Ducati Monster Forum

Moto Board => Accessories & Mods => Topic started by: Graymonster on July 31, 2014, 04:27:09 AM



Title: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on July 31, 2014, 04:27:09 AM
Hi.
I want more power in my M900  [thumbsup] but I'm not sure what to do. I'v been looking at the track pack here http://www.jctcycles.com/ducati_parts (http://www.jctcycles.com/ducati_parts) What will this kit do regarding horsepower/torque on my bike? I have custum 2 - 1 exhaust. Sent an e-mail to JCT, but they dont respond.... Any good/bad experiences with JCT here?
Any other suggestions?

Wiktor Norway (excuse my English :) )





Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: ducpainter on July 31, 2014, 04:40:11 AM
No experience with that company.

Why not buy all those parts from our sponsor ca-cycleworks? I'm pretty sure they sell all those items, and they're a first class outfit.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on July 31, 2014, 04:42:06 AM
Here is my Monster :)

(http://i1368.photobucket.com/albums/ag164/wiktor69/mymonster_zps1402ddee.jpg)


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on July 31, 2014, 04:43:49 AM
No experience with that company.

Why not buy all those parts from our sponsor ca-cycleworks? I'm pretty sure they sell all those items, and they're a first class outfit.

THX, I'm checking out ca-cycleworks as we speek :D


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: koko64 on July 31, 2014, 04:53:35 AM
Hey Wiktor

That full kit would be good.

Does your bike have W or V stamped heads?

+1 on using our sponsors.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on July 31, 2014, 04:59:40 AM
Hey Wiktor

That full kit would be good.

Does your bike have W or V stamped heads?

+1 on using our sponsors.

Thx koko64 :)
I'm not sure about w or v stamp... Were could I find that?


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: koko64 on July 31, 2014, 05:11:38 AM
Look on the front head on the left hand side near the exhaust valve cover. Look for a "V" or "W" inscribed there. The details about this are on bikeboy.org topic "900 engines, not all created equal".


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: ducatigirl100 on July 31, 2014, 11:24:09 AM
 Shorten the intake between the carb and the motor is another way to have more top end.
 A clutch and  Nichols flyweel to put less stress on the crank can also be an option ....  before opening the heads.

I have those ca-cyclewoks  coils     there great  [bow_down]


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: MotoPsycho on July 31, 2014, 02:49:11 PM
Shortening the intakes is a good way to gain top end but you lose bottom end. Not my first choice. No replacement for displacement like my Pappy always said.

If I had access to the right equipment and materials, I'd try a mini tunnel ram like the old hot rods used to use.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: memper on July 31, 2014, 04:36:09 PM
I have dealt with jct. Products are the same/similar. Decent communication. But not so good with tech advice IME. If done again I woulda saved a bit more and went with CCW


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Rudemouthsky on July 31, 2014, 06:26:00 PM
The suspense of finding out which heads he has is killing me, lol.

++++1 on CCW. Chris will let you bend his ear for tech support and advice after the sale, and is very helpful.



Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on July 31, 2014, 10:10:53 PM
Koko 64. Suspect that I have the bad heads. Im offshore and wount find out for a week... 

Thx memper, im going with ccw :)

ducatigirl100. I'm a sucker for lowend torque so I'm keeping my intakes. Nichols flyweel on the other hand sounds interesting :)

GRUBBY: Mini tunnel ram, as in forcing air into the carbs?


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: MonsterMadMarty on August 01, 2014, 01:44:41 AM
I have dealt with both JCT an CA-Cycleworks both are very good but JCT doesn't responded to emails!  JCT do the JE pistons cheaper but CA-Cycleworks will do a good deal if you mention this fact. 

Go CA-Cycleworks, better commuication and they also sent me a free pack of M&M's plus a nice pen and sticker!


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on August 01, 2014, 04:29:19 AM
Thanks MonsterMadMarty (no wonder your getting M&M's with that nick :) ) I will buy stuff from ccw, but were should I buy new cams?


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on August 01, 2014, 04:30:59 AM
And what the heck ryhems with pliers?!?


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: koko64 on August 01, 2014, 04:41:02 AM
V heads come up for sale here regularly with the bigger cams and valves. Do you have local parts breakers you trust? I have a friend with 900 V cams, but I don't know how bad shipping would be from here.
You should get the bigger valves and someone to do the machine work. Know a good machine shop? Sometimes it's easier and cheaper to buy complete heads. You could enquire with our sponsors regarding 43 In/38 Ex valves, or even 44 In/38 Ex valves.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on August 01, 2014, 04:41:52 AM
And what the heck ryhems with pliers?!?

Ahhhh, tiers  [bang]


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: koko64 on August 01, 2014, 04:54:02 AM
Oh, you mean tyres. ;D


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on August 01, 2014, 05:29:31 AM
Oh, you mean tyres. ;D

Yuuup... Tried everything to send a message to ccw....  :o

Have an exelent machinshop and when I first do this, I want to do a propper job. So, new valves and cams will be fitted. Any good places online to buy this?


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: koko64 on August 01, 2014, 05:44:41 AM
Some of the Americans should know.

Candice at CCW should be in touch soon if you emailed.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Rudemouthsky on August 01, 2014, 06:23:29 AM
Yuuup... Tried everything to send a message to ccw....  :o

Have an exelent machinshop and when I first do this, I want to do a propper job. So, new valves and cams will be fitted. Any good places online to buy this?

You're looking for a place in the States to buy valves and cams?


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on August 01, 2014, 06:30:40 AM
You're looking for a place in the States to buy valves and cams?

Yes sir! Any ideas were?


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Rudemouthsky on August 01, 2014, 07:05:47 AM
Kibbelwhite for valves;

http://www.kpmivalvetrain.com/ (http://www.kpmivalvetrain.com/)

Even my dealer opts for their valves over OE.

But imo you'd be better off just looking for a pair of complete V heads. Since veetwo went under there is no way that I can think of to purchase new cams, and for the price you'd be paying for used ones the complete heads probably wouldn't set you back much more, and you'd be getting the valves along with it.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on August 01, 2014, 07:56:56 AM
Thx Buck Naked! :)
I'm now looking for new heads... what is the differense between V1 and V2 heads?


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Rudemouthsky on August 01, 2014, 08:39:58 AM
I think the V2 heads had valve guides that were made of a different material, bronze instead of steel but otherwise they are essentially the same. Someone else may know for certain.

One thing I just realized; if your motor does/does not have external oil lines from the heads, you will need to be sure you get the same type to replace it. In other words I don't think older SS V heads will work on your 98 because of the external lines you *don't* have. Someone smarter than me can confirm/debunk that statement tho.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on August 01, 2014, 10:42:58 AM
Thx again B N :)


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: koko64 on August 01, 2014, 01:44:40 PM
Pm sent re a couple of guys who might point you in the right direction to have your heads rebuilt.
Cheers.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: koko64 on August 01, 2014, 02:11:31 PM
I think the V2 heads had valve guides that were made of a different material, bronze instead of steel but otherwise they are essentially the same. Someone else may know for certain.

One thing I just realized; if your motor does/does not have external oil lines from the heads, you will need to be sure you get the same type to replace it. In other words I don't think older SS V heads will work on your 98 because of the external lines you *don't* have. Someone smarter than me can confirm/debunk that statement tho.

The motors changed around that time, deleted external oil lines, larger alternators, etc. The external appearance of the alternator side cases and lack of external oil lines stand out. A question to the forum, will 900ie heads fit these later carbed motors? I suspect the head/barrel oiling system is the same. That could be an option.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Rudemouthsky on August 01, 2014, 02:33:22 PM
The motors changed around that time, deleted external oil lines, larger alternators, etc. The external appearance of the alternator side cases and lack of external oil lines stand out. A question to the forum, will 900ie heads fit these later carbed motors? I suspect the head/barrel oiling system is the same. That could be an option.

Good question. We already know the cams from an I.E or SSIE work, if something is different it's probably in how the o ring recess lines up with the cylinder.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: xcaptainxbloodx on August 01, 2014, 02:33:32 PM
the 41mm carbs are not ideal for the street, go with the 39s


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: koko64 on August 01, 2014, 03:16:59 PM
I think it would depend on what combination of modifications go with the package.
For a stock motor maybe. I do think the FCR39s give better response at smaller/partial throttle openings, but it seems grabbing bigger handfuls of throttle on a 900 goes the way of the 41s from bikeboy's dyno charts. Getting on the gas, the 41s were softer off the bottom on a worked 900 and better in the wet than the 39s. While exiting a corner leaned over, I could give the 41s more gas without getting bitten. The 39s were too good! :P Getting the 41s tuned on a 900 was more involved in getting the slow circuit just right iirc.
Anyway, I was happy with both.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Rudemouthsky on August 01, 2014, 04:49:51 PM
The 39's vs the 41's is such a tight debate that for me it made no sense for me to not go with the 41's. Chris Kelley is absolutely adamant that if you ever want to get the most potential out of the 900, you need the 41's so that swayed me. I think a Sudco rep once said they sell 3- 41 kits for every 39 kit, for whatever that's worth. I began having unrelated problems shortly after my 900 swap and really barely got to experience mine. I suppose I would probably get the 39's if I were to do it again and was leaving the motor stock based on Brad Black's research.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: brad black on August 02, 2014, 12:02:40 AM
heads: http://www.woundedduc.net/Engine.html (http://www.woundedduc.net/Engine.html)  these are v heads, compare chamber to w here: http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Piston-and-cylinder-head-horizontal-DUCATI-Monster-900-1993-1997-/161379735581?pt=AU_Motorcycle_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2592fb581d&_uhb=1 (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Piston-and-cylinder-head-horizontal-DUCATI-Monster-900-1993-1997-/161379735581?pt=AU_Motorcycle_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2592fb581d&_uhb=1)

i'd go 39 because i'm a tight arse.  actually, i'd probably go mikuni these days.  the tm pro series are much cheaper.  but they're not a racked drop in.  now i'm just rambling.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on August 02, 2014, 12:28:25 AM
Thx brad black! I'v sendt them an email about the heads :)


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Rudemouthsky on August 02, 2014, 05:37:08 AM
heads: http://www.woundedduc.net/Engine.html (http://www.woundedduc.net/Engine.html)  these are v heads, compare chamber to w here: http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Piston-and-cylinder-head-horizontal-DUCATI-Monster-900-1993-1997-/161379735581?pt=AU_Motorcycle_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2592fb581d&_uhb=1 (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Piston-and-cylinder-head-horizontal-DUCATI-Monster-900-1993-1997-/161379735581?pt=AU_Motorcycle_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2592fb581d&_uhb=1)

i'd go 39 because i'm a tight arse.  actually, i'd probably go mikuni these days.  the tm pro series are much cheaper.  but they're not a racked drop in.  now i'm just rambling.

Haha...those are the heads I bought from him 8 months ago, along with the matching bottom end. He hasn't updated his site in ages.

The FBF cylinders and barrels are from the same bike, I tried to buy those too.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on August 02, 2014, 06:27:01 AM
Ohh, snap... just start searching again  [coffee]


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Rudemouthsky on August 02, 2014, 06:52:07 AM
Ohh, snap... just start searching again  [coffee]

Those have the external oil lines so they may not have worked for you anyway.

Maybe cams and porting what you already have actually is the better way to go...


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on August 02, 2014, 07:40:40 AM
Maybe cams and porting what you already have actually is the better way to go...

I'm looking into that posibility, but which cams should I buy, and were... Would st2 cams fit? just want to expand my field of search.... No problems with the porting, have an exelent place to get that sorted.

Wiktor :)


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: koko64 on August 02, 2014, 11:54:49 AM
Yes, ST2 cams fit.  [thumbsup]


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: brad black on August 02, 2014, 03:49:25 PM
the external oil lines are on the cylinders, not the heads.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: koko64 on August 02, 2014, 03:54:07 PM
Brad. So the oil holes on the head to barrel faces line up and fit as usual? Good to know. Does this mean 900ie heads would be a bolt on as long as you fit later barrels? That could open up possibilities.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: brad black on August 02, 2014, 08:07:40 PM
any 900 cams are pretty hard to find these days.

the o-ring location went from cylinder to head in the small block motors around 2002 i believe.  st2 didn't change, maybe 900 didn't change either?

98 to 01 ss had internal drain backs, monster allegedly went to air cooled cylinders in 00 according to falloon (from memory).  all just variations of the same theme.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: koko64 on August 02, 2014, 09:39:24 PM
Thanks Brad, good to know. Opens up the possibilities.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on August 02, 2014, 09:53:43 PM
Again, thank you folks! Really appreciate the help you give a noob!  [beer]
I'm now looking for new cams everywere... and ccw to answere my e-mail. :)


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: MotoPsycho on August 04, 2014, 12:22:32 AM
GRUBBY: Mini tunnel ram, as in forcing air into the carbs?

Nah, as in a little bit longer intake tract. Like a few more inches. After looking at it, wouldn't work. Not enough room plus I don't have pod filters anyway. It was just a thought.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: monsta on August 04, 2014, 03:36:30 AM
might happen to have a set of veetwo 210 cam's(the high torque one's)  lying around that you may be able to sway me to part with...  8)

Of course you would have to pay freight from Straya as well...   [thumbsup]


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: koko64 on August 04, 2014, 03:40:16 AM
I think Wik may have picked up some complete heads. [popcorn]


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: koko64 on August 04, 2014, 03:43:56 AM
Do you need longer valves with those?


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Rudemouthsky on August 04, 2014, 04:47:03 AM
might happen to have a set of veetwo 210 cam's(the high torque one's)  lying around that you may be able to sway me to part with...  8)

Of course you would have to pay freight from Straya as well...   [thumbsup]

I'm interested if Wik isn't...


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on August 04, 2014, 04:49:07 AM
Thats right Tony, I found a set og 8 K mile V2 heads (waiting for pictures of them as we speak :D )

Sorry for asking monsta (I'm a duc noob) What would those cams do with my (future) project?

And Tony, why would I need longer valves?


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: monsta on August 04, 2014, 04:50:35 AM
Do you need longer valves with those?
yep, they get a higher lift from having a smaller base diameter.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: monsta on August 04, 2014, 04:55:31 AM
Thats right Tony, I found a set og 8 K mile V2 heads (waiting for pictures of them as we speak :D )

Sorry for asking monsta (I'm a duc noob) What would those cams do with my (future) project?

And Tony, why would I need longer valves?

They are made to give more torque to your engine as opposed to the the 212's which will add top end power.

They have a highr lift, thats why you would need longer valves...


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on August 04, 2014, 04:56:29 AM
yep, they get a higher lift from having a smaller base diameter.

I see, then Buck Naked could have them. Im happy (for now  [roll] )with V2 heads, fcr 41, new coils and lighter flywheel.... But next winter....  [thumbsup]


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: monsta on August 04, 2014, 05:02:04 AM
no worries. I'm not desperate to offload, I have a set of V heads that I was gunna play with one day, was planning using them for that.

But you can have them if you want Buck.  They were about $1200 aus when they were getting sold. so I'm looking at $600aus  (they are new)


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Rudemouthsky on August 04, 2014, 05:16:26 AM
Sounds like they wouldn't work for my project (stock valves and manifolds, 944 kit). I'm looking for more peak power. You don't have access to a set of Veetwo adjustable pulleys tho would ya??


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: monsta on August 04, 2014, 06:51:16 AM
ha.. nah, wish I did. They stopped making them a long time ago.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: garryc on August 04, 2014, 05:22:13 PM
http://www.veetwo.com.au/ (http://www.veetwo.com.au/)


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: silas on August 05, 2014, 11:34:28 AM

Graymonster,
My 98 M900 (charcoal) came w/ the small valve W heads. I bought a 96 900ss engine w/ complete V2 heads and had someone swap the heads 2-3 yrs ago, then I sold the 900ss engine w/ my old heads.  He didn't pull or disturb the cylinders, and 17k miles later the cyl. base gaskets are still good, no leaks. The heads were a direct swap as far as I know, no oil line differences. (My 98 does not have the external oil lines.) I did no other changes, so I was able to immediately feel the change from this swap.    Its gains were small and mostly at higher rpms. It pulled a little harder above about 4k and vibrates more too at all rpms w/ the bigger valves.  Maybe 5hp more, tops?  I then did the CCW ExactFit coils & FCR 41's w/ pods & saw cut the air box off the coil / battery box bracket about 8k miles ago. I LOVE these carbs ! Better gas mileage also!  Great honking intake sounds.  Light flywheel & minor FCR jetting updates coming next.  I'll post my jetting change info w/ RU-1750 pods once I install the new jets in case it helps BuckN or ChrisK or someone.  All parts were from CCW, great service.  For max HP, the airbox is better "they say". I prefer the open look & ease of maintenance w/o the airbox.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Rudemouthsky on August 05, 2014, 02:58:09 PM
If I had to do it all over again I would honestly save my cash for a 1000ds motor swap or just buy a more powerful bike if I felt like I needed more power. My problem is, I've *never* had a truly sorted out 900. I went from a 750 to a 900 that had issues from the beginning. Had a shop ruin my top end...bought a low mileage 900ss motor and right out of the gate the oil galley plug was backing out. Split the cases then went insane and here I am with a ton of money invested and still no bike. Looking back I should have kept my reliable little 750 and bought something else to satisfy my need for speed.

Now I'm way past the point of return and have no choice but to keep throwing cash at my 944 and hopefully still be riding it in 30 years. :)

Like Silas said it seems that no one thing makes these motors come alive...it's always better heads plus FCRs...or more compression plus FCRs. Or in my case more compression, more displacement, FCRs, and head work lol.

It really does say something about how special our bikes are...that we'll throw the kind of illogical money we do at them to have *exactly* the bike we want instead of just getting something different.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on August 06, 2014, 12:16:25 AM
Thx guys for a lot of help :) After reading just about everything on the big interweb about tuning of an M900, your advices and an email from chris at ccw, i'v decided to just do an brushup on my new V2 heads (no porting), fit FCR 41's, new coils and a lighter flywheel.

Already got better respiration with a cut open airbox (maby fit POD's and ditch the airbox?) and a custom 2-1 exhaust.

Will make an buildthread in "tech" when I start. Now I'm just going home (work on an oil rig in the north sea) and enjoy the beautifull, easy laydown, turnwilling Monster for a couple of months before winter turns up here in Norway. Then my plans will be put to action :D


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: almgren.t on August 06, 2014, 03:34:37 AM
Last year I went that route with my '99 M900.

- head swap (from W to V1/V2)
- piston swap to high comp ones
- carb swap to FCR 41:s
- air box ditch for air pods
- better coils
- Ignitech ignition

Bike is, well, another bike. Still struggling a bit to get the jetting of the FCRs right, but overall this has been a fun couple if mods.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on August 06, 2014, 03:45:06 AM
Last year I went that route with my '99 M900.

- head swap (from W to V1/V2)
- piston swap to high comp ones
- carb swap to FCR 41:s
- air box ditch for air pods
- better coils
- Ignitech ignition

Bike is, well, another bike. Still struggling a bit to get the jetting of the FCRs right, but overall this has been a fun couple if mods.

Sounds fun  [thumbsup] Do you recon the jetting struggles comes from high comp pistons?


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: koko64 on August 06, 2014, 04:58:49 AM
The jetting struggles are often from the FCR carbs being very precise instruments. The Off idle-1/8 to 1/4-1/3 throttle range has a number of overlapping circuits that influence it. The high level of adjustability is what gives the carbs the capacity to deliver strong performance everywhere in the rev range with little compromise. It also gives plenty of scope for error (kind of like fully adjustable suspension). So there are more layers to tune, but at least they are reasonably linear. Therefore an understanding of the carbs is important in tuning them.

Some people are lucky and put them on as delivered with great results. IME, the biggest hassle for tuning was when I did quite extensive airbox modifications.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on August 11, 2014, 11:11:56 AM
Found out the heads I planned to buy, was no good.. I found these ones

http://www.ebay.com/itm/91-98-Ducati-900SS-SP-FE-CR-m900-PAIR-DUAL-SPARK-V2-CYLINDER-HEADS-BIG-VALVE-96/121408048050?_trksid=p2047675.c100011.m1850&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D23491%26meid%3D8964221631613288437%26pid%3D100011%26prg%3D10073%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D10%26sd%3D121384435048 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/91-98-Ducati-900SS-SP-FE-CR-m900-PAIR-DUAL-SPARK-V2-CYLINDER-HEADS-BIG-VALVE-96/121408048050?_trksid=p2047675.c100011.m1850&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D23491%26meid%3D8964221631613288437%26pid%3D100011%26prg%3D10073%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D10%26sd%3D121384435048)

on E-bay.
They are dual spark plug. Is this original or converted like this? Is it good or bad with dual spark plug? On the vertical head, it looks like the big valve is burnt... Do you agree?

Wiktor


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: ducpainter on August 11, 2014, 11:22:31 AM
It's a conversion.

The valve doesn't look burnt to me...just sooty.

They'd be good for a modded engine. Unnecessary for stock.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on August 11, 2014, 11:36:36 AM
Thx ducpainter :)

Unnecessary, as in you only need dual plugs in a tuned engine?
Is it a good idea to make an spark plug dummy, and use them as normal heads?

Wiktor


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: ducpainter on August 12, 2014, 08:32:41 AM
The theory, as I understand it, is with a high domed piston the flame doesn't travel all the way to the other side of the combustion chamber so there is unburned fuel, and a 'waste' of power. Add a plug to the other side and problem solved.

Ducati used the concept on the 1000DS. I don't know if it was done for performance based or emissions based reasons.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: koko64 on August 12, 2014, 02:23:57 PM
 I wouldnt go out of my way to do it as a mod, but if the heads came that way,and suited my needs,  why not? Hopefully if they went to that trouble they ported the heads and did a good valve job.  Did they did do anything else to the heads?


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: brad black on August 12, 2014, 02:41:58 PM
as a generalisation, a dual plug conversion on a crappy combustion chamber will give better fuel economy, maybe some more power and be smoother.  it also needs less ignition advance.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: koko64 on August 12, 2014, 02:53:13 PM
The theory, as I understand it, is with a high domed piston the flame doesn't travel all the way to the other side of the combustion chamber so there is unburned fuel, and a 'waste' of power. Add a plug to the other side and problem solved.

Ducati used the concept on the 1000DS. I don't know if it was done for performance based or emissions based reasons.

Wonder if idle is cleaner and throttle response  crisper?


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Rudemouthsky on August 12, 2014, 07:42:52 PM
as a generalisation, a dual plug conversion on a crappy combustion chamber will give better fuel economy, maybe some more power and be smoother.  it also needs less ignition advance.

Would seem like a dual plug head with high compression pistons and no timing adjustments would almost be counter intuitive/destructive then?


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: brad black on August 12, 2014, 08:05:54 PM
it'll ping like a mofo.  but only because you changed it and didn't do it properly, like everything else.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: koko64 on August 12, 2014, 08:16:47 PM
as a generalisation, a dual plug conversion on a crappy combustion chamber will give better fuel economy, maybe some more power and be smoother.  it also needs less ignition advance.


I believe it in regards to ignition mapping.
Hemi head Sportsters liked it, but blew up if you didnt retard the ignition.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: koko64 on August 12, 2014, 08:21:18 PM
it'll ping like a mofo.  but only because you changed it and didn't do it properly, like everything else.

BN's got the services of a reputable engine builder. He should be right.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: brad black on August 12, 2014, 08:27:25 PM
sorry, general comment on the not done right causing a problem bit.  not aimed at buck.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on August 13, 2014, 01:46:59 AM
"Ping like a mofo". What does that mean?
Think I would just buy the heads, make an sparkplug dummy, and use them as single sparkplug heads....


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: brad black on August 13, 2014, 03:48:26 AM
mofo, as in mother make the beast with two backser.  lots of pinging.  coating the plugs with the molten pieces of piston pinging.  that sort of shit.

most likely.

you'd want to make sure your dummy plug doesn't act as a hot spot.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: koko64 on August 18, 2014, 03:12:06 AM
Hows the build going GM?


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on August 18, 2014, 02:23:06 PM
Im still buing stuff from all over... Heads (V2 single sparkplug) ond carbs (FCR 41) are hopfully on the way to me. Im currently reading about the importance of changing coils (any thoughts?) and studbolts.

The bike is in daily use as long as the roads here in Norway is icefree  [Dolph] . Rebuild starts as soon as the snow is here (and all the parts I need)  [thumbsup]


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: koko64 on August 18, 2014, 02:43:49 PM
Exactfit coils from CCW our sponsor. Great bang for bucks.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: monsta on August 18, 2014, 05:18:24 PM
Those dual plug heads are a good price, you wouldn't be able to get the mod done for that price, let alone the bigger valves!

Having said that, back in the day when Veetwo did this mod, not a lot was gained from it. Wasn't 'really' worth it..
Ducati did it for emissions.

The bigger valves are another story...


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Nibor on August 19, 2014, 03:45:45 PM
Get the Exactfit coils as Koko64 said. Really worth the small price, smoothed out the spark a heap for me!


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: monsta on August 24, 2014, 01:29:22 AM
I've been thinking about them heads, I thought they were a good price but I made what I thought was a silly offer and see what happens.
$500...  and now their mine! hahaha
now what am I gunna do with em?!!    ;D
I guess when they turn up I could have a good look and do what's needed and try em out (Of course that'll require more expence- coils etc)...   
I reckon they would have been ported. If you were going to spend that sorta money you would have done that as well eh?
Do ya's think they are magnesium covers? I've never seen one with the oil cooler support like that...

Damn ebay!!  not the first time I've made what I thought was a silly offer and got it...    [roll]  :)  [drink]


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: koko64 on August 25, 2014, 02:28:45 PM
You get 'em yet Monsta?

How's the build going Graymonster?


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Speeddog on August 25, 2014, 06:59:14 PM
I doubt that those are Mag covers, I don't think any were Mag with the cooler mount.

That cooler mounting is the standard SS 'low-mount' setup.

I've got a 900SS customer and his 900SS riding buddy that have swapped from the low mount to the Monster-style high mount and both report substantial decreases in oil temp.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on August 31, 2014, 09:16:44 AM
Hehe, monsta, e-bay got you (and me)

Tony, still riding my bike but everything is planed. Recon I'll start november-ish.
I'v been helping my friend who bought an really beat up 900ss. Previus owner had started an rebuildbut not finished. Btw, it is an 1993 with w1 heads… is that original?

Nibor, exactfit coils is on my must have list :)

Wiktor


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: monsta on August 31, 2014, 03:19:55 PM
I thought the W1 heads came about 95...
My 93 has V2 heads standard.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: koko64 on August 31, 2014, 04:20:49 PM
Hehe, monsta, e-bay got you (and me)

Tony, still riding my bike but everything is planed. Recon I'll start november-ish.
I'v been helping my friend who bought an really beat up 900ss. Previus owner had started an rebuildbut not finished. Btw, it is an 1993 with w1 heads… is that original?

Nibor, exactfit coils is on my must have list :)

Wiktor

Not original, 900SS never came with W heads, unless someone put them on. Maybe V1 is stamped on them?


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: monsta on September 05, 2014, 06:43:22 PM
heads turned up yesterday..
bit disapointed, I thought they looked like they had larger valves, but they are standard.
Also, I would have thought if you spent money on a twin spark setup you would have had them ported as well...
And they have standard cams...

Oh well, not a big deal, still not a bad price for heads here in Oz. I'll probabaly clean em up re-shim and on sell!   [roll]


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: koko64 on September 06, 2014, 05:15:37 PM
That's a bloody shame. I s'pose someone with a W head M900 or E900 might want them.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on September 16, 2014, 11:37:41 PM
Is it an idea to change my vacum fuel pump with an electric one? Would my FCR 41's like it?
(also thinking about fitting an 999 fueltank.... love the look on Radical 9 1/2 )


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on September 16, 2014, 11:49:29 PM
heads turned up yesterday..
bit disapointed, I thought they looked like they had larger valves, but they are standard.
Also, I would have thought if you spent money on a twin spark setup you would have had them ported as well...
And they have standard cams...

Oh well, not a big deal, still not a bad price for heads here in Oz. I'll probabaly clean em up re-shim and on sell!   [roll]


Sorry to hear that monsta.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: koko64 on September 17, 2014, 03:47:54 AM
You would have to manage fuel pressure to 3 psi max. I like the big ugly hex pump for its low pressure but high flow capability.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Howie on September 17, 2014, 04:12:25 AM
The stock pump flows 65 liters/ hour (about 17 gallons).  Obviously more than it needs mathematical since, at 60 MPH would equal about 3.5 MPG.  Thing is, full throttle, no vacuum.  I would think, from an electric pump, less would be needed.  See if you can find what the volume is on a carbie 900 supersport pump.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on September 17, 2014, 04:25:42 AM
Thx howie and Tony :)

Started teardown today, and found that my cam belts are way to loose.... Have felt that my bike was getting more and more lazy (maby thats why) but neglected it because the soon to come rebuild.... Realy exited about the outcome of this, hope it will feel like sitting on a rocket when finished :D


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: silas on September 17, 2014, 02:00:26 PM

Gray- I've got this rectangular Mikuni fuel pump w/ FCR41's on my M900. Works great still w/ 6-7k on it.


http://ca-cycleworks.com/catalog/product/view/id/3846/s/002-220/category/53/ (http://ca-cycleworks.com/catalog/product/view/id/3846/s/002-220/category/53/)




Is it an idea to change my vacum fuel pump with an electric one? Would my FCR 41's like it?
(also thinking about fitting an 999 fueltank.... love the look on Radical 9 1/2 )


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Rudemouthsky on September 17, 2014, 02:08:54 PM
I prefer this one for the peace of mind, matches the flow rate of the OG. Probably a good idea if you have future performance mods planned. You'll need a 2-1 splitter. It mounts up same as the OG also with slight modification.

http://www.motoparthub.com/DF62_702_Mikuni_Fuel_Pump_Dual_Outlet_High_Volume?src=Google&gclid=Cj0KEQjw4uSgBRDZveXz9M-E1aoBEiQA2RMP6vPmFQ512IbU0TEFB0tg78XlcQHzDeSew3W4BwFJa-AaAr4j8P8HAQ (http://www.motoparthub.com/DF62_702_Mikuni_Fuel_Pump_Dual_Outlet_High_Volume?src=Google&gclid=Cj0KEQjw4uSgBRDZveXz9M-E1aoBEiQA2RMP6vPmFQ512IbU0TEFB0tg78XlcQHzDeSew3W4BwFJa-AaAr4j8P8HAQ)


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: ducpainter on September 18, 2014, 04:18:36 AM
There's a problem with your links.

They don't even work if you copy and paste.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on September 18, 2014, 04:44:53 AM
Thx guys, I,l consider one of those pumps. :)

Teardown time  [thumbsup]
(http://i1368.photobucket.com/albums/ag164/wiktor69/IMAG0182_zpsbf56bcd0.jpg)

Cannibalizing the old exhaust
(http://i1368.photobucket.com/albums/ag164/wiktor69/IMAG0179_zps21cdedf3.jpg)

(http://i1368.photobucket.com/albums/ag164/wiktor69/IMAG0180_zps1a81ec66.jpg)

The rough idea
(http://i1368.photobucket.com/albums/ag164/wiktor69/IMAG0181_zpsc4966aee.jpg)


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Rudemouthsky on September 18, 2014, 06:24:12 AM
Thx guys, I,l consider one of those pumps. :)

Teardown time  [thumbsup]
(http://i1368.photobucket.com/albums/ag164/wiktor69/IMAG0182_zpsbf56bcd0.jpg)

Cannibalizing the old exhaust
(http://i1368.photobucket.com/albums/ag164/wiktor69/IMAG0179_zps21cdedf3.jpg)

(http://i1368.photobucket.com/albums/ag164/wiktor69/IMAG0180_zps1a81ec66.jpg)

The rough idea
(http://i1368.photobucket.com/albums/ag164/wiktor69/IMAG0181_zpsc4966aee.jpg)

Did a quick scan-back, must've missed something; watcha doing with that exhaust?!?

Oh and re: fuel pump again;  you should explore going electric. The subject has come up a few times and I think either Chris Kelley or Stu or both have done it successfully without hassle, but there isn't much documented. Someone has used an electric pump from a fuelie Monster on a carby and the pressure difference was not an issue, I gotta find that thread...


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on September 18, 2014, 07:00:52 AM
Hi BN.
Here http://www.ducatimonsterforum.org/index.php?topic=68956.0 (http://www.ducatimonsterforum.org/index.php?topic=68956.0) is what you missed ;)

And this is what it looks like now :)
(http://i1368.photobucket.com/albums/ag164/wiktor69/IMAG0184_zps57b51e55.jpg)


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Nibor on September 18, 2014, 01:22:21 PM
Is that just straight through, or mufflered? Will look awesome with the headers cleaned up! Love something simple, light, and loud on my bike, ran it briefly. Couple of times straight out of the midpipes, it's a bit too loud then haha and I know not the best for the engine.


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on September 18, 2014, 02:17:25 PM
It is mufflered like this
(http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL1267/13541045/24236650/409821693.jpg)

The pipe also includes an additional sound supressor and silencer held in place with a snap ring. Easy to take out if you want. Loud or louder :)


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on September 25, 2014, 01:21:01 PM
While waiting for my heads and carbs I hacked of my rear end

(http://i1368.photobucket.com/albums/ag164/wiktor69/IMAG0190_zpscffe99cf.jpg)

The idea is to make a new rear end. A little shorter and a little higher. I'm also planning to use a 999 fueltank... :) And new single rearsets... Any suggestions? Cheep and black :D

I also want to make a new electrical harnes. It must be like 52 meters of unneccasery wires here...

(http://i1368.photobucket.com/albums/ag164/wiktor69/IMAG0203_zpse43dc22e.jpg)

Got my heads and carbs today

(http://i1368.photobucket.com/albums/ag164/wiktor69/IMAG0202_zps12041c59.jpg)

Very glad its like 3 degres celcius and raining here... If not I would be out driving with no rear end and a wire harnes draging.... ;)


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: thorn14 on September 25, 2014, 01:47:23 PM
If you want cheap single rearsets, get them from an ST2 along with the rear brake master lever and mount. Got it all for $70 and then proceeded to change the pegs out for shorter aluminum ones $80 two months later [bang]


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Rudemouthsky on September 25, 2014, 05:14:44 PM
Düb Lüv put cheapo eBay rearsets designed for a 1098 on his Monster with very minimal modification, that's another inexpensive single rearset option. And they actually looked pretty darn good.



Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: ducatigirl100 on September 26, 2014, 02:37:33 PM


I also want to make a new electrical harnes. It must be like 52 meters of unneccasery wires here...

(http://i1368.photobucket.com/albums/ag164/wiktor69/IMAG0203_zpse43dc22e.jpg)


If you want to make  a custom electrical loom.   I made a  tread on a full motogadget loom .. :)


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on September 27, 2014, 01:06:55 AM
Nice work ducatigirl100 :)

Have looked at this system.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Thunder-Heart-Performance-Electronic-Harness-Controller-D-Model-EA4250D-/231201101903?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item35d4a8d84f&vxp=mtr (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Thunder-Heart-Performance-Electronic-Harness-Controller-D-Model-EA4250D-/231201101903?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item35d4a8d84f&vxp=mtr)

Any thoughts on it?


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Rudemouthsky on September 27, 2014, 03:14:22 AM
Nice work ducatigirl100 :)

Have looked at this system.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Thunder-Heart-Performance-Electronic-Harness-Controller-D-Model-EA4250D-/231201101903?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item35d4a8d84f&vxp=mtr (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Thunder-Heart-Performance-Electronic-Harness-Controller-D-Model-EA4250D-/231201101903?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item35d4a8d84f&vxp=mtr)

Any thoughts on it?

From the brief description it doesn't sound nearly as comprehensive as the m-unit. Personally I would drop the (somewhat) small amount of extra coin:

http://store.revivalcycles.com/products/motogadget-m-unit-controller (http://store.revivalcycles.com/products/motogadget-m-unit-controller)

Aside from the practically infinite modular/expandability potential of the m-unit it has really slick touches like a billet housing and other beautiful details.

But thanks for posting that...I hadn't even thought to seek out an "out of the box" alternative to the m-unit.



Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on October 06, 2014, 03:52:13 AM
Mocking up the 999 tank...

(http://i1368.photobucket.com/albums/ag164/wiktor69/Mobile%20Uploads/IMAG0220_zps4f78febe.jpg)


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on October 06, 2014, 03:56:00 AM
From the brief description it doesn't sound nearly as comprehensive as the m-unit. Personally I would drop the (somewhat) small amount of extra coin:

http://store.revivalcycles.com/products/motogadget-m-unit-controller (http://store.revivalcycles.com/products/motogadget-m-unit-controller)

Aside from the practically infinite modular/expandability potential of the m-unit it has really slick touches like a billet housing and other beautiful details.

But thanks for posting that...I hadn't even thought to seek out an "out of the box" alternative to the m-unit.



You'r welcome BN. I agree, would prefere MG's soulution, but for now I'm going to make the best og the original wiring and make a box for everything up front, were the huge original airfilter box used to be :)


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on December 01, 2014, 12:06:59 AM
A little update from Norway :)


(http://i1368.photobucket.com/albums/ag164/wiktor69/M900_zps1c85a9ec.jpg)

Front mudguard chopped to size. Rear frame modifyed to fit my homemade fiberglas rear-end.

On the "todo-list"... Finding right color to go on the 999 fueltank, making brackets for the front mud-guard and the head-light, lowering the clutch/brake reservoir, paint the rear cuts and powdercoating the frame black :D


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on October 19, 2017, 01:44:25 AM
Havent got much time for my M900 due to moving, work etc but now it is almost ready :)

(https://t4.cptr.no/th/3/7ac3ca8e-e3cb-45de-b19c-730825862066?area=1280&clip=1&pri=1&auth=RsCQKEC2QDiCUxGhMpqgAQVf2rZuTZipqVhIUbnwH&key=KVEz-WDMsj)


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Pinion on October 19, 2017, 03:33:32 AM
 [thumbsup]
 [popcorn]


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: GK on October 19, 2017, 09:36:27 PM
That frame looks lovely as is, beautiful contrast to the black.

Just my opinion!


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: Graymonster on October 19, 2017, 10:26:14 PM
That frame looks lovely as is, beautiful contrast to the black.

Just my opinion!

The frame is newly painted so in my opinion your right  [thumbsup]


Title: Re: More power in my M900 -98
Post by: GK on October 20, 2017, 12:46:46 PM
Cool!

I thought you were going to paint it black.


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