Ducati Monster Forum

In full disclosure, I've been riding on the street for 28 years. 18 of which were without the "M" endorsement.

According to the article:

In a 2012 study by the Michigan State Police, 58% of fatalities had no endorsement.

Not long ago I was stopped (on Stunt Road ironically) for a California stop and speeding (both of which I was guilty of) and the CHP let me go, said that he was really trying to grab guys with no endorsement and/or insurance.

I also have a P and S endorsement.

However, it's pretty rare I actually remember to have my license on my body.  Good thing I know my number...  That's gotten me some courtesy at traffic stops where I was 100% guilty of whatever I was stopped for and didn't have a license on my person.

JM

Which is down significantly from when Harry Hurt did his study in the 70's.

Results here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_findings_in_the_Hurt_Report (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_findings_in_the_Hurt_Report)

Numbers 20-25 and 55 jumped out at me.

20-25 & 55 to me makes me think new/inexperienced rider.

JM

Riding without an M Endorsement in some states results in some pretty severe consequences. I know some states will actually impound your motorcycle. No thanks.

You don't drive a car without a driver's license......why ride a motorcycle without an M Endorsement?

That happens a lot as well.

while it's not that high in au afaik, it's still in the region of 25% from memory.

we have a tiered licence system, but i don't know the stats for restricted riders dying on bigger bikes vs restricted ones.

unregistered bikes is also quite high, but that may also bring into the stats people riding dirt bikes.

In WA they will impound your motorcycle if you're pulled over and found to be without an endorsement.

They also ask for your license number when renewing your motorcycle's registration, which seems a bit much to me.

I am willing to bet more people ride without an M endorsement than people drive without a standard driver's license

Have you been to California. [laugh]


I'd agree.

You'd be wrong.  :)

Of course. Based on your extensive LEO experience.

I think the issue with people driving without a license tends to fall under the category of people misinterpreting that driving is a privilege and not a right.
Motorcycle endorsement I've met a few who honestly did not know that they had to have one to ride.

I think what is being lost in the disagreement is the distinction between TOTAL numbers and PERCENTAGES.

I have NOTHING to base my theory on, it is just a guess:

I would bet that there is a higher PERCENTAGE of motorcyclists without a motorcycle license but a far higher TOTAL number of car drivers without a license, simply because of the vastly higher number of cars on the road.

Carry on.................... [coffee]

Mark

I'd agree with you that just due to the differance between the number of cars/trucks vs number of motos you would have to be correct. I would add that in my experience, in LA County,  if I pull over 10 motos I've found that generally one won't have an endorsement. If I pull over ten cars at least three wont have a license or will have a suspended or revoked license which is as good as not having one at all.

^^^
Wow! I'm surprised.... but I don't think I should be.

Nate here is your chance to make a buck.  Given your mighty admin powers you should blackmail the guy that does not have an endorsement.   ;D

Sorry I am all about an opportunity  [laugh] [laugh] [laugh]

Exactly - he's a cop and thus actual, extensive LEO experience.

A possible reason for this is because motorcycles tend to be viewed as pleasure vehicles.  People buy them for sunday ride in the hills(yes, I know a good number also use them as their own daily driver).  People with pleasure vehicles are more often up to date on their license because the money needed for said pleasure vehicle would not be as easy to come by with no license.  A car is viewed as by many as a tool to get to/from work or a tool to complete a chore.  There are some who feel it's better to just gamble with the idea of not getting caught then paying their fines to get their license unrevoked or getting car insurance.

I think you may be on to something.

Kinda like not having to have a license or endorsement to drive a motor home bigger than a school bus? 

JM