So a couple weeks ago, ML and I put a new clutch my ST.
I replaced the OEM basket/plates/springs with 20K on them with the Barnett set-up. I still running the stock pressure plate and do not have an open clutch cover. This is touring hog not a show queen. ;)
Life happened and I wasn't able to test ride right away.
B took it out for a ride last week in preparation for our trip to Vintage Days and noticed the clutch does not fully disengage. After some searching here; we bled the clutch and saw little improvement.
Next we removed all of the barnett springs and put the old ones back on and saw a little improvement, but not enough. So we took off two springs. This gave an even greater improvement.
800 miles later the clutch still feels the same.
So what gives....Where should we start trouble shooting?
It seems the issue is that the Barnett pack is thicker than the OEM set-up.
Can we replace the barnett flat plates (non-friction) with the OEM we took out?
Could it an issue with the stock pressure plate?
Any suggestions?
i read about this one time.. maybe in tech or on the other forum...
a good search should find it, but someone else had this issue IIRC
1ST...I can say, I do not like the engaged feel of the Barnett clutch and I think it is do to some combination of their friction plates or steel's....not exactly sure what it is, but I just think it feels spongy and slippy...
2nd...my co-worker experienced the same/similar condition and assessed the slave and all kinds of things, when in the end it seems the dealer that stocked and sold the clutch to him then admitted that it is mostly a repeated feeling with their clutch pack sets as to how they seem to be designed, though he did advice to make sure the spring steels were in order correctly in the stack before condemning the product altogether...so that could potentially be a part of the issue...
Ducati dry clutches will work correctly with a stack height of about 1.48"-1.52".
That's with flat steels, not sure about with a belleville (cone shaped) steel.
I've not had good luck with the Barnett wet clutches, likely that's what Raux was referencing.
Thanks for the replies.
I have checked and rechecked the stack order and # of plates.
I was just going through the old stack on my glass coffee table (flatest surface available to me) and noticed all of the plates are dead flat. The barnett pack came with a "curved" plate that was put in the middle of the stack, as instructed. Could this plate be the issue?
curved OEM plates will have a punch mark on one of the 'teeth'
It's very unusual for a Duc clutch not to have one.
I had a similar problem with my Barnett clutch which I fixed by very lightly sanding the tabs on the steel plates so that they moved a bit more freely in the basket. You would think this wouldn't need to be done after 800 miles though
Just went through the stack again.
None of the plates have a punch on the teeth. :-\
The plate in the order where the curved plate was placed does look like it has two punch marks (almost a v) on the friction mating surface located in line with the little indentation on the outer edge of plate. Could this be the curved plate marking?
Does it matter which direction the teethed plates face? ie. punch face vs. punch flange side.
Am I overthinking this?
Quote from: DesmoDiva on July 26, 2011, 07:04:15 PM
Thanks for the replies.
I have checked and rechecked the stack order and # of plates.
I was just going through the old stack on my glass coffee table (flatest surface available to me) and noticed all of the plates are dead flat. The barnett pack came with a "curved" plate that was put in the middle of the stack, as instructed. Could this plate be the issue?
The curved plate is what Speeddog calls the Belleville spring. It's job is to reduce gabbiness on engagement. Assuming the clutch hydraulics are properly bled and functioning properly the most likely cause is stack height. I would correct this with the OEM steels as needed as long as they are not scored, warped, badly serrated or overheated. I would keep the curved plate. If I remember correctly one of the OEMs were curved, at least when new. You didn't say how bad the problem is, but if the drag isn't too bad it will eventually break in.
Update:
Gage is correct, not enough clearance between the tabs and basket can cause drag. There is no minimum spec, max is .6mm. I guess moves freely with a little extra will work.
Stack height is good.
We are going to try rebleeding the system and taking a little off the tabs. The fit right now is still real tight between the tabs and basket.
Thanks for all the suggestions.
I'll let you know how we make out. [thumbsup]
As you remove material from the plates remember that the loose fit is what creates much of the clutch noise.
I'd tread lightly...plates generally wear as does the basket.
SloDuc just went thru the same thing with a Barnett clutch
I know he is still dealing with them
A PM to him might be the best avenue......
P.S. he put his stock plates back in and problem disappeared
As I mentioned, we very lightly filled the tabs. It seems to have helped.
Can now find neutral.
Still only running 4 springs though.
Did another 400 miles this weekend and doesn't seem too bad. [thumbsup]
Quote from: DesmoDiva on August 01, 2011, 04:55:44 PM
As I mentioned, we very lightly filled the tabs. It seems to have helped.
Can now find neutral.
Still only running 4 springs though.
Did another 400 miles this weekend and doesn't seem too bad. [thumbsup]
For some reason the barnett clutch packs are sloppily assembled with that glue all over them...
Glad it worked for you and now that they are somewhat free in the basket I would expect them to wear in faster and start clanging around as they should.