Ducati Monster Forum

So, I'm fat and out of shape and it's affecting my trackdays.  As improbable as it seems, I'm now considering actually working out in order to better enjoy my motorsport hobby. [cheeky]

Issues I'd like to solve:

• Endurance - I'm not able to make it through all sessions of the day and tend to fatigue so bad around 3/4ths of the way through that I have to sit-out and/or pack it in.
• Core Strength - specifically, as it relates to me now attempting to achieve the physics improbable goal of hanging my fat ass off the bike ;D, I'm really feeling it in my thighs and core.  Additionally, because I'm still battling bad form and technique my arms, shoulders and pecs are pretty quick to go too.

I'd love to hear some pointers from you track addicts, racers, etc.  What you're doing personally, links to pro's workout routines, etc.

Well, you need to do cardio if you wanna increase endurance.  I do a lot of jogging through the canyons I live in and I suggest jogging over other cardio (elliptical, stairmaster, etc) 'cause I've never had as much success with them.

Core strength - Do some pilates.  That shit is hardcore and works the hell out of your core as it emphasizes control of your muscles.

Another thing to do is cut out liquid calories (and quit smoking dude, jesus christ - that's an obvious one).  Liquid calories are worthless and usually come with a host of other problems (like being made from bad sugars, etc) and they do nothing to hydrate you.  Also, the day before you go to the track, you should be drinking enough water so that you're peeing clear all day long.  Then, keep it up on track day and drink plenty of water at the track (you can also drink some gatorade, but don't drink gatorade exclusively as it has tons of sugar in it too).

that covers it

plus, corny as it may sound, do some yoga.  this (http://www.poweryoga.com/) is not steeped in see-the-light bs and is hands down the best workout i've ever had.  and it's a) donation based, so not very expensive and b) walking distance from you.

also, the 4th street stairs.

Oh god.  I used to run those 3 sets, 4x a week.  Those are killers.  And they will have you throwing up the first time you try it ;)

we had a "super macho" guy in our office when i worked on the air force base. we took him to sand dune park over on rosecrans for lunch one day and told him he couldn't run to the top.

he was talkin a lot of shit to us in front of the hot chicks at the bottom before he took off runnning. he made it about halfway up before he lost his stride, then took a couple steps sideways, then gave up and stumbled back down....

...THEN he got "the look" on his face. hurled two meals worth right in front of the same hot chicks.

gawd that still makes me laugh.  [laugh]

not the guy, but this'll give you an idea of what he was up against:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=Z9iY6X5-SFU

if a trip down and up is a rep, i used to go there and do 20 reps.  moving but definitely not running.

probably couldn't do 5 right now.  ;)

yeah a rep is a run up and down. Full speed.

f that.

I've got a pedal-bike and I'm working on getting out on that to do my cardio.  I've never had good results with jogging/running.

Pilates? hrmm

I've been working on both eliminating soda and smoking. [thumbsup]  Thanks for the heads up on the day before, I certainly hadn't thought of that before.  At the track I take in a lot of water and just a few small bottles of gatorade.  Over the course of the day it's >1gal of water and 2-4 small (20oz) gatorades.

it's good to be moving, but you really gotta get your heart rate up for effective cardio.


most people's big problems with running is trying to go too long/far at the beginning. starting this week, i'm alternating between a biking day and running 1 mile, walking 3. my goal is to work back up to the 4.5 miles a day i used to run.


..or yoga. both will kick your ass, and not just in a "look i can turn myself into a pretzel" way. you'll feel like you spent an hour at the gym lifting weights after a good yoga/pilates workout.

gm2 is right, find a yoga that isn't all ohm and spiritual. power yoga, bikram, etc.


if you cut out sodas altogether, you'll be amazed how quickly you lose the taste for it. water will be your "go to drink" just about everywhere you go.

heh.  In a past life we bet this totally un-athletic PA that she couldn't make it up and down in 5 minutes (she got winded crossing the street.  not fat, not out of shape, just plain not active).  Somehow I got suckered into joining her while we were at the stairs.  Wearing flip flops and with 0 conditioning or preparation, I ran them 2 at a time.  [roll]  I didn't puke, but I don't think I could stand or walk without pain for about a week. [laugh]

I might get to running, but for now I'm feeling like some cardio is better than none.  Beside what you mentioned, running bugs me because of the high impact and boredom/aimlessness.  At my current state, a modest pace bike ride is pretty effective at getting a sweat on and my heart rate up.


I think I'm going to grab some of the poweryoga dvds and get started at home, to reduce my embarassment factor.  [cheeky]  This isn't the first endorsement of that studio i've heard [thumbsup]


I've managed it a few times in the past, but then slipped back into drinking them way too often again.  I'd like to make it stick.

i understand the sentiment.. but you should just go to this one.  in the entry level classes there are all walks of life.. and size  ;)

i used to stop mid-class all the time too, early on.  people often stop and leave.

it's zero pressure.  try to get bryan the first time you go.. really good teacher.  he keeps it light and entertaining while (duh) getting you to the right stuff.

DVDs at home definitely will not get you anywhere near the experience/reward.  tho of course if you actually did em at home it wouldn't be a bad thing...

I'm enjoying reading this while sipping my black cherry vodak, my thighs still screaming from Track Day LAST THURSDAY :P
I gotta do something...
I actually gave up soft drinks a while back. I now have maybe 2 a month. Don't miss them.
They're right about yoga- it'll kick your butt, but you need a teacher for guidance. Doesn't do you any good at all if you're doing it wrong.

Let's all make a pact [laugh]

I usually do spinning classes 2-4 days a week(hour long class) and 30min to 1hr of weights 3-4 days a week. Ive always done weights even before i was riding, just started doing the spinning cause my suit was getting a little tight. I like the spinning classes a lot, low impact and intense. Easy to stay motivated and keep up the heart rate. Just cutting the bad stuff out of your diet will help a lot. Your workouts will be a lot more effective if you can cut out alchol, none, nada zip, not even one beer. And stop smoking.

Also better riding technique has helped me a lot. I used to feel like ive been doing squats all day. My legs were shot after 3/4 of a day. I started to relax and keep my weight on the seat and not all on my inside leg. Dont know if thats proper or recommended, but it has helped me a lot.

Cycling FTW.   [thumbsup]

I started up on the bicycle for similar reasons--I don't have a weight problem--kind of the opposite.  However, I'm pretty small and tossing a 400 lb. bike around all day on the track is a lot for me.  My endurance was crap and my legs would be on fire after 3 sessions.  I'd spend the last half of every day just trying to get through it instead of having a good time and getting faster.  I got so tired one time that I just let the bike fall over in the pit.  Yeah.  That tired.  Pathetic.   [roll]

That was a couple of years ago, and the work is definitely paying off.  Now that I don't have to battle fatigue so early in the day my times are dropping on the motorcycle dramatically.  I've found that the regular workouts teach you to breath properly and manage your heartrate also.  Simply doing something physical regularly makes the few trackdays that I do feel like less of a shock to my mind and body.  I've come to enjoy the cycling a lot--so much that I've signed up for my first century (100 miles) ride in August.  I've got three trackdays after that--a couple hundred miles on the moto in a day is going to feel like a Sunday cruise!  [moto]

I'm sure a lot of the fatigue you are feeling at the track is just from "processing" and focus...
And yes the excersice and diet will help.  Every body has given good advice, so good luck.  Persoanlly, I could run all day and night, but I hate the stationary bike at my gym.   I force myself to do it.  Maybe I should get a mountainbike.

Perfect Pushup ;D .... Seriously though for 40 bucks this lil tool is no joke. its all about the core muscles.
That and a healthy diet will go a long way. track days (or US rides) will ware you out real fast, a good diet will fuel your brain much longer than McD's breakfast sandwich. when your focus starts to fade, you have to work harder which will accelerate fatigue.

Liposuction and cocaine FTW  ;D

Lots of good advice here.  [thumbsup] I gave up my daily donut at work in the morning, and cut back to almost no beer, and it has made a big difference. I lost almost 10 pounds by doing those two things. Then again I have a stupid high metabolism.

I'll add another perspective that helped me a lot for racing. Relaxing! Seriously, my laptimes are so much faster now that I've learned to relax. There are some things that I've done to help that.

Earplugs....I can't say enough good things about wearing earplugs. It cuts out the wind noise, and helps you to stay relaxed and focused.

Mouthguard....Man this one really makes a difference. No more cotton mouth, and no more stress from clenching my teeth. And, it reduces the chances of concussions. That's why it's required in some sports. You can purchase these from sporting goods stores, and follow instructions on fitting them to your teeth. (involves boiling it first)

Tape over Speedo....This may only apply to the real fast tracks like B.I.R. but not looking at your speedo will keep you from getting scared of your speed. Put a piece of Ductape on it and write "RELAX" on it. My home track has two corners where it's WOT all the way through in top gear. When on a middleweight bike or bigger, you don't want to look at your speed as your tipping into the turn at 170 mph!

Water.....as mentioned before, gotta do it!

Diet....On race weekends, I just eat high protein and high energy foods. I've got a pretty good diet normally so this is not a stretch for me. I do load up on Cliff Bars during racing. One of my sponsors supplies those so that's a no-brainer.

Resting....I just sit and rest between races as much as possible. I try block out everything and just relax. Then when it's time to race, I'm calm and ready to go.

I know it's not directly related to fitness but being relaxed will make you go faster, and conserve a ton of energy.

Gauges?  What are those?   ;D  Grio Gris and others who have talked about the mental aspect of fatigue have a definite point.  Just go for a cruise around the block and then pick up the pace on your own.  You'll tense up fewer muscles, have fewer oh poop moments, and get tired less easily.

Muay Thai.  http://www.indianapolismartialartsclub.com/ (http://www.indianapolismartialartsclub.com/)

I dropped 20 lbs in 6 months, and then slowly shaved off the other stubborn 10 lbs over the last year.  I'm in better shape at 31 than I was at 21, and I was playing lacrosse in college.

Obviously, practicing fighting arts tones your whole body.  The movements of the Muay Thai tend to develop your core, and especially your legs and hips.  Any instructor with any fighting experience will also add lots of body-weight resistance and calasthenics as part of a class.  All of that is great for adding endurance to the muscles you need to hang of the bike.

If you don't do extensive contact sparring or fight, you don't have to worry about getting all banged up... the best part of the workout is how low-impact it is.  You're not pounding your knees and lower back like when you run miles.

I'm trying to get one of my riding buddies to give it a shot, but he's balking at the cost... he's willing to drop $1800 on a full exhaust system to cut 8 lbs from his bike, but won't spend the same amount to shave 30 lbs permanently off his butt... go figure.

Wow!  :o Thanks for all the great info and pointers!  What a great resource this board is ;D [thumbsup]

I'm on day 3 of the patch and my bad eating and soda habits are slowing in anticipation of changing them wholesale on monday.  I'll check in here occasionally with progress.

Forgot to mention... Once I'd started losing weight and getting more comfortable with regular Muay Thai classes, I did eventually start sparring and fighting.  After a few sessions I realized that I needed to get physically stronger, since Muay Thai involves a lot of upright wrestling ("clinch" fighting), and I was getting pwnt by all these buffed up young guys.  I didn't want to bulk up, get large, or get slow - just develop functional strength - so I started working with a friend that is addicted to this website... http://crossfit.com/ (http://crossfit.com/)

The site can be a little daunting and initially hard to decipher, but at the core of all that yah-yah is a foundation of exercises that develop your ability to do a lot of work over a short period of time.  They focus on getting the muscles to work together in realistic movements, as opposed, say, to laying on your back and pushing a bar over and over - something that you'll never do in real life.

The site offers demo vids, daily workouts, tips on logging progress, and occassionaly has pictures of toned chicks in tight gear bending over (bonus!).  I've found it to be a great way to avoid workout tedium, which is one very real reason that people starting up a fitness routine bail out early in the process.  It also helps that most of what they demo on that site can be accomplished with some very basic equipment, things that are readily available on the average public playground, or no equipment at all.

Some of this stuff can be extremely strenuous, so don't pick an intense workout (like 'The 300') and expect to knock it out your first time through.  But you can cut down the recommended weight or reps or just do some of the prescribed activities until your fitness level catches up.

I was a weight room guy for years, and now I swear by this stuff.

Good luck.

a lot of guys that compete in watercross and dirtbike - many more bumps to absorb with your body, swear by the ol' standards:

Push, Pull, Squat.

(Benchpress, Deadlift, Squat - for those not hip with lifting lingo).

The classic three weight exercises, and there are infinite variations.

This is a great thread.  I'm a bigger rider, 220ish, would love to get back to my HS playing weight of about 190. 

Living in NYC I face the beers, pizza,  [bacon] and soda conundrum all the time.  I try to moderate, but for the most part I eat what I like, and drink when I'm dry.  My roommate calls me the most active kid he knows and the worst eater.

I try to run, and get out on the pedal bike.  My other sport I need to stay shape for is ice hockey.

Anyway, after reading this thread yesterday I went for a central park loop.  I’m just riding along on lower east side and this guy starts talking to me…Its Mathew Modine.  He handed me a flyer for his bicycle group which I thought was pretty cool.

http://www.bicycleforaday.com/home.html

I was so pissed I did get him do some Full Metal jacket lines for me.

As dumb as it sounds, I've always found sit-ups to be good for core.  The results are pretty quick too.

So the gf managed to con me into going back to the gym, only she signs us up for a body boot camp, outdoors, resistance training, running and I have to admit I've found that my core is lacking, my endurance sucks and I still hate running.  But after 3 weeks, the work outs are getting any easier (the intesity picks up each work out) but my recovery time is starting to get shorter.  Ok so I F*ked up my knee the other night over compensating but still I'm starting to feel better after only 3 weeks (3 days a week).  Yea there was a bit of a diet change but it isn't drastic and really I've had to cut back to light beer, my Irish great grand father is rolling over in his grave but then again he only weight 150lb at his heaviest and I'm 220 so I need the light beer.  The other thing I've noticed, is that this great little pub's food smells like crap when I'm working out .... and I love pub grub.

Anyway all to say that everyone seems to have some great ideas and the key one as far as I'm concerned is find something you can stick too, my goal is 30lbs in 4-6 months, but short term is 7-10 in 4 weeks.

Cheer and good luck.

 [drink]

how is the workout going sqweak?
update please!  :)

had to read this 6 times before i realized you meant didn't

Not much of an update here. :(

 I'm on my third week of not smoking and soda intake has been greatly reduced.  Unfortunately, crunch time (70 hr work weeks) isn't the best condition for making substantial changes to diet or getting on the workout routine yet.  I'm eating a little healthier, at least what I can do with eating fast/quick-service food.  Hopefully things will level off soon and and I can make some more changes, but the progress I've made is a good start :)

Keep up the good work,
you're doing great!

Thx for the update :)

I've converted him to whole wheat pasta!   [thumbsup]

get him to agree to taking his lunch instead of the fast food  [thumbsup]

Taking your lunch will make your wallet strong too.  Tell him the money saved will go straight to the tire kitty.

good for the waistline & the wallet  ;D

that was actually the plan, and the first week, I made the food but it somehow never made it to the office. Then things became very abnormal around here.  i am "off" work studying for the bar, he doesn't get home until 3 am and leaves again at 9 am, and many days have meet spent out of the office at meetings.  I think things will go better in a couple of weeks when life goes back to "normal". 

on that note, anyone got any ideas for a sack lunch?  Please note:  he does not eat sandwiches.

Dog food. Try IAMs dogfood. My dogs are fit & have a never ending abundance of energy. They could go all day if I let them.

&,, it doesnt taste that bad  ;)
Sorry,, just couldnt resist.

first, good luck on the bar :)

i pack a salad, with whatever protein we had for dinner the night before...
so, if we had grilled chicken for dinner, i make extra, and bring it for lunch.
does he have access to a microwave at his office?

another idea is rollups.... get some turkey or roast beef, and roll them into tubes
pack a side of pickles, or a salad. cherry tomatoes are great for the sack lunch, they don't make things soggy.

get some some of those tiny storage containers
for a portion of dressing that he can add to his salad's before he eats.

fruit snacks will help him get through the day without cheating...

I have all of the little containers and he used to take a small side salad to work. I even made him a duct tape lunch bag!   [thumbsup]

What kind of a baby man is he?!?! 
Tell him to make his own damn lunch!  ;)

 [laugh] [laugh] [laugh] [clap]

I know of 2 ppl  weight watchers/points...  -50 lbs, each not a joke.

one who would wait all day to eat and would be starving, so' eat anything... and even late into the night. The same that likes to go out at lunch...

gotta keep the brain fed while working, or you put the bodys stress on beating that hunger to get a job done, so you can apprreciate a meal you should have deservedly so.

Snacking on something throught out the day, not exactly ice cream, but, the 100 calorie packs  of snax, ( an apple is 70? calories a candy bar is 270? calories) or the 1-point bag of pop corn durring the day  stave off the inevitable, " im too tired to   40min meal tonite, I can make microwave hot dogs"  *

personally, the peanut butter bliss * are a little crunchier/ chewier when they are a little melty, i go thru a box faster when they are.

one who married a very loving wife willing to pack his lunch if it helps him eat healthier?  [cheeky]

(making my own damn lunch is what gets me to end up at subway (not that bad) or the cheesteak shop (*really* bad) ;D)

Running is evil. It can be hell on your joints. I only run when chased. [laugh]

 The added bonus of cycling, is that besides the increase in fitness, you also work on your riding skills. [moto]
Cornering, braking, looking through your lines, learning to carry your momentum into the corners... it all transfers over to the moto. [thumbsup]

And here's a very simple way of cutting the useless calories... If you can't read/pronounce all the ingredients on the label, then you probably don't need to eat it.

If you really want some good cardio, and are slightly masochistic, try spin classes. You'll love it, if you don't die. [puke] [puke] [laugh] [laugh]

another thing i haven't done in a good long while but i gotta agree.  they're fantastic.. after you go for a while.  at first it's hell.

Guess who has started his nike ipod training program?!?!  Last night was day two...

www.coolrunnings.com

it is what I use.  They have a couch-to-XX (name your distance) training plan.  I am the weirdo that likes to run but has never been very fast.  The goal is health, not speed.  The best results I have ever seen have been with a heart rate monitor and this program.  No matter the day, how you feel, peer pressure etc.....stick to your heart rate goal (65-80% I think to start)

you probably meant coolrunning, no 's'

The rumors are true, the ground shaking that is presently occuring nightly around 11pm isn't aftershocks but my fatass making an attempt at "running".  [cheeky]

I'm doing something similar to the couch to 5k plan, doing mostly walking with intervals of jogging and running.  I average ~1.2 miles (~2k) daily, and yesterday I walked a full 5k at ~10m/k pace with a brief jog during the last 400m.  So far so good.  The geek factor of using the nike+ kit is definatley keeping me engaged, and I've been lurking around the nike+, runner+, coolrunning, runnersworld, etc forums for training plans and information. [thumbsup]

keep up the good work squeak  [thumbsup]

has it started talking to you yet?

Well, you live in a place that is about as conducive to running as anyplace could be, so keep it up.  When I lived in SM, I used to run for miles on the green belt on San Vicente.  It's a great workout and the grass makes it easier on your joints.

Also, make sure you have good shoes - they are VERY important.  Nike shoes have been linked to a number of joint problems and most professionals will tell you to stay as far from them as you can.  Personally, I have 3 pairs of Asics, each suited for different kinds of running. New Balance also makes great shoes as do a few others.  Best bet is to find a place (I love Run With Us in Pasadena) that is a running store NOT a shoe store and they will observe you as you run and find you shoes for your pronation that also suit the terrain you will be running on.

big hairy +1

i go to the place around the corner from me.. on lincoln, near maxella.  forget the name.  i dig those Nikes for obvious reasons but they aren't the right shoes for my wide, flat feet.  i also have some Asics; they were carefully fitted to me by the dude at the store.  at a good store they'll look at your feet, how you stand, how you walk, what kind of running you intend to do, etc and then bring out several choices.  there's no brand relevance.

Yup.  I use it to time my intervals, so I am pretty used to all the auto-generated voice prompts.  And Lance Armstrong and some chick with 3 names keep congratulating me on my longest/fastest/bestest workout. [cheeky]


I have been running at Palisades Park across the street from the house.  It's got dirt/grass paths in addition to paving. [thumbsup]


Learned that lesson the hard way already.  :-\  My Air Max180s are the most comfortable athletic shoes I've ever owned, but when I picked up a pair of "Victory" they shredded my Achilles' on both heels after a very simple 15min/1mi walk/jog.  Promptly went to Top to Top in Santa Monica and after a gait analysis and q&a they got me sorted with some Brooks "Addiction".  I'm using a pouch on the laces for the Nike+ [thumbsup]  They are more comfortable but I'm getting a bit of shin splints in my left leg.  They seem to lessen in severity if I'm aware of my stride and be sure to land heel first and roll through instead of just clomping them down.  I'm sure some of that is related to just the increased activity level as well.

Shoes....DB is right....In the running world if you are over 150 lbs (or something close to that) you are considered a "heavy striker"  I am 190lbs.  New balance trail or all terrain shoes have had the best support for me.  I have been in the Army for 12 years have changed my shoe type twice (addidas, soucony) and have paid dearly with knee/ hip/ back pain.  I have used NB 902.  (the ugly grey 'old') and All terrain 470series, and 800 series. 

Good job!  May your lap times go down, and may you finish track days with energy to spare.

Has anybody looked into Chi running? Basically it teaches a different running technique which puts a lot less stress on your lower body. I used to run like a sprinter, all power, but that doesn't get you very far in long distance running. I'd get shin splints that make my muscles feel like they were tearing apart in the middle. With the Chi running , i can run once every few months for about 3 miles with out pain. Ive been too lazy to dedicate myself to running, but the few times i do it really helps.

Links? Resources?

This sounds really interesting...

[laugh]  I think I just found the best workout evar.  We found that there is a Crossfit affiliate that is right down the street from the house we just bought.  We've only done a handful of workouts, but a lot of the movements will strengthen the muscles that are used on the track.

crossfit is pure evil!!  If you can stick with it though the results are amazing.

It's pretty easy to stick with it when you're with an affiliate.  I would have an impossible time if I were doing it on my own at home.  I'm always the slow one to finish when it's rounds for time, but that just means that I get my own motivation squad.  [laugh] 

Today was a big game of build-a-workout.  Steve asked everyone what movement they either loved or hated.  It ended up being 3 rounds (21-15-9) of 400m run, thrusters, pull ups, sit ups, handstand pushups (I do mine piked on a box to scale).  It was uuuugly!!!

crossfit

http://crossfit.com/

just do the workout of the day everyday, you may throw up sometimes.

mags & I walked the "Nike+ Human Race" 10k last night here in Los Angeles. [thumbsup]