Ducati Monster Forum

Nothing to report yet, except that Roger Hayden (AMA SBK) will be racing with #9.5 instead of his usual #95 due to the fact he lost half his pinky.

  [laugh] OL

Is TV coverage limited to the Craptastic Broadcasting Network at 2 pm PST?

I believe so.  Speed will have the AMA superbike race though.  Now would be a good time to get the motogp.com sub for 60% off.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BgKexiT2xsI

FP1, stoner up by half a second

http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2008/Jul/080718e.htm

Man, Stoner was retarded fast.

"Stoner blitzes first practice at Laguna" (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/69246)

 [popcorn]

Mladin Faster On Superbike Than Suzuki MotoGP Bike In First Session Times (http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2008/Jul/080718g.htm)

FP2 starts in 5 minutes

when and what channel is moto gp for laguna seca shown on?

Why was FP2 interrupted? [popcorn]

West had a crash and the airfence had to be replaced.

Glad I didn't pay to go this year.  It looks like its gonna be another snoozer if Stoner keeps up his "retarded fast" pace.  Nicky might sniff a podium finally.   [thumbsup]  I'll be rooting for that at least.   :)


They decided "what was the point?" if Stoner keeps running a second clear of the field.... but yeah, Ant West had a rough crash and tore up the air fence.

CBS @ 2pm PST.

FP2

1. Casey Stoner (Ducati), Bridgestone, 1:21.826
2. Nicky Hayden (Honda), Michelin, 1:22.634
3. Valentino Rossi (Yamaha), Bridgestone, 1:22.769
4. Alex De Angelis (Honda), Bridgestone, 1:22.808
5. Chris Vermeulen (Suzuki), Bridgestone, 1:22.847
6. Shinya Nakano (Honda), Bridgestone, 1:22.924
7. Colin Edwards (Yamaha), Michelin, 1:23.077
8. Andrea Dovizioso (Honda), Michelin, 1:23.097
9. Toni Elias (Ducati), Bridgestone, 1:23.114
10. Loris Capirossi (Suzuki), Bridgestone, 1:23.185
11. Ben Spies (Suzuki), Bridgestone, 1:23.244
12. Marco Melandri (Ducati), Bridgestone, 1:23.317
13. Jorge Lorenzo (Yamaha), Michelin, 1:23.415
14. Sylvain Guintoli (Ducati), Bridgestone, 1:23.495
15. Dani Pedrosa (Honda), Michelin, 1:23.707
16. James Toseland (Yamaha), Michelin, 1:23.943
17. Randy De Puniet (Honda), Michelin, 1:23.955
18. Jamie Hacking (Kawasaki), Bridgestone, 1:24.371
19. Anthony West (Kawasaki), Bridgestone, 1:24.483, crash

Gap 1-2 = Gap 2-13+

Inmake the beast with two backsincredible.  :o

must be the bike.... ;D

 [laugh] [laugh] [laugh] [laugh] [laugh] [laugh] [laugh]

Gracias amigo! [thumbsup]

34 minutes to go in FP3, Spies in 4th!  1:23:449

...stoner just hit the :21s

FP3

..marco!?

1. Casey Stoner (Ducati), Bridgestone, 1:21.461
2. Valentino Rossi (Yamaha), Bridgestone, 1:22.168
3. Shinya Nakano (Honda), Bridgestone, 1:22.343
4. Chris Vermeulen (Suzuki), Bridgestone, 1:22.533
5. Marco Melandri (Ducati), Bridgestone, 1:22.758
6. Nicky Hayden (Honda), Michelin, 1:22.770
7. Alex De Angelis (Honda), Bridgestone, 1:22.833
8. Jorge Lorenzo (Yamaha), Michelin, 1:22.967
9. Loris Capirossi (Suzuki), Bridgestone, 1:22.988
10. Andrea Dovizioso (Honda), Michelin, 1:23.138
11. Ben Spies (Suzuki), Bridgestone, 1:23.171
12. Sylvain Guintoli (Ducati), Bridgestone, 1:23.179
13. Colin Edwards (Yamaha), Michelin, 1:23.233
14. Toni Elias (Ducati), Bridgestone, 1:23.234
15. James Toseland (Yamaha), Michelin, 1:23.338
16. Randy De Puniet (Honda), Michelin, 1:23.358
17. Jamie Hacking (Kawasaki), Bridgestone, 1:23.663
18. Anthony West (Kawasaki), Bridgestone, 1:24.165

oh, and rossi re-signed with yamaha through 2010

I'm pretty sure that Marco, De Angelis, Nakano, Hayden, Lorenzo and Capirossi set their fast times on Qs. 

Rossi, Stoner, Spies and Vermuelen I'm pretty sure did not as they were able to string together consistently fast lap times and were some of the only ones able to do so.  Rossi looked particularly good at the end of the session when he ran a string of low 1.22s together to finish the session.

Tomorrow I'm looking for Stoner, Rossi, Vermuelen, Spies to be running up towards the front with Stoner most likely dominating the race, but hopefully Rossi will be able to give him some competition.

pedro just went home

Michelin: weather forecast?  they can do that?

http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2008/Jul/080719g5.htm

Cut slicks.

That's gonna suck.

QP is running.. retarded fast continues.

qualifying results.  stoner pulls out a :20... geezus.

(http://7mzdt.com/images/laguna08qp.gif)

Qualy is a little misleading though. Unless it heats up like crazy tomorrow, I don't think you'll see a Michelin finisher higher than 8th or 9th - their selection is THAT bad.

I think it's gonna be a 2-horse race with Stoner likely taking it.  Vermuelen in 3rd, Spies in 5th.  You heard it here first.

Great article about Stoner on Motorcycle Daily
http://www.motorcycledaily.com/18july08_stoner.htm

well... it's an article alright...   [laugh]

WTF? The bike never even gets a mention >:(





 [laugh]

the michelin tire situation at laguna is downright embarrassing.

http://superbikeplanet.com/2008/Jul/080719g5.htm

http://superbikeplanet.com/2008/Jul/080718rn.htm

http://superbikeplanet.com/2008/Jul/080719rn.htm

(http://superbikeplanet.com/image/2008/MGP/laguna/cutslick.jpg)

(http://www.rideontwo.com/gallery/d/38016-1/mgp_2008_07_19_Laguna+Seca_RandydePuniet_4798_crop.jpg)

on friday night, i threw $10 into a "pick the podium" pool. i said "i'm really temped to take stoner, rossi, and the mole" but then took stoner, rossi, hayden. man am i pissed.

we didn't hear anything about the tires on friday, but it was the talk of the track yesterday.

furthermore, with all the hayden/ducati talk going around, i'm hoping that nicky takes tires into consideration and ends up on the italian team.

i was sorry to see pedro go. without something catastrophic happening to rossi or stoner, this has just become a two horse race.

ok, off to breakfast. i gotta meet peeps at the track in a few hours.  [cheeky]

I don't know about it being a great article.  If I would've turned that in to one of my journalism professors, they would've probably kicked me out of the class.  It's embarrassingly poorly written.

As for the content.  Yes, Stoner is a great rider.  No, I doubt he needs a BJ from a journo.

Make sure you are in front of a TV to watch this race!  History gents.....history.  Stoner is faster on race tires(1' 21.2") than the rest of the field, except Rossi(1' 21.1") on QUALIFYING RUBBER!!! :o

How'd ya like that  [bacon]?

Rossi: `To stop Stoner, you´d have to shoot him´ (http://www.motogp.com/en/news/2008/Rossi+To+stop+Stoner+you+d+have+to+shoot+him)

I would expect that kind of statement from Hayden or Edwards, but from Rossi its downright hilarious. [laugh]

Rossi Quote " When Casey is is fit and everything is OK, he can strike fear into everybody's hearts. What he does with the Ducati is something almost supernatural"

Interesting to see Stoner making multiple mistakes today.  Rossi ran a very precise race to pull that off.  Never gave Stoner an inch.  That was one of the best fights I've seen in a long time.  Wow.

I hope the rest of the season is like Laguna.  I was afraid of another snoozer.... man I'm glad I was wrong.

Two horse race? WHat makes you think that? I mean SURE you dump the bike and are able to remount and not lose 2nd place but it wasn't like they were THAT far ahead of the pack.  [laugh] [popcorn] [bacon]

Looks like the joke was on Stoner...lol.

It's nothing new to see Stoner make mistakes when he's behind. If that bike didn't have an obvious edge in power I don't think he'd be in the top 2. Pure rider ability goes to Rossi, Pedrosa, then maybe Stoner. On that bike though Stoner is almost superhuman. It's a perfect match for him and I'm sure with the lack of ability to fully develop multiple bikes Ducati puts all their eggs in that basket.

It's one thing to run fast lap times, it's another to have to break your line and adjust to another rider in front of you.

Woulda coulda shoulda though Stoner and that bike are one awesome combo. This championship is going to go down to the last race. Rossi better not sleep.

That was the greatest race I've seen in a while. Today's Formula 1 was equally awesome. My heart is still pounding. [bacon] [bacon]

GO 46!!!! ;D

I was pulling for a last lap dice between Stoner and Rossi, but oh well.  Great race  [thumbsup].

see stoner's post-race interview?

now who's whining?   ;)


helluva race.  can't believe they both stayed upright in the corkscrew.
i said early on that if rossi can stay out front long enough, stoner will be pressured into a mistake....
awesome race.  well.. for 1st and 2nd.
 

[thumbsup] for ben spies.

What a little pregnant dog Stoner was at the post race interviews, complaining about Rossi passing him. I think Stoner has got used to blasting off into the distance without having to fight for his wins and when someone makes him work for it he cannot handle it.

Rossi was his usual relaxed self at the interview (win or lose) but who knows what he said afterwards in Italian. Anyone know?

yep.

Rossi is unreal!  He ran a perfect race to keep Stoner at bay.  Knew once Stoner ran wide in T2 it was only a matter of time before he ran off again.  It seemed he was trying hard on the straight to get by.  Or at least check his draft and timing for the line if it came to that on the last lap.  I told my wife it was only a matter of time before one of them went down considering how hard they were going at it.  Awesome race!!!

Can't take anything away from Stoner.  He was in it to win it.  Made Rossi work for it.  Given his times through out the weekend, and the power of the Duc, he should have won.  But Rossi had other things in mind.

Nicky isn't worth a mention but I'm stoked Spies got 8th.  Good showing for good old Ben!

Stoner whining..

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/motorsport/motorbikes/7516543.stm (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/motorsport/motorbikes/7516543.stm)

http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2008/Jul/080720H.htm

Rossi congratulated Stoner in the cool-off area after the race but got a lecture back on the rough passes. Rossi reportedly smiled and simply said "That's racing, Casey".

Wow, just wow.  Stoner wants nothing to do with Rossi.  Intresting...  [coffee]

Bout damn time.  Their relationship has been far too civil for my tastes.  I want to see the fire that former rivals ignited in Rossi and vice versa.  This is when the racing gets good.  A few run offs, a few fairing touches, some flying elbows.  That is exciting stuff.

I agree that this could prove to be a lasting feud.  I just hope that Stoner is mental tougher than Biaggi and doesn't alway crash when he gets frustrated by Rossi.  GM2 called Stoner cracking under the pressure, but I hope he can clear his head before Brno.

GAHDAMMIT!!  WTF..was the race on CBS again?!  I don't have anything on TiVO!!   >:( >:( >:( >:(

Sounded like it was a great race though! 

DAMMIT!!  I can't believe I missed it!!   :-\

rather than using a season pass (channel-specific), if you use a wishlist ('MotoGP' and 'Moto GP') this won't happen.

racing-underground.com

or i have the file here.. .but it's 1.2gb.  don't think i'll be sending it anywhere  ;)

Man..Stoner didn't even shake Rossi's hand.  Not cool!  I understand he was pissed but..it's racing.




GM2..thanks!!   [thumbsup]

Reminds me of two other guys.... Gibe and Biaggi  [cheeky]

What a little pregnant dog Stoner is.  This is why I don't like him.  It's never "I just didn't have it today" or "congrats on an amazing race," no it's gotta be "Rossi's passes were too close" or "my forks are being sabotaged" or "my bike didn't have it."  Man up.

Well, we'll never see him in WSBK that's for sure.  He'd be complaining to the FIM after every corner.

Iz, I can burn you a dvd and send it in the mail...if you don't wanna do the whole bit torrent deal

i can't believe he hasn't already, especially since we told him the exact same thing after the last time this happened to him (and the time before, if i remember correctly).

Hey gm2, how about you sne dme a DVD in the mail [clap] , thanks buddy [thumbsup]

Yes, I had a motorcycle racing on my wishlist set before I left Seattle Dad.  For some reason, it didn't work.  Actually, a few things changed on the Tivo since the move.  The s/o's shows haven't been taping either.  

Brix..thanks for the offer. 

close your eyes.

imagine an envelope.

https://www.racing-underground.com/dwld.ru/11134/MotoGP.2008.Round11.USA.Laguna.Seca.Race.PDTV.Eurosport.XviD.English-asd.avi.torrent

 [laugh] [clap]

so how does this work???  My computer won't play it  :'(

I also was hoping for a DVD with hearts drawn on it or something  :-*  you know, a personal touch  :-*

 :-*

Here's the best part.  On Casey's own website, in his forums for his fans, they're even calling him out for acting like such a little pregnant dog.  And these aren't guys who just registered either, these are his old fans talking about how disappointed in him they are.

Now that Rossi is firmly in his head, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to see Stoner push too hard and throw it away.

Some Rossi quotage after the race.

And Casey's reply ;)

watch the AMA sbk race?  mladin basically said that watching rossi was so inspiring he.. had to ride like he did.

the bike was awesome..... how it stayed running and all.



man, Jorge got some hang time..... he should be riding for Jordan.

Everybody but Casey is in awe of the racing today.  Apparently, Casey would prefer it if they just rode single file from start to finish.  I bet he uses the bumpers when he bowls too.

I'd like to say that Rossi is getting in his head and Stoner is going to crack but there's still quite a few races left. I'm rooting for Rossi to reclaim what's rightfully his but it's too early to count Stoner out.

Pedro on the other hand... [laugh]

Oh and yeah go Spies! I think he did great considering the circumstance. I'm actually hoping he goes to either Honda, Ducati or someone better than Suzuki in GP. Maybe he can team up with Repsol with Nicky leaving to Ducati perhaps? We'll see.

i'm almost disappointed that this is the start of the summer break and that the impact of what rossi did this weekend will be minimized.

i remarked to a buddy of mine at the race today that "wouldn't it be funny if rossi had been sandbagging the entire weekend to give stoner a false sense of security, only to go wheel to wheel with him during the race and break him?"


the kid can race and i really feel for him. he tried this weekend and only withdrew from the race when he couldn't make it through 9 laps of practice.

look at nicky's finishing position and think about what a healthy pedro could've done on the track. it would've been nice for him to have grabbed some points instead of dropping two rounds and the championship lead.


the only person that's gonna end up on the repsol honda team if nicky leaves is dovi. ben's only (serious) prospects are suzuki, (preferably factory) ducati, or a satellite honda squad.

it's unlikely that a satellite honda team would be able to afford him, especially since the rumors are that the factory suzuki squad was taken aback by his salary demands.

did someone say something?

I'm afraid i couldn't hear it over all the leghumping. [cheeky]

Good raceing for most of it.  Shame Rossi needed to make it physical to make passes stick, and then chose to lie about it afterwards.  Shame Stoner screwed up and ended the batlle early, and then acted rather immature afterwards.

i actually got a sore throat from the first few laps of this race  [thumbsup]
we were screaming in our living room  [laugh]

i'm disappointed @ stoner's reaction to rossi's aggressive passes, but damn... what a race  [clap]
i wish i had been there to see it in person.

Stoner got schooled today, not owned. The question is what will he take away from it. He's got a month to sit down and think about what happened before, during and after the race. This isn't the first time he and rossi have gone back and forth, just the first time they've been really physical about it. Personally, I don't think that Aussie is Gibernau or Biaggi and that he WILL learn from the w/e....great race, btw.

Shhh! you will throw off the rhythm of the Rossi circle jerk. As I remember it Vale complained long and loud about rough passes at the beginning of the season and if anyone had lowsided their bike into his and punted him off the track (sorry RdP!), we'd still be hearing about it.

There is definitely a dual standard regarding whining in the MotoGP paddock. Saying that Stoner DID whinge like a little girl and Vale DID put in some tough passes which he himself would have complained about.

Anyone see WSBK race 1 this weekend? Insane!!!

Give that boy some cheese  [wine].A fair race, no touching. Like Vale said. this is racing.

Has anyone complained about the commentary yet?  Because I would like to complain about the commentary.  My favorite quote, probably 40 or so laps in

Let ... = uncomfortable wordless voids

"VALENTINO ROSSI.
...
...
...
WOW!"

Not that it matters how well they transition to commercials but "YOU ARE GONNA WANT TO STAY TUNED... ITS EXCITING" was another moment of excellence.

"They wear helmets and leather suits..." Ranked right up there for me.

Schwantz did a great job of correcting EVERYTHING that Greg White spouted.

....motogp.com

loved at one point during the broadcast there was a few moments of greg white being silent (bliss!), something amazing happened.. few more seconds of silence, then you hear schwantz say, "wow."

uh huh.  thanks.

my fav was after stoner made his mistake and he's 18 sec down, with what 7 laps to go, they're going to break and white says something like, "stay tuned after the break to see how Stoner can get back into this."

"They use the clutch with their left hands...."

"They wear leather suits, boots, and gloves...."

"SIDE BY SIDE!!!!!"

Greg White is the Ed McMahon of motorcycle commentary........

http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2008/Jul/080720sh.htm

tbh, in the transcript stoner is much more even-handed.  he didn't like two or three moves but also gave all credit to valentino.

i'd expect him to be more composed in the post race interview.

can't beat "stoner raw" right after the race, though:

i can't wait to get home and watch the race on motogp.com to see everything i missed.

of course, i have to watch f1 practice/qualy/race and worldsbk brno, too... this is gonna be a long day (after my looooong ride home  ;D).

don't bother, brno is boring.


...not.  =)

I don't know why I'm being lured in, but make the beast with two backs it...

If they never touched, how is it physical?  Maybe Casey should take up Old Maid or something a little more his speed.  That was standard fare just a few years back in GP and can be seen weekly in WSBK.

Great stuff.   Goes to show that racing isn't just about who's the fastest and that defensive riding can win races.

Rossi rode a great race but lets be honest he got lucky as well.  He could have gone down just as easily as Stoner when he ran through the gravel in the corkscrew. 

IMO Stoner was the faster of the two and was probing Rossi at 3 different corners setting him up for a pass.  If he hadn't hamfisted the braking on that last corner it was only a matter of time before he overtook him.

I loved it though.  I hope the rest of the year plays out like this. 

As far as you fanboys go with the other stuff:

If someone had pulled that move through the gravel on Rossi and forced Rossi wide in the corkscrew you leghumpers would have been all over them.  The fact is Rossi is lucky that 1.  he didn't go down (as i said above) and 2. that he didn't take both of them down when he rejoined the track.  It was a reckless move and anyone who had to avoid it would have felt the same way, especially in the pits immediately after the race.  It was fun to watch though.

Hard to see anything worthy of a pregnant dog tag in the superbike article...

"Q Was there any in particular you weren't happy with?

A Two moves, basically three moves. I think everybody would've seen them. But I think a couple of other ones were all right. All nice and clean. We were riding side by side for a lot of the race. There were just a couple I wasn't really happy with.

Q One final question about the race itself. Did you feel if you could hang on for three or four corners at the front, that you could've pulled away?

A Yeah. I was basically trying to find the right place to get past and actually pull the gap. We knew we had a faster pace, but Valentino, like I said, was riding a great race, very defensive and very difficult to pass. I was a little bit disappointed where we couldn't get past too easily, but like I just said, Valentino was very, very defensive, and a fantastic race. He wasn't making any mistakes, and it was very hard to find an opening."

Very correct.  The guys in WSBK race like that, or worse, week in and week out.  I don't see where this is a problem.  As fans we should be cheering what happened this weekend.  We're finally getting some racing.

Watch the video right after the race in the winner's circle - that's where he was at his very pregnant dogiest.  I seriously thought he was gonna leave the circle to go beat his wife right afterwards as he was so flustered and pissed.  (it's the BBS video you need to watch to see it).

As for the corkscrew, yeah it was hairy, but that pass is made ALL the time (Spies and Yates both did it in AMA last year in fact) and yes, he's lucky he didn't go down when he went into the gravel for a split second, but here's the thing - he didn't take Stoner out, he didn't even touch him - so what is there to complain about?  A bunch of what ifs?

Stoner rode a great race for the most part, he had the better pace, he had the better package, but he wasn't gonna win that race regardless if he grabbed too much brake in 11.  If he was gonna find a way around Rossi, it would've happened before there were only 8 laps left.  He got frustrated cause he wasn't as strong on the brakes  and couldn't get by and eventually he pushed a little too hard and we saw what happened. 

i thought it was a nice battle. Rossi was in great form and made few mistakes.

i don't think anyone's worse than hector barbera when it comes to antics in a race.

from the whiners bike cam.... it almost looked like Rossi brake checked him.

+1

Rossi admitted that Stoner had more pace after the race.  If Stoner can't get by Rossi and make it stick after 24 laps, I highly doubt he would have made it stick during the 8 that were left.  Instead he ran wide on turn 1, then again on turn 11 which ended his race.  Both of those mistakes were unforced errors while trying to overtake the lead bike.  He cracked.  Stoner said Rossi was racing extremely precise race lines, and always closed off the home straight going into turn 1.  I don't really see where Stoner was planning on getting by him.

Are you serious?  Stoner was in there WAYYYY too hot.  Which is evidenced by the fact that he couldn't even slow it down in time to keep it out of the gravel.  So, yes Rossi braked before Stoner - at the last braking point and Stoner braked later, which is why he didn't make the turn and ended up picking the Duc out of the gravel.

I just rewatched that pass and slow mo'd it as well.  the only reason they don't touch is Stoner corrects his path.  If he holds line they are both out - no question.  It was reckless but it worked.  I'm not upset about it and thought it was fun to watch.  If I had been on the bike that had to avoid the knucklehead attempting the move yeah I'd be pissed.

I watched the video and just see 1 pissed guy.  That's pretty tepid though -- they get more worked up than that over practice sessions in most other professional circuits.


Again rewatching the race there are easily 3 corners where he is setting it up and it's obvious that Stoner is the quicker of the two and being held up in multiple areas.   IMO he would have made his move in a lap or two and been gone.    We can agree to disagree on that though.

I'm just mess'n....all those guys ride waaaaaaaay better than I could ever hope to, and they all have my respect, and, I didnt see Stoner do'n anymore whining than any other rider, when things didnt go as planned. They have all had thier moments. If any of us had just ran a race like that, we would all have been a lil pissy in the paddock.

It's clear Stoner could run a faster pace than Rossi.  Which is why Rossi wanted to get out front, and if passed, regain the lead.  He knew if Stoner got out front he'd check out.  It was the perfect strategy.  Showed that it's not always the guy with the fastest lap times that wins the race.

As for the corkscrew pass.  I think that had more to do with the corkscrew than anything.  I've seen lots of passes there.....and lots of guys run wide trying to pass there.  It's a tricky corner.

Too bad Casey ran off in 11 though.  It was a barn-burner for sure.  I think if anything else he probably could have gotten Rossi on the run to the line.  

except rossi kept beating him to the line by out-braking him in 11.

stoner had a bit more pace

rossi was better on the brakes in every corner and rode very defensively.

it's a really hard track to pass on.

every time stoner started to make up that tiny bit of room b/c of his pace, it was time to brake again.. and rossi would beat him there, every time.

sounds really damn frustrating to me.  :)

all it really did was prove once again that rossi is the master of racecraft.  get him close enough and he can win based on racing, not package + racing.  see: 2004.

plus, racecraft includes saying things to the media like 'only way to stop stoner is to shoot him' or 'yeah, i can win.. if you give me a 30 second head start'.  before that race even began he had casey convinced that all he had to do was go out there and do some laps.  then first lap, rossi is attacking, racing like a man possessed.  pressuring casey into a mistake was inevitable... i'm sure he was pissed off and totally out of sorts the entire race.

effing brilliant.

Exactly why Stoner ran off in 11.  He needed to make up time in that corner in order to have a shot on the straight. 

If he got a run on the straight he'd run wide in T2....which happened prior to his run off in 11. 

Hard to get around a guy running on the race line that is able to out brake you into the corner. 

The doctor at his finest.

Yep, he's being held up the entire race, not just three corners.  However, he tried to make his move over and over again, and he couldn't.  Why? Because Rossi knew that if Stoner got clear track in front of him, he'd be gone.  So, Rossi braked later to every corner and didn't put a wheel wrong, meaning that Stoner would have to find another way around (which is why Stoner ended up in the gravel).  Stoner wasn't going anywhere.  


Dude, I'm sorry, but every opportunity he's had to speak over the last 24 hours, he's complained about Rossi's passes, up to and including the official Ducati press release.  The tone of his comments were, "if Rossi hadn't made so many unfair passes on me, I would've won." He could've said his piece after the race and been done with it, but that's all he wanted to talk about.  

if I only weighed 127 pounds.... I'd be pissy too

I think he had 3 corners in particular he was choosing between and he would have eventually made his move.  My guess is before turn 11 because Rossi was effectively blocking him there and impeding his drive down the straight.  Rossi rode a good race but he wasn't unbeatable.  Stoner did pass him and was passed in only 1 area of the track repeatedly (corkscrew).  He had many opportunities to pass and as I said I believe he would have.

Point me to one article where he whines like that.  I've seen one post race video where he's obviously pissed.  All the articles and interviews are pretty bland and a repeated, I was faster but Rossi ran a great defensive strategy and won. 

You are reaching on the pregnant doginess let alone all the he's in his head, biaggi, etc nonsense talk.  Stoner knows he's faster and is confident in his team.  He's got 4 of his favorite tracks still ahead and an extremely fast track (supposedly) waiting for him in Indy.  To say he's afraid of Rossi is laughable.

My fear is his attempting to even the score with Rossi in some future race where he makes an equally as reckless move only this time taking them both out.  Then again the fireworks from that would be fun to watch- both on track and on the forum.  LOL.

I'd be ecstatic.

Rossi passed him into 6 more than the corkscrew actually.


Do you have a motogp.com subscription?  You can watch the post-race interviews on there for one.  After that, head over to superbikeplanet.com and read the quotes and press releases.  Then head over to BBC.com and autosport.com and you can read some more (they're everywhere, I don't feel like listing half the web here).


Well, I guess that Julian Ryder, John Hopkins, the entire WERA board (which includes a few people involved in GP racing surprisingly), as well as countless others are reaching as well.  At least I'm in good company.

I don't know that I ever said he was afraid of Rossi, I just said that Rossi is in his head, and that could lead to mental mistakes much like the one you mentioned.

At the end of the day, yesterday was a great day for racing and the two best racers duked it out to a level little seen in GP anymore and that makes me happy.  If the racing remains like this throughout the rest of the season, I'll be happy no matter who wins the championship (even Pedrosa).

* rossi is in my head...... FACK!




 [laugh]

awesome race!  I was sitting front row at the corkscrew and seeing Rossi go into the gravel and SOMEHOW save it and then Stoner SOMEHOW recover and not go off the track was insane.  the crowd was going nuts.  I completely expected to see those two tangled up in the dirt on that corner.

I haven't watched the replay, but in person it sure looked like Rossi bumped Stoner.  I don't see how he couldn't hit him because Rossi basically slid back onto track right into Casey's line.  If he didn't actually hit Casey then I'm even more impressed that Casey could react so fast and save his  [bacon]

Valentino ran an incredible race.  He was so aggressive and smooth that I think Casey (even though he was apparently faster) couldn't pass him without putting himself in serious jeopardy.  I have new respect for both of these guys.

This was the best battle I've seen in a long time.  I hope those guys enjoyed it because I know I did.

my $0.02

was it me or did it seem like there were more on-board footage than when it's broadcast on speed? awesome footage of stoner up rossi's ass.

and yes, white is a doofus...

motogp.com

It all started with his claims of sabotage when he moved up from 250's.  And his need for validation.

Keep in mind he was thinking this during his first season when he hadn't won anything and kept crashing.  Even then we wanted to be special.  He was upset people had forgotten about him. He'd just moved up to the big bikes and hadn't done anything yet and he was already upset.......

SpeedTV: When you took the pole in Qatar in only your second MotoGP race and were leading Rossi over the first part of the race, were you surprised to be going that well so soon?

C.S: Yeah, well Dani did it in the first race in Jerez and Dani and I had battled all through the 2005 250 season. It was a little bit frustrating because coming into that season of MotoGP everybody just looked at Dani. Sure, he has a lot better resume than me going up into MotoGP -- he'd won championships -- but I had pushed him. But everybody seemed to completely forget about me and they were all saying that Dani was going to be the fast one out of us.

Yes, the American broadcast is lacking.  The comentators, even with Schwantz, seemed ignorant in comparison to the European announcers.  There was a brief portion of the race, when Rossi and Stoner were still battling, that displayed the activity of the on board controls of the two.  You could see how much smother Rossi was than Stoner.  It just seemed that Stoner was really fighting hard for some reason and graphic showing his hard braking / hard throttle really confirmed the impression.

Rossi was just riding like he always does.


And another note regarding the broadcast, a track map was never displayed on screen untill the end of the race...Casey had already gone down, and the race was in essence, over.  The track map then appeared...it wasn't even synced up well....the location indicator lagged behind the rider's location...weak.

I am pretty much a MotoGP n00b - these last two races and pretty much a whole season I watched in Hungarian is about the extent of my viewing experience.
But, what I took away from that race was that Stoner got outridden by a better rider on a slower bike.   I got the impression that he was trying to use the bike, and not really his ability to overtake - like he was waiting for the opportunity to let his bike beat Rossi's bike.  He eventually got frustrated, did something stupid, and ended up in the gravel/second place.  I didn't think any of the passes were particularly reckless - if they were, they may have been riskier to Rossi than Stoner (fvck it - I am going offroad.).  So, any complaints on the part of Stoner have the ring of sore loser to them - Rossi just wanted it more.  He was smarter, apparently more hooked up with his bike (I kept expecting Stoner's wobbles to materialize into a crash), and a better competitor.

one other comment I'll make.  those of you who think that Rossi's pass on Stoner in the corkscrew was "just racing" probably watched it on TV.  In person it was UGLY and if either of them had gone down (which my mind still can't comprehend how they didn't) I fully expect one of them would have been broken in half.  I don't share their skill so it's hard to know how manageable that situation was for those guys, but it didn't look that safe to me.  Perhaps Rossi's comment "that's racing" means more that weird shit happens and you just gotta make the best of it.

It's lame that Stoner wouldn't shake hands with Rossi.  I can see it both ways tho.  I'd be pissed if someone tried a move like that on me.  Still, he should just take it on the chin and be happy that he's there.

I know for a fact that most of you, on the track, would go ballistic if someone pulled something even 1/1000th as dangerous as that move on you.  ;)

Lorenzo ....  maybe this dude should just take a long break and heal himself.  He seems to get more and more injured every race!

fixed it for ya  ;)

I guess it looked worse in person, cause they never even touched and Stoner didn't even have to go to the edge of the track.  When Rossi comes back on track they're side-by-side, so it's not like Stoner's gonna get t-boned.  I think Stoner had to check up a bit, but if you're gonna cry every time you have to check up, you're prolly gonna need tear duct implants in the near future.

This quote from the BBC is the one used in most of those articles (I have them RSS too, LOL).  I read pissed but whiney?  Please.  In his head? LOL.


This is the Italian TV interview version.  Again.  Pissed, not happy, etc.  Whiney? Maybe.  Rossi in his head? LOL.

The following quote is the only one I would classify as whiney/pregnant dogy. 


Being pissed about a reckless move is one thing.  Whining about the special treatment of other riders is another.  Still not in his head though.

Yeah, but what you need to keep in mind was Rossi ending up in the gravel wasn't intentional.  He never intended to wind up in the gravel in order to make the pass stick.  Lots of riders overshoot going into the corkscrew.  So it was indeed just a racing incident.  And Rossi did the best he could to salvage going in too hot.

Stoner runs extremely wide there.  On the first shot he goes from inside line to outside and is a few feet from the paint.  On the close up replay Rossi's bike hops and skids back on track next to Stoner who immediately stands it up a bit and goes wide to avoid him.  No question if Stoner doesn't do this they touch and one or both of them go down.

in my mind the corkscrew pass is in a different category.  that was hairball.  ...no roadracer attempts a pass that includes the dirt unless things just went wrong.  obviously he overshot that one and they were both lucky to stay up, even if they only barely came together.. which did look like exactly the case on tv.

he overshot it, exactly like stoner overshot 2 and 11.  had he been under rossi on either of those occasions, they would have come together and maybe/probably gone down (as in carlos checa vs. max n earlier this year).  but anyway, does anyone even watch wsbk?  this shit happens on damn near every single corner.

stoner is complaining about several other moves however.  all the others were "just racing".. it's just that no one, those guys included, have seen very much of that lately.

I agree the rest of the passes were just racing.  Corkscrew/gravel pass was the only reckless move IMO.

...wait, did we just agree??   =)
 

Both of them made some questionable moves.

That said, had the roles been reversed on the Corkscrew, there would have been a worldwide outcry and every motoryccle forum out there would have locked up under all the Stoner has no business being in MotoGP! posts.

I do wonder if Stoner learned anything from this.  He was given several very good lessons.  First, Rossi's not going to move aside and let him by.  This isn't golf and the faster party doesn't play through.  Second, he can't outbrake Rossi.  Which, really, who can?  He's going to need a different strategy.  Finally, he learned that waiting on Rossi to make a mistake is a futile effort.

Will these lessons sink in over the summer break?

 [evil]

well the way i see it is you can pass or you can pass agressively, now some people like that a person uses intimidation of wrecking to pass a person, now if you like that type of gamesmanship, fine but when someone else does that to you you can't complain at all, is someone wrecks you for being too agressive you have nothing to say no matter how many times you did it and didn't crash.

i think rossi is a great rider but its clear that the guy took risks passing, and like other said, when it works he's great, if he wrecks hes and idiot.

the question really is if you are are the person that subscribes to "win at any cost, winning is all that matters, nothing else and nobody else matters" or whether you think there should be unwritten rules of competition on what should and should not be done.  if you go with the first then you can't complain no matter what when your team loses fallling to the same or worse tactics, bc you just threw out the unwritten code of sportmanship.

i think rossi knew that he had a slower bike and had to take risks it was the only way he was going to win, yes he is a great rider but he had to cut the corners probabaly closer than he wanted.  

i think stoner is a prima donna and a bit immature and will complain about not getting attention, he is only 22 years old so that is expected. rossi is a bit older so he has matured a bit with age which is expected as far as the whining or not.

i think if stoner wants to get respect,what he will have to do is race during this season and at one point basically run rossi off the track or out of a race and go on to win the race and say "hey its racing" when rossi thinks the tactic was bad.  then he will probably get more respect on the track from rossi and the others, but he will have to take that risk of wrecking to get his respect.

as far as not shaking a hand, i don't care about that, if i dont' like someone i dont' have to shake their hand, simple as that. and neither would you, if you really thought what a person does is low class who cares what people think is right, you are probably saying "hey you are lucky i didn't just punch the guy instead".  like if some drunk driver hits you on the road you arent' going to shake their hand when they say "hey statistically drunk drivers get in accidents today its you, hey its just a risk of driving you should have known that, no hard feelings".

Make that 3 of us that agree.  Rossi would never intentionally go into the gravel, just like Stoner didn't mean to go into it in T11.  Mistakes happen and fortunately they're both great riders, so they were able to keep it up.

We'll have to disagree about Stoner whining, but at the very least he made himself look like an asshole.

As for the role reversal, I can only speak for myself, but I wouldn't be upset about that pass - it's racing and it happens.  When Elias won in Portugal '06, he put some pretty hairball moves on Rossi, but I was up out of my seat cheering cause those last few laps were the best thing I'd seen all year.

I don't want to watch a parade of vehicles ride around for an hour without attempting to make some close passes - if I did, I'd watch F1.

if it happened exactly like it did but in reverse, nonsense.  rossi nearly paid dearly for overshooting that corner.  it's not like he decided to take a rossi-only superstar shortcut.



all these points are exactly why the 'pundits' feel about rossi the way they do.

i think stoner is clearly one of the best riders in the world.  maybe #2.  but he aint valentino...

I agree as well.  With the exception being it wasn't a stupid pass.....it was a botched pass.  There is a slight difference.  But I agree it was the only questionable pass of the day.

I'm not buying too much into the post race stuff.  It's fun to call someone a pansy but I don't think Rossi is in Stoner's head at all.  I'd say the opposite.  Casey's riding well, the Duc is fast, and Rossi knew he had to up his game to win.  He took chances knowing he needs the points.  So I'd say Stoner is still the guy everyone is watching......

Since when is MotoGP following  Fastrack Riders 6 ft passing rule?  [laugh]

ya know, even though these 2 guys got their passes yanked and were kicked off the property moments later, i'm thinking it was probably worth it...

[beer]

(http://7mzdt.com/images/valeLaguna.jpg)

hey....Tom Cruise was there....waaaaay cool.




















 [puke]

omg, really?  rossi even called them over to hold his bike! ... injustice!

it was a cool moment.  rossi kissed the track that saved his  [bacon].

You can't be serious.  Forget being victim to a reckless move --  all it takes for Rossi to drive close to 200 pages of forum haterade is to lose.

If the roles were reversed there is no doubt in any but the fanatics minds that the Rossi nation would be out loud and large...  "Stoners always been reckless, Stoner should be penalized, Stoner should be banned, Stoner is a Nazi, Stoner is a Communist, Stoner is a closet ...." 

Being the first to blog or post on a forum about the injustices Rossi faces is part of the responsibility of being a Rossi fanboy.  if you don't you first lose your Tuscan sun. fail again the moon is taken.  do it 3 times and your keyboard loses it 4 and 6 keys.

From Julian Ryder's column:

Rossi's moment at the Corkscrew and a pass on Casey at turn five being the most memorable. The race was decided by what Casey first said was 'completely my mistake.' Later he was said he thought the mistake happened because Valentino braked a little early for Turn 11. That was at the post-race press conference; immediately after the race Casey had refused Rossi's hand in parc ferme and offered the opinion that some of the passes had been beyond aggressive.

It has been shown several times that if things get personal then Valentino tends to come out on top. This has been demonstrated to both Mr Biaggi and Mr Gibernau. The Doctor does not waste ammunition on those opponents who are not a threat to him. Noises emanating from the Fiat Yamaha camp indicate that Rossi is very angry indeed at the suggestion that he rides dirty. Jerry Burgess,a fellow Aussie, opined that it's a good job Casey wasn't racing in the 1980s against Lawson, Schwantz, et al--and especially Luca Cadalora.

So, on the weekend he announced that he will race for two more years with Yamaha he goes to his Summer holiday with a 25-point lead over the opposition and a new-found anger. The gloves are off.

When I say "in his head" I don't mean that he'll forget how to ride, I just think (much like you do according to an earlier post) that he may push it too far next time they're battling and end up binning it.  He's not gonna forget Laguna and he's not gonna forget how pissed he was afterwards and anger is often times a bad thing when you're racing - just ask Biaggi.

IROC

Why exactly are we debating what didn't happen?

So, when Stoner won these 3 races in a row, there was 200 pages of hatred?  Apparently my search function is broken because all I can find is a bunch of people talking about what a tear Stoner is on and how great this season is and how we're all happy to see such competition again.

http://us.redbullrookiescup.com/videos.php

these guys were bump'n and rub'n

what a whiney response.  ;D


1.  I think the point the OP was trying to make was the Rossi humpers calling Stoner pregnant dogy is the pot calling the kettle black.  I just decided to have more fun with it.

2.  To test my theory that to drive post count on here all I need to do is type something remotely anti-Rossi.  Even a comment about his hair or lack of it will drive a 30 post thread no problem.   [evil]

That's the smartest thing that's ever been said in reference to the Stoner/Rossi debate.

well yeah, i am serious.

but i can only speak for myself.  i'm also a stoner fan, and spoke really highly of him both in '06  and '07.  his off-track habits have always been slightly annoying, but i really don't care what any of these guys say or do off-track enough to actually be annoyed.

the times i've seen rossi lose have been when he screwed up, his equipment failed, or someone out-raced him.  or elias runs into him.  none of which have ever caused me to kick off any Magickal incantations or sell my My Little Pony collection.

I'll sum up the 2006, 2007 and recent win threads so you don't have to look it up or go to TOB in 4 words.

The Bike, Traction Control

Oh by the way, Lighten up Francis. [laugh]

The point I was making is that there's a significant double standard in place.  And I'm not accusing anyone on this board.  Anyone else on the grid does something reckless, people raise hell about it.  Rossi does something reckless and its written off as a racing incident or he's praised for his superior skill.

That kind of zealotry leaves a foul taste in my mouth.

 [beer]

How else could he or anyone else lose?  You've covered all the bases there. LOL.

My Little Pony, nice touch.   [thumbsup]

dibs

 [laugh]


 [laugh] [laugh]


I'm not a fan of that kind of zealotry either and all I want is this season to keep going as it has been 'cause it's been the best one in quite some time.  Also, I thank god for the Stoners and the Pedrosas of the world, cause it's equally boring to watch Rossi run away with the championship with 5 or 6 races to go.

that was pretty much the point  ;)




;D

Anyone read anything further about Lorenzo? :o :-\

broke his (third) ankle.  i think that's been the only update.

I wonder if he's as thrilled as his doctors that the summer break is finally here.

What does the International Race of Chumps have to do with all of this?

 [popcorn]

 [popcorn]...................  [wine]......................  [drink].................  [puke]........................  [drink]

I'm still at work.  [drink] when I get home

OK..I am the biggest Rossi Fanboy on the planet. In fact, if given half a chance, I think I would even turn gay for him.
That being said, the BIGGEST letdown of the entire race for me was when Casey ran off the track. Up to that point it was far and away the bst front pack racing of the season. Speed, great skill, and youthful zeal vs. determination, experience, and maturity.

I personally saw nothing dirty in any of the passing. I saw a couple of riders who really wanted to win a race battling it out. Why does everyone have to overanalyze everything? Frankly, had Casey not gone off tack and dropped the bike, I would have been happy with either rider winning simply because that was some great racing. But let's face it...Casey started to get a bit edgy. The laps were dwindling down and they were reaching a point where every time he got around Vale, Vale would charge right back to challenge him. And when he tried to use the speed advantage, Rossi kept putting himself in Casey's way.

When did MotoGP racing become a sport where "Oh...you want to pass me? Here...let me open up a nice clean line for you so that you can get in front of me." That needs to happen when it's a front runner overtaking a backmarker but when it's in a battle for the lead, why in god's name should they do anything short of fighting tooth and nail to get around the other guy? I didn't see anyone intentionally try to push the other guy off the track or put another rider on the tarmac.

So, long story short, there's no crying in MotoGP racing! Man up, dust off your pair and lets race. It's racing. Not a make the beast with two backsing tuesday afternoon day time drama show.

Danika, Casey
Casey, Danika



cat fight!   or as GW would say "SIDE BY SIDE!"




 [laugh]

THEY WEAR LEATHER SUITS!  AND HELMETS!  YES, THAT IS A HELMET!  AND LEATHER SUITS!

AND THE CLUTCH LEVER IS ON THE LEFT!!!!!!!

and he's expected to race at brno.   [bang]

Really it all comes down to showmanship and the want to perform for fans.  The reason everyone loves Rossi so much is that, 1) he is one of the top talents, but also 2) he is always candid, smiling, and performs for the people that come to watch races.  Stoner and Pedro are simply boring and lack the qualities that rockstars, popular sports stars, etc carry with them.  Stoner can ride, Pedrosa can ride, but neither will ever be a darling of the crowd, and therefore its much more difficult to get a lot of people to cheer them on.  I promise you, we'd much rather see a healthy Lorenzo on the podium in the next few years.  He's the same basic personality that Rossi is and he enjoys performing.

Its like when the San Antonio Spurs win the NBA championship.  The ratings are awful and no one enjoys crediting them with success.  They are defensive, boring, not flamboyant enough, and just slug there way to wins.  It works, but its more difficult to enjoy that style of play.

first ...  [bacon] ... then ... [coffee] ... then ... [drink]

This made me spill my drink!!!  [laugh]

Great timing....  [thumbsup]

 :o

(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3075/2689959431_7752e6c9e7.jpg)

It looks to me that both rossi and Stoner made some mistakes. One was just more lucky than the other. That corkscrew could have been really nasty.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=h4vKQUvYBXI (http://youtube.com/watch?v=h4vKQUvYBXI)

Are there more photos?  This makes it look like Rossi has everything under control, but I distinctly remember him sliding down into the curb (which saved him) before sliding back onto the track.

I just have to say again ... IT WAS AWESOME!!!!  I would have ended up under Stoner's front tire.

Btw, I just re-watched this race and in particular this lap and Stoner puts a hard pass on Rossi going up to the Corkscrew and basically runs right into him.  I hope they both keep it up 'cause this is entertainment.

Anudder:

(http://www.superbikeplanet.com/image/2008/MGP/laguna/tim07/p02.jpg)

entertaining reading..
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/69369
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/69377

and finally, from the no-shit dept:
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/69379

Yeah, I don't know why everyone seems to miss that move.  Stoner is visibly leaning his bike into Rossi as he goes by him.  Its not like Stoner wasn't racing aggresively himself.  He almost lost that bike a few times while pushing so hard around turn 9.

Great race!

First time I have yelled watching this year.

Knobbies next race?

mitt

ditto.. just got around to watching this again.  that whole melee started with casey literally elbowing past rossi in 4, or whatever corner that is.  i don't think it was an out of bounds move but it did set off the series of events that ended with the gravel trip and stoner have to check up on the exit of the corkscrew.

damn this is great racing from both of them.

Who had the fastest lap time of the race, and how did it compare to qualifying?

7 is the slight right kink just prior to the corkscrew.
8 is the left at the top of the corkscrew, and 8A is the right.

Did Stoner push past Rossi on the entrance to 8, and force him wide?

It would be coming out of T6 and into T7.  Rossi had the line and Stoner runs into him and takes the position.  Then you know what happens two turns later.

Was it shown on the Euro version, or only on the motogp.com version?

I watched the Euro version, and I don't recall seeing any shoving prior to the corkscrew incident.

Stoner by .25 or so if memory serves.

Yep - if I remember correctly, after Casey ran wide, he set 2 new lap records back to back.

mitt

I only watched the motogp.com feeds, but you can see it clear as day on it.  If you have access to the motogp.com feeds, you can either watch the whole race to see it or I believe the highlights from the race has it as well.

Lorenzo's injury worse than thought (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/69393)

crap...I like watch'n Jorge ride.

That boy needs to have a discussion with his boot provider.

It'd help if he stopped the Flying Wallenda auditions, but he's just not getting the protection he needs.

Damn!  That sucks. :-\

Least its only his foot.  Dude landed on his noggin after that low Earth orbit attempt. :o

i'm not sure how much more protection you can get and still be able to use your foot..  the '100mph, 12ft fall' rating on those things is probably pretty limited

Fixed!  :P

I watched it yesterday night and halfway thru i was gonna come on here and tell all you Stoner haters to go make the beast with two backs yourselves.

But then he fell off.  [laugh]

Up to then It was a great race!  [clap]

I think that with the Jorges hang time.... ride'n for Jordan would be a given. Nike's have great ankle support.


See'n Casey lay it down in the dirt made me feel better about my lowside  [laugh]

ok, enough whining (quotes) from both sides.  getting old.  [coffee]

" least I pay tax's " - C Stoner

" I'm taller" -V Rossi

" least Greg can pronounce my name" -C Stoner

" least I didnt kiss him to make sure he pronounces it right" -V Rossi

" your mama " -C stoner

" no... your mama " -V Rossi

etc etc etc

i don't think any boots lorenzo uses is going to help...

almost nothing is going to help when you are being launched off the bike into low orbit providing a prime example on youtube of what a really, really, really, bad high side looks like on both ocassions...when you see him go flying in both accidents it looks like he was shot out of a circus cannon.

i'd say if nothing else he is lucky he wasn't injured even worse.. but he should maybe say, "guys make my boots out of solid titanium next time, i need it"

(http://www.dpi.wa.gov.au/cycling/images/clipless_pedal.jpg)

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/89/Pasta_with_pesto.jpg/800px-)

It's not like Rossi's move there is unprecedented -- Zanardi's will always be simply "The Pass"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bLSNIfO6LM&feature=related

we were joking around sunday night about rossi taking zanardi's line through the 'screw.  [thumbsup]

I thought "the pass" was a Joe Montana thing  :-\


 [laugh]

nope, that's "the catch" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Catch_(American_football)) ;D

or was it "the drive"?   [laugh]

Nope, "The Drive"  was...

http://www.profootballhof.com/history/decades/1980s/the_drive.jsp