Since the day I picked up my 796 ABS from the previous owner, the front brakes have always been a little... uh, grabby, or maybe lumpy? I didn't think much of it... this is my first (relatively) high performance non-Japanese bike, maybe things are different. Riding it around town isn't any big deal, but if I have to grab a handful of front brake, it definitely talks to you, and if you one-finger it, you can actually see the lever pulsing. This is not (I feel) because the ABS is activating... I'm no where near wheel lock or slip. When I first got the bike, I took it to a parking lot with sand in it and fooled with the ABS just to know what it was going to feel like... and it's not this.
Last night, headed up the back road to get Italian food, with my nice, new Rosso's on, I was riding a little harder than I have before... braking a little later into the corners... and very quickly realizing something isn't right. This thing is a freaking handful trying to brake and then quickly transition into a corner... you have to be completely off the front brake or the bike is so unsettled I wind up spoding into the corner.
I haven't had a chance to jack the front end up and look at the rotors, which is my first thought. I'm assuming the 796 has floating rotors? Are there any other common problems with the fronts (ABS or non) that I need to be looking at? Certainly the brakes have never been bled out, it's on the 'to do' list. I just had the tires replaced, but it's been doing that all along, not just since the tire change.
I'm kind of at a loss, here... this was something I didn't expect. Any pointers would be welcomed...
It could be that the rotor buttons are dirty. It could be the rotors are warped/bent. It could be that there is uneven material deposition on the rotors from the pads. If the bike was owned by someone that drove in stop and go traffic the rotors have a hard spot on them from heat soaking.
Was it this bad before the tire change?
All of the above happens frequently :(
The rotors are "semi floating", but not nearly floating enough to come even close to the real advantages of full floaters, IMO.
The 796 fork isn't made for really aggressive riding, progressive springs and poor damping. You could try trail braking to have more dive/geometry control, but that isn't very safe on the street - especially with poor damping.
I'm extremely impressed with my fully floating Brembo HP series rotors. Heat control, feel, wear. There are other brands by our sponsors where you get full floating for the price of OEM semi floating. Just something to think about if replacing is required....
Something definitely not right there. Pulsing? ??? Mine's more than adequate. See what you find, otherwise maybe run down to the Dallas dealer and ride another bike for comparison. Fluid ever changed? ??? Let us know what you find.
Quote from: ducpainter on April 23, 2016, 07:30:02 AM
Was it this bad before the tire change?
Yes and no.... I didn't ride it as hard as I'm doing now.
QuoteAll of the above happens frequently
Is the Monster THAT bad???? I bought the 796 thinking it had an adjustable front fork, which it doesn't have... but are the brakes really so inadequate?
QuoteFluid ever changed?
As I said, no. It's on the list, and quickly moving up. Same with a pad change.
I put it up on the jack tonight, there are no obvious hot spots or warping, they look fairly true to me. There is slightly more discoloration on the left (off) side rotor than the right side.... Soon's I get a chance, I'll replace the pads and bleed down the lines.
Maybe you are right... test drive something similar and see if it acts the same way. My problem is... if I test drive something like a MST... I might be trading in the Monster....
The brakes are more than adequate. DP summed it up, stuck buttons, blade or carrier run out (quite possible after a tire change), hard spots, uneven pad transfer to the blade or even, if you are fully bottoming the forks on braking, suspension.
First I would try cleaning all the buttons and confirm they move. It will take effort to move them since they are semi floating.Then, with a Scochbrite pad and brake cleaner clean the rotors. Sand your pads and put a slight bevel on the top, bottom and leading edge. Pray to the Brake Gods, then go out and bed them in.
Quote from: howie on April 23, 2016, 11:41:34 PM
The brakes are more than adequate.
Correct me if I'm wrong..., but the brakes are the same pair on an 1100 EVO. I'm riding most often with two pals on EVO's who've never mentioned any dissatisfaction. They wait for me at crossroads and stoplights. ;D
Psssst... The fork isn't bad, BUT the stock Sachs shock/spring IS. Change that and the fork gets TONS better. 8) If you need a change of damping and are 200#, change the fork oil from Shell Advance 7.5W to Red Line 10W. http://www.redlineoil.com/Products.aspx?pcid=18 (http://www.redlineoil.com/Products.aspx?pcid=18)
PS. Another pal with an MST, 796, R1200RT, Bonneville SE, and F650 something or other thinks his 796 is dandy. Something ain't right with yours. ???
Quote from: howie on April 23, 2016, 11:41:34 PM
The brakes are more than adequate. DP summed it up, stuck buttons, blade or carrier run out (quite possible after a tire change), hard spots, uneven pad transfer to the blade or even, if you are fully bottoming the forks on braking, suspension.
First I would try cleaning all the buttons and confirm they move. It will take effort to move them since they are semi floating.Then, with a Scochbrite pad and brake cleaner clean the rotors. Sand your pads and put a slight bevel on the top, bottom and leading edge. Pray to the Brake Gods, then go out and bed them in.
No, the fork doesn't bottom... I have a zip tie on one of the legs and it never has bottomed. I'll going to replace the pads as a precaution, and take a look at the rotors with the wheel off the bike.
Quoteblade or carrier run out (quite possible after a tire change),
Talk to me about that... Damage from mounting the tire, or from not properly reinstalling the wheel?
Mounting the tire. The carriers often are not that rigid. If the person mounting the tire uses the rotor as a fulcrum for a lever this could happen. On a newish bike like yours I would first try cleaning. Where I worked we had a bunch of warranty Lexus rotors that were replaced under warranty for pulsation. These were donated so students had rotors to practice measuring and machining. All were in spec.
If you do replace pads make sure you clean all the old pad material off and re_bed properly.
Quote from: ducpainter on April 24, 2016, 10:02:22 AM
If you do replace pads make sure you clean all the old pad material off and re_bed properly.
Copy that.
Anyone have a good suggestion on a good set of pads? I have a hard time deciphering the advertising BS to find out what I really need. This bike is street only, no track days anytime soon (although I would like to change that.)
Pad type depends a bit on what sort of behavior you want.
Quite a while ago I switched from whatever the stock Brembo pads were over to Ferodo Platinums, and really liked them.
Less touchy, but still plenty of power.
I've been using Dunlop Pads for a long time and like them. I believe they give more initial bite than the Ferodos.
Usually a manufacturers line up will have a pad you like.
I'm a Dunlap fan too. The DP HH, similar to EBC HH, but, IMO, gentler bite and better feel.
http://www.dp-brakes.com/Shop/p-2-SDP-SPORT-HH.html (http://www.dp-brakes.com/Shop/p-2-SDP-SPORT-HH.html)
Also a slim possibility: When a bike is being wheeled onto a bike lift (at least the lifts I've seen), the 320mm Ducati rotors can actually enter the clamp part which is only supposed to hold the wheel. *IF* that has happened and an inattentive technician tightened down the clamp, a bent rotor is the result.
Again for disclaimers sake: Slim, slim possibility.
Right on. I'll have more time to look at them this weekend in the daylight. I've got new pads on the way, too.
I went on a ride Monday night, and the pulsing didn't seem so bad... of course, I wasn't using them as hard as I was the week previously... so that sort of points to the buttons, I'm thinking, or the fluid.
Fluid won't cause pulsation.
That's right... air in the line causes the brakes to drag or mush, not pulse.