Hi guys,
I bought a non running '09 monster with under 500 miles but not running.
It was sitting on the parking lot in army base for few years. In very hot sun, rain and sand storms.
Its a bit faded from the sun, there is sand everywhere on the engine, handlebar switches, etc.
The bike does not run, it does not turn over starter at all, just a strong "click". Just purchased new battery and still nothing.
When in neutral, bike rolls no problem but when in the gear, it moves only few inches back and forth but engine does not seem to move at all unless clutch is squeezed. I hope engine is not seized.
This is what i had done so far:
1. Checked cluster menu, i see no errors.
2. Clutch lever didn't work smooth so i flushed the fluid and it seems better now.
3. Disconnected all electrical connectors and lubed with automotive electronic lube
4. Opened handlebar switches and lubed them as well and they are all functional
5. Air filter was split open on one side and was also black as if it was close to the heat
6. There is a bit of sand in the air-box, not much, i hope that some didn't get into the engine.
7. Took off timing belt covers to check for timing but could not rotate the engine to align the marks as it requires specialty socket/wrench. I did put it in gear and try pushing but the engine didn't move.
In the Manual states that in some instances the system would lock the engine, what does that mean?
Is this mechanical lock or electronic?
Any suggestions as to where i should be starting?
Thanks
Sasha
Get the bike up on a rear stand, remove the spark plugs, put the bike in gear and see if the engine now turns with the rear wheel. With the plugs in you are fighting compression. Before attempting to start make sure there is no sand anywhere in the intake system. Also make sure the timing belts are not older than two years before starting. Expect the fuel to be stale.
I'll have to remove the air box to inspect everything.
I didn't remove the plugs and just by pushing it forward and backward, it would move a little and it would seem as it hit something and stop.
But by pushing a bit more, it would move but I don't think the engine turned.
Do you know what "engine lock" is that is mentioned in the owners manual.
Supposedly depending on the error, engine can get locked.
Thanks
No idea what they mean by "engine lock", the light tells you something wrong in the engine management system. There is no engine mechanical lock on the bike.
You won't be able to move the bike in gear very easily with the plugs in.
There would be slight resistance with plugs removed.
As Howie said you will want to check the state of the belts and it's a virtual guarantee they need to be replaced.
You can confirm the valve timing hasn't jumped by moving the horizontal cylinder to TDC and verifying
belt pulley marks align with marks on engine case.
If the motor won't turn with the plugs out you can graduate immediately to the advanced course.
Bike only moves slightly but then it's a clunk! As if there is a bind somewhere.
It could have stuck or bent valve.
Belts are definitely as old as the bike as it it has 487 miles on it and they will be replaced as long as get to turn the engine to align timing marks and I'll try removing plugs today.
If not, my next step is to remove belts one by one and try rotating cam pulleys one by one and see what if they will turn and if not, I'll know for sure it's internal and heads will come off.
Can vertical head be removed with engine in the frame?
Any suggestions on workshop/service manual?
Thanks
Removed the plugs, got into one of the upper gears, moved bike forward, it didn't move at all.
Moved the bike backward and the engine stated rotating, I could hear some compression from the plug holes however, after about 1/4 turn, the engine stopped moving, it feels as if something is not letting the engine move further.
It has to be stuck or bent valve or maybe engine seized.
I can't turn it enough to get the crank timing mark on the line.
I will start by removing belts one by one and see which cam does not turn.
I read on here somewhere that some of these engines were bending valves in the horizontal head.
Thanks guys!
Ok, now we are getting somewhere,
I took off the belt off of horizontal head and I could easily spin that pulley but when I took off vertical head belt, I can only turn it maybe 1/4 turn and very hard too.
I looked inside where cams are but can't see anything wrong.
It seems that I'll have to take the head off, I wish it was the horizontal one as it would come off easy. Vertical one will not clear the frame, the engine needs to be tilted if possible or come out completely.
for some reason, what I had written did not post, it was right after seevtsaab post.
since you have now moved the timing you WILL need the manual to correctly time it again!!!
try to put both cylinders in TDC and then turn the crank . . . it seems you are in a rush to get it running one way or the other but, my advice, before continuing to strip the engine apart, get a manual
REALLY wished you had waited a little longer and I would have said to spray the cylinders with a little WD40 to "loosen up" the rings
I made marks and put things back the way they were.
Engine barely moved an inch (and it moved easily so I don't think it stuck)so I can still use some wd40 and I though of that but if H head cam can turn and the V cam doesn't, it's definitely an issue with the head itself.
Thanks
If the piston is at or near TDC you won't be able to turn the cam
It is very easy to screw up these engines when you are not intimately familiar with there internal workings. They are not like valve spring engines.
Ok, any thoughts on why would the engine not turn?
Something is hitting something and not letting the things turn, it is audible too, metal on metal sound.
Crank is not on the mark as I can't turn the engine enough to get it there.
Maybe it's the valve lifters that stuck, I'm still waiting to find manual.
I washed it and got all sand out of it. Removed tank and air box.
Nothing else to do until I get the manual.
The cam lobes and the rocker arms do a close order drill as the engine operates. You can have things positioned such that you can measure the clearances, but you can not move the rocker over enough to free the opener shim. A little more rotation back or forth can move the closer cam enough to allow the opener rocker to slide over to release the opener shim. Then to release the closer shim more dancing is required. If the motor will not turn one of the rockers is bumping into one of the cam lobes. Removing the timing belts allows the cams to move independent of the crank, so that the cams and rockers are free to to be fiddled with without the crank being involved.
Clear?
Very clear Spike,
That is what i attempted to do, move the opening rocker over so i can rotate the cam.
Only problem is i can't turn the cam pulley enough to get rocker arm loose enough to slide it over. Cam pulley barely turns 1/3 of the turn and hard too. Vertical head cam pulley turns much easier.
There is a bind somewhere, either in the rocker arms, maybe there is no valve clearance or valve is simply bent.
I can see the exhaust valve and rockers moving up and down but not intake.
I downloaded the manual and ordered some tools and will try again but i think ill have to remove the head and see what is going on in there.
To bad it isn't the vertical head, this way i'll have to remove engine to get the head off.
Thanks
Good luck! You might leave the rear mount in place and just rotate the engine down in front......
That's what I was hoping for, swing arm can stay in that case too?
I got spoiled with my honda cbx where I can tilt the engine and do anything I want.
I'm also thinking if there could also be something else like seized starter it something in the transmission but I think it all points to the valve train.
Rear brake is seized, not sure yet if it's master or caliper. Clutch lever needs to be pumped so it works. I changed the fluid but it seems that I'll have to open the master and at least clean it up if not rebuild it.
Needs new drive chain as this one is rusty and has I rings coming out, front sprocket is also rusty but it can be cleaned out.
I'm definitely in for a bunch of work!
I appreciate all the input
Wait a minute- why would you need to remove the motor to get the head off?
It doesn't look like the head will clear the frame to come off.
This is vertical head in question, if it was horizontal, it would of been a breeze.
Luckily per your tip that the engine can just be tilted a bit, it may end up easy, we will see
Ok so I haven't removed the head yet as the tool I received was wrong so I'm waiting for another one.
What I did in the mean time is I tried to see why vertical head intake valve wasn't moving.
So I took the clip off and slid opening rocker to the side.
The valve was very tight, I think that head is in TDC and the pulley should spin when opening rockers are moved to the side but, the pulley is very hard to move. Maybe 1/4 -1/2 turn only.
Horizontal head pulley, when belt removed, spins easily.
Crank also turns 3/4-full turn until it stops.
There is no valve gap/lash on the intake at all.
So I removed the rods that hold both rocker arms in order to remove it.
Once I did so valve does go freely up and down and I can see exhaust valve do the same.
Why would the head pulley be hard to turn?
Also the crank. Am I looking in wrong place?
Maybe it's the transmission, clutch center nut or ?
What else should I be checking before i disassemble the engine!
Any input appreciated