome tune if they plan on buying a PC3. I have no problem shelling the $ for a custome tune but unfortunately there are no good shops in my area. The few I found on PC's website got mixed reviews...

So my question is, for those who have gotten their bikes custom tuned, would you be willing to share your map? Is that even allowed?  If not, I may just go with the DP ecu seeing how PC3 + custom dyno tune is more than the DP ecu..

that's a good question for the professional wrenchers on here.  i just had my bike dynoed (full arrows and pciii) and it runs INSANE.  i'd be happy to share the map but 1. i don't have it  2. no idea if i did if that would piss off the guy that spent 6 hours creating it (although it was on my dime).  not sure what the protocol is for that . . .

I don't see why it would not be allowed.  The owner paid to have the map done for them.  I would think that gives them the right to share it.  Now though, if someone shelled out $$$ to get it done why would they want to share it.  Nice guy/girl maybe?

Would you really want someone else's custom map?  I mean unless your set up is EXACTLY the same, it probably won't run right.

I ran a open airbox, full arrow exhaust map on my bike.  My bike has open airbox, DP midpipe, race Termi slip ons.  Similar set up, not the same.  Bike didn't run good at all.   I had a custom map done and bike runs damn near perfect now.


uglyducky - You have the map you just need to pull it off the Power Commander.  Probably a good idea to do anyways so you have a backup if anything goes wrong with your Power Commander.

You should talk to Sony/Apple...and a laundry list of others that believe even though you own the product they own the rights to it.

i.e. jailbreaking apple software/playstation firmware. <- things I should be able to do with my product, but will certainly get you sued in todays system.


I agree though, should be able to share your maps. Lots of people on here have similar/same setups. Could work well.

I got a custom map for an 05 s2r800 w/ spark exhaust + spark udder eliminator + open box + light flywheel.

I don't recall any agreement being presented stating I can't share a map I had paid for to have made or made myself.

Hey uglyducky,

What type of airbox are you running?

Thanks, I guess my question was really two-fold, 1) is it allowed (whether that's regulated by moderators here), or even a higher power and 2) would the owner be opposed?

Like I said I don't mind spending the dime, it's just there are no good tuners around me. Thus it might even help the owner to share his map b/c I'd be willing to subsidize his cost. I understand that every bike IS different but I think it's safe to also say that most of us do the same / similar mods.

If you or anyone is willing please let me know. I plan on making a decision of DP ecu vs PC 3 very shortly, and unless someone is willing to share it looks like I'll be going the DP route. My specs: 06 S2R 800 with Marving pipe, aftermarket slip-ons, and open air box (using stock paper filter).

PM me your email addy, and I'll let you try mine out if you want.  We've/I've shared maps here in the past, and it hasn't been an issue.

On a non-02 bike, unless the DP ECU does something other than a new map such as raise the redline, the PC3 should yield better results with a proper map.

The guy that use do my maps ran a DP ecu and a PC3 on his 749.  The DP ECU was just there for the higher redline.

Very cool of you. Seems like we have same mods minus the flywheel. Speaking of flywheel, which do you have? How do you like it?

Obviously I havent gotten my PC yet but this made my decision easier! I'll surely paypal you after I've gotten myself set up...

Sent!

I got the Nichol's flywheel. I like it. Revs like a bat outta hell.  Would I do it again...not too sure.  I like the idea of a lightened steel piece being more durable, but the Nichol's piece is just so light.  One thing that sold me on the Nichol's is that they're local, and that's who does any work on the bike that I'm too lazy to do.

Thanks, got your email. Will hit you back as soon as I get my stuff in order. Need to determine which slip-ons, Quat D or Arrow... then order/install the PC3.

Umm. No, jailbreaking your iphone is legal. As declared by US courts. Just like you can modify your bike. However, should you use your jailbroken PS3 to download and play pirated games, it's illegal. Just like should you use your bike, modified or not, to commit a crime.

Also, don't expect apple/sony/ducati to cover anything you've touched/modified.

As long as you don't sue Dynojet when your bike gets damaged because you  made an improper tune, you can do whatever you want with the maps, I'm sure. It's like saying I can't share pictures I've made with ms paint, or you can't back up and save anything ever recorded on  your answering machine.

open box with K&N.  and i'm happy to share my map with anyone that wants it if you guys can walk me through how the hell i access it.  2005 S4R with full arrows, PCIII, and open box.  Runs like a pissed off dragon right now, but a contained, pissed off dragon.  happy to pass it along . . .

Next time you're in, I can get the map off of it.  ;)

I would LOVE to have that map UG (and Speeddog).  I'm going to be opening up my airbox soon.  Once I do that, I'll have the exact set-up that you have.  Right now my airbox is closed, so I'm running the map that you can get from Dynojet's website.

Thanks guys!

cool,
problem solved.  i need speeddog to have a look at a faulty low fuel light so, when i'm there we'll get you that map. 

^this

Take two S4RS Monsters with different mileages from different parts of the country for example, exact same intake/exhaust on both. PCIII and dyno them. Two identical bikes with identical equipment.

They will have different tuning parameters, because of their differing baselines. Say one is running different compression numbers than the other, a very plausible scenario. Not only plausible but highly likely. One's had a recent valve check and found to be merely in spec while the other had a tedious valve adjustment performed with zero closing shim clearance - perfect. One's cams are off by a degree from the factory (commonplace). Both had the throttle bodies synchronized, but by different people with differing levels of perfectionist tendencies. A fuel injector on one has a spray pattern that's slightly irregular, nothing noticeable by the rider.

These are some of the reasons why you should go and get your own map. If one could swap maps between bikes like that and have it come out consistently, then everybody's dyno sheets would all look the same since a lot of mods are common between these bikes. As it stands every dyno sheet is different, because every bike is different, even if the bikes are the same. Some bikes inherently run better than others, and this is fact. This is due to inherent miniscule differences that add up in the end.

This is not to say the bike won't run. It just won't run as it would if it were optimized for your machine, which is the whole point of a custom map.

Get the engine baselined to the best of your ability, then trailer it to a good dyno shop and have your PCIII mapped. Using somebody else's parameters is imprecise and won't necessarily translate well to your bike regardless if your bike and mods are identical.

There's a very very small chance it'll be perfect...almost impossible.  Being close would be a success if you were to ask me.

It's free, why not.  If it doesn't work remove the map.  No harm, no foul.  Find a Dyno at that point.

Would I use some elses map...Nope.  Would I sit there and try to tune it myself...Nope.  But that's me.  

Maybe someone should ask why do they offer maps on the Power commander web site then?  [cheeky]

They offer the canned maps for people who just want to get close and don't care about that extra bit of perfection. These are the people who live hundreds of miles away from a Dynojet place or just don't want the trouble or expense. It also allows Dynojet to sell more PCIIIs, by claiming a 'plug & play' retrofit. It works fine, but for best results you need to get it tuned on a dyno.

For my part, I'm not sure a PCIII is worth the $300 or so if it's not tuned for my bike. I don't understand the point of having the capability if it's not going to be put to use. It's like using a sniper rifle to shoot paper targets @ 50 yards. Why not dial it in so it's tight all the way out to 1,000?

A DP ECU realistically speaking is all an S2R800 needs, providing the rest of the bike is tuned and running the way it's supposed to run; valves, cams, & throttles set accordingly. With a DP ECU, dialing the mechanicals in properly will do more to eliminate flat spots & smooth the power curve out than not dialing anything in, leaving it factory (very rare to have the valves & cams set dead-on from the factory) and masking the out-of-wackness with a piggyback PCIII device and tuning it on a dyno. Most people don't go that route. I always say that a PCIII is a fine gimmick as long as all the other bases have been covered beforehand.
 
Nobody's going to get a huge power increase out of an S2R800 & PCIII without major engine work anyway. If you just want to smooth out the power curve in my opinion you can do that by tuning and adjusting the mechanical aspects of the valvetrain, a school of thought a lot of people surprisingly don't appreciate. Again, these bikes commonly come from the factory well off-baseline just because Ducati knows nobody seriously races them and doesn't care to apply the resources necessary to ensure perfect spec from the factory. They're Italians not Germans, and they commonly drink on their lunch breaks.
 
If you go with the PCIII, why not run a canned map from the website or somebody else's map, it definitely won't harm anything and won't cost you a dime. I'd probably do the same anyway. If it doesn't provide that night & day improvement you expect, or the result is somehow anticlimactic in some way, I'll bet dollars to donuts you will be up at night thinking about where to get the thing tuned.

empirically speaking, i do have to agree that my bike runs better than any other i've ridden (and i've ridden many in the sss monster class) and truly was worth the time and $$ of getting it dyno'd.  i can see what bergdoerfer is saying and it seems totally feasible and makes sense. 

Just for arguments sake:

Wouldn't running a DP ecu w/o a termi exhaust be similar to running a canned map or a map from another bike with similar mods?  Parts not tuned for each other either way.

Each bike is different, but the DP ecu is the same for the model range.

The OP doesn't seem to have a termi exhaust so the DP map will not be tuned for that...just like a canned or shared PC3 map.

I'm not saying sharing a map will yield the best results, but regardless of the results, it'll be a learning experience that "should" have little consequence that will be reversible.

With all arguments aside, yes the dyno will yield the best results.  Even after getting a custom map, I brought it back a second time with more mods for even better results.

Yes, a DP ECU is fixed canned map. That's what I have.

I'm saying get a PCIII if you want. But do yourself a favor and baseline your bike then visit the dyno, don't just slap the thing in there and use a canned map derived from some other bike. That other bike probably ran better than yours to begin with, and the parameters used to tune it could be nonoptimal for your machine.

The difference could mean several net horsepower & torques and no jaggy lines on the sheet. Isn't that what people buy a PCIII for to begin with, for performance?

Or just get a PCV with the autotune feature.   :)

Usually, yes.
And that's a bit of a shame.

Because when used properly, it can dramatically improve rideability, which is what most folks need.

anyone have experience with the S2Rs and hyperstacks and PC3?