Just out of curiosity, are there any other MSF rider coaches on this site?
There's a couple - just can't think of whom presently
venomousr1993 is.
whos asking lol.
"falling or dropping the motorcycle.. or an intentional unsafe act".
you know, ive never seen anyone do an intentional unsafe act during the skills eval.
If there are any MSF rider coaches out there, maybe you have some advice for a girl I met last week. I was at a volunteer site and she approached me after seeing me enter with my helmet and told me her tale of woe...
She's fairly young -- I'd guess around 20 -- and enthusiastically wants to learn to ride. She attended an MSF rider school but they kicked her out because she dropped a bike during the first exercise -- where students are walking the bikes and learning about clutch control. She's about 4'10" - 5' tall and could only get her tippy toes down on the bike, so she had a hard time with that exercise. The school said they couldn't accommodate her with a lower bike or teach her how to ride on their bikes and refunded her payment.
She still wants to learn how to ride, possibly at a different school, but she'll have to drive 20 - 30 miles out of her way for other schools in the LA area. Anyone know a place that accommodates short women?
I'm on the east coast, so can't help with the LA local - but bike selection will be key or her. Finding a school that has 125-250 cruiser or standards will probably offer the lowest seat heights available. Something like the Virago 250 has a 27" seat height. If you or she can find out what models of bikes they use, it's easy enough to look up the seat heights.
Something like that virago is is too small for me at a long legged just shy of 6'. A friends roomie had one they asked me to ride back from the shop to their place and I couldn't do it... Bars hitting knees, couldn't shift gears it was a mess.
Im an msf coach and i have to say, there are 3 things that strike me odd about that story.
1. almost all schools (not all) use viragos or gz250's for that exact same reason. Super low seat height. She should EASILY be able to FLAT foot those bikes. Ive had sub 5 foot students, flat foot a gz250. So shes describing a school that doesnt have ANY viragos, or gz's or similar bikes? Odd. Seems theyre just throwing away business? not likely.
2. I HAVENT ever seen some counseled out ( we dont kick people out) on exercise two (friction zone). I guess its not impossible, I wasnt there. However, exercise 2 is where the person is just being introduced to the technique.. theyre not all going to be perfect.
3. dropping the motorcycle is not immediate grounds for CO.
Her version is a little suspect to me, thats all im saying . More than likely, theres more to this.
In any case, her only options are another school since they specifically stated they CANT help her and REFUNDED her money (extremely odd).
1. call another school
2. verify they have small 125 or 250 cruiser style motorcycles
3. Stay in touch with her, find out if she passed or got "counsled out" again.
fwiw, she got counseled out for a reason. I can assure you, it wasnt for dropping the bike. Students drop bikes all day long. I dont counsel out, as most RC's dont.. unless theyre becoming a danger to themselves or others. She may have been exhibing very dangerous behaviour during power walk, or part 3 riding. Crossed into the path of another student.. or lost control of the motorycle. etc etc.
Yeah thinking back on it - my wife did the BRC not so long ago and dropped her bike at least once, possibly twice early on and didn't get the flag off. One woman in her class did, but as it was relayed to me it was a safety thing really. She did have a few drops, but just had no ability to properly control the machine
You're right, she's probably not telling me the full story. If it's an embarrassing one, I probably wouldn't either ;) She did say that they didn't "kick her out" (those were my words) right away. They counseled her out of that day and said that they would try to do something for her like get her a smaller bike. But a week later they sent her an email to say they were simply refunding her money.
Thanks for examining and explaining it from a coach's perspective polivo. I was up in arms about her treatment! lol Now I'm back down to earth. I'll follow up and let you know the outcome!
Asked my wife about her experience - the woman who was out from here class had many drops, wasn't getting it - leading to degradation of teaching for the rest of the class and a safety issue violation - dropped bike away from the attention of the instructors, picked it up and rode. Instructor check of a dropped bike is a must, hence the violation.
So that woman had many stikes against her.
I must say theyre are some interesting stories about MSF courses lol. Never do get tired of hearing them though. I just got finished with a class yesterday, and am doing another tomorrow. Had one last weekend, and another this upcoming lol. I was really just curious how many of us on here are MSF instructors.
During my class there was on person COed. She was a mess. It was apparent she had either zero to none experience riding anything on 2 wheels. They offered her an even more basic class. I think she made it to the riding portion.
An even more basic class?? I dont see how the BRC could get any more basic lol.
They might start you off by sitting on a bicycle making motorcycle noises.
Quote from: duccarlos on November 19, 2012, 10:15:09 AM
They might start you off by sitting on a bicycle making motorcycle noises.
Experience with playing cards and clothes pins is a useful prerequisite.
This is just a guess. They probably suggested she/he/they sign up for private lessons. An instructur can spend as much time with you as needed before moving on to the next step.
I dropped in class going around a cone, a little too wide and hit some gravel. The instructor came over asked me if i was ok, i said yes, asked me if i wanted to go on, i said "hell yes", he said "well you know what, gettin the first one out of the way is gonna help u in the long run, now pick her up and get back in line". i did, i smiled on my way back, the group clapped and i ended up getting the 2nd highest score on final exam.
Me, too...more of a laydown than a drop....on the "panic stop in a turn" drill. Did it fine 2-3 times and on the 4th attempt I (was told that I) pulled the brakes a teensy bit too early ;D No one clapped; one hog head called me a d*ck head for holding up class for ten minutes - best part was he failed the riding test at the end :-*
Coaches were great about it; very professional and, after some paperwork and checks of the bike and my swelling calf, on we went...
Two female riders COed from my class; one 65-ish woman whose previous experience was as queen on her hubby's GoldWing, which she inherited when he passed from a heart attack a few months earlier. Other was younger but intimidated by the bike's weight, etc. compared to her mountain bike. The rest of the ladies in the class did very well - better in some cases than a few gents who had been riding for many years - old habits die hard, they say.
I dropped the bike during the cones. It was very low speed so i just picked it up and kept going. Was very embarrassed, but ended up being one of two to get a perfect score on the practical exam.
My MSF was at West Valley Occupational Center in Woodland Hills. Great Class! They did have some low seat bikes, no one should have trouble there. One person did get COed, because they continually ignored the instructors directions, intentional or not. I was REALLY not good at first, but in the end got the third best score in my group. Excellent instructors! [thumbsup]
Can a "non US Resident or Citizen" take this courses?
Quote from: Darkmonster620 on March 28, 2013, 11:53:30 PM
Can a "non US Resident or Citizen" take this courses?
I believe so. Might want to contact them: http://msf-usa.org/index_new.cfm?spl=2&action=display&pagename=RiderCourse%20Info (http://msf-usa.org/index_new.cfm?spl=2&action=display&pagename=RiderCourse%20Info)
Quote from: LowThudd on March 29, 2013, 12:26:42 AM
I believe so. Might want to contact them: http://msf-usa.org/index_new.cfm?spl=2&action=display&pagename=RiderCourse%20Info (http://msf-usa.org/index_new.cfm?spl=2&action=display&pagename=RiderCourse%20Info)
thanks
Yep. as far as I understand it you just have to be close enough (or willing to travel) and a way to pay, and any gear/bike requirements met to do a class. There's no residency or citizenship reqs.
Quote from: Slide Panda on March 29, 2013, 09:00:08 AM
Yep. as far as I understand it you just have to be close enough (or willing to travel) and a way to pay, and any gear/bike requirements met to do a class. There's no residency or citizenship reqs.
Travel, I'll do, means to pay, I have; bike, ??? [can't own since "non US Resident or Citizen"], gonna write to them in either FL or MI[near Detroit] to see what they answer . . .
Wheres it say that? I looked over the site and I'm missing it.
Oh and which class are you looking at? Their Basic Rider Course (BRC) is very basic...
Quote from: Slide Panda on March 29, 2013, 09:05:09 AM
Wheres it say that? I looked over the site and I'm missing it.
Oh and which class are you looking at? Their Basic Rider Course (BRC) is very basic...
Not in MSF, but, laws in general, can't purchase on my name and have it insured !!!
Well, would try to do ALL courses, from beginning to end, I have never had a formal "how to ride a motorcycle" class
Quote from: Darkmonster620 on March 29, 2013, 09:09:49 AM
Not in MSF, but, laws in general, can't purchase on my name and have it insured !!!
Guessing I missed something, I'm a tad confused.
Quote from: Darkmonster620 on March 29, 2013, 09:09:49 AM
Well, would try to do ALL courses, from beginning to end, I have never had a formal "how to ride a motorcycle" class
Gotcha. Well the BRC might have some things to learn then. But the first day on a bit - at least the first portion of the first on-bike day will be rather boring for you as it's *basic* operation with the assumption that someone has never operated a motorcycle before. So going over all the controls, then power walks to educated people about clutch operation etc. It's the 2nd half of that first day, then the 2nd full day on bikes where you actually are moving about regularly .
Ok . . . good to know !!!
Will inquire more regarding me "owning and insuring"
Quote from: Darkmonster620 on March 29, 2013, 09:26:06 AM
Ok . . . good to know !!!
Will inquire more regarding me "owning and insuring"
There is always renting/borrowing... there are two providers in AZ who have courses local to me... and I have a monster with frame sliders and full coverage.
http://www.motorcycletraining.com/ (http://www.motorcycletraining.com/)
http://www.ridearizonamtc.com/ (http://www.ridearizonamtc.com/)
uhm, Arizona, thanks . . .
the farthest I've been west of the Mississippi is Dallas, . . .uhm . . . could be a vacation with wife and an excuse to look for a Multi, Terrablanche design . . .uhm . . .
I will be RCing for the first time this year.
I have taken the BRC 3 times and the advanced course on 3 of my bikes.
(BRC once was for myself and 2 other times to offer moral support to friends)
Last time, the lead coach suggested I sign up to be a coach. I did 2 years ago but the local community college that hosts all of the MSF classes has had no lack of coaches. Apparently, one decided to hang up his manual and clipboard so I got the call.