Ducati Monster Forum

After tweaking everything I can think of on my new (to me)  M1100 evo in the last couple of months, I've run out of practical items to work on.

So now it's time for the impractical.  [laugh]

I've noticed that the PC-v has the ability to integrate speed sensor data. With the combination of rpm data  gathered from the TPS and speed,  you can calibrate setpoints for gear specific fuel maps.

With a dual channel autotune already installed and advanced independent cylinder maps already functioning, enabling gear specific mapping should allow me to develop a "supermap" with a crazy 12 different fueling tables for the bike (one for each gear and cylinder)

Has anyone else been insane enough to try this? The logic makes sense in my head but I'm not sure if the autotune is capable of providing gear specific trim information.

Also the idea is for the PC-V to tap into the existing speed sensor that registers to the dash. My bike has 2 speed sensors. Does anyone know which one does this? Is it the back wheel or the front? The speed sensors on my bike are ridiculously inaccurate but for this to work precision is more important than accuracy. For the computer to establish what gear I'm in, the speed data has to be exactly the same as the dash input.

Any input would be appreciated.

Just don't tell me how stupid I am for trying this. I already know.

Here's a suggestion.

Use the Bazzaz system as a reference point as it comes with all this standard.
The Bazzaz system does this by tapping into the speed sensor and neutral light wire and more. I got a unit for my Hyper and it has a whole other loom enabling this, for map by map, gear for gear,tuning to perfection. I ended up not using it, but the options for tuning in all those parameters including speed shifters, traction control, etc are amazing.

I suggest going on the Bazzaz site and checking the wiring/installation  instructions to get an idea of what is involved. The Bazzaz unit I got had seven connection points while the PCV had three. It read everything.

Then you can check out the Dynojet site to see what accessories are available that will piggy back your unit.

Just a suggestion on a way forward for research.

why do you think it would be useful?

I got the power commander and a dual channel autotune for less than 500 dollars combined. I'm sure the bazaaz is better but I'm a thrifty person and the damage is already done. No sense dwelling on it now. Plus there are more dynojet tuners in my area in case i wanted to tune it on the dyno. I dont expect to but the flexibility has its benefits. 

As for why I think it would be useful. I dont know. It might not be at all. If its a matter of positappping a speed sensor and just running 5 dollars worth of wire, why not?

Do you think it would be worse? I'm still just poking around about the idea so anyone who has experience, please chime in.

Ideally my goal is to install a handlebar switch that will allow me to switch from a fuel economy map to a power map on the fly. Figured I'd just develop the maps first.

From a wiring and accessories perspective. Its already laid out standard so EEL can see  it  conceptually. He can then see what parts he needs from DJ.

Or you asking EEL? In that case he's a perfectionist.  ;D

EEL Im not suggesting you get a Bazzaz, but look at the Bazzaz layout to emulate with PCV accessories.
I went with the basic PCV because the wiring was cleaner and for the other reasons you mentioned. Dynojet dynos are everywhere. [thumbsup]

a fuel economy map and a power map are the same thing.  it's called good mapping.

So the switch is a gimmick?

Mapping for each gear would be seeking perfection I guess.

Ah...now I get it.. Good Idea!

I was going to place a call into Dynojet today. I didn't even think about the neutral condition and how the maps account for that. Looking at the PC-V Instructions. I cant figure out if it even does.

this should be repeated.   [thumbsup]

That could go in the proverbs thread.

Microtech ecu, that is all.   ;)

How can a economy map and power map be the same when stock in the closed area shoots for 14.7 and the pcv optimizers shoot for 13.6

 [popcorn].

Kind of where I am now with DP closed loop for economy and PCV map in open loop range for power. It is a significant compromise.

I guess if you want the whole range for power or economy without compromise the switch would be good? I think they mean mapping for power when the throttle position asks for it and economy in low load ranges.
Does that sound correct?

Hey EEL, how's it going? Tried anything with this yet?

I'm curious about all this as I'm an old carb guy learning about EFI and interested in the different opinions on the idea.

I've been slammed at work lately. 12 hour days just to keep up with the workload.

Generally working before Dynojet opens and still working after dynojet closes.
Every time I call there's a half hour wait for support.

Got the day off today so hopefully I can get some answers from them.

Talked to Power commander support. Here is the response

1) Positap from the signal side of the speed sensor gets routed directly to the power commander 5. The support guys said 3rd input from the left on the terimal bus..I will have to look at the PC-V instructions to confirm. The unit has a weather proof jacket inside that you need to punch out with the paperclip before install the wire into the Power commander unit.

2) The autotune will work with the PC-V with respect to gear specific inputs. For those who have a PC-V with autotune, you're aware of the trim tables per cylinder. Basically you would now have 12 trim tables (6 tables per cylinder) if you use a power commander AT-300 dual channel autotune unit.

3) As for neutral. There is a gear selection input built into the power commander but since the ducati monster doesnt really know what gear its in and has no such input, you have to just utilize RPM and speed data. According to the rep I talked to, the PC-V algorithm defaults to the 1st gear map if it does not know what gear its in (like in neutral).

4) As for calibration. You physically input the data for the range of speed and RPM for each gear by calibrating the system at a specific speed. The power commander rep just pointed me to the help inside the power commander software.

5) Wire: Power commander rep suggested 18 to 22 gauge wiring for the positap. Basically the biggest size you could fit thru the weather proof tap on the PC-V

Seems like this would be a doable task with minimal material cost (posi-tap and wire). The rest is just messing with the power commander software using a laptop.

Life and work is getting in the way but looks like this might be a late summer or winter project for me.

Very cool. [thumbsup]