Ducati Monster Forum

I dont ride the same, I enjoy it but I dont...
just before my accident, I started to get very very good.. very confident but now-
I get shell shock in a corner or at an intersection.
I'm afraid of just pushing the handle bar at a fast speed and letting the bike lean over and corner really well.

I dont know what to do about the fear itself... maybe take the msf again? maybe take a track lesson?
I ride a 749 dark now and I def dont use the bike the way it is supposed to be used.

I think a track lesson would be good. From what I heard, you learn your bike's leaning potential and how position your body. I don't think the MSF course will give you the higher speed cornering confidence. I'm the same way with my u-turns. I'm deathly afraid of making a u-turn when there's gravel or a curb on the other side and I can't help but to target fixate because I know its there.

i feel you man. im in that bundle right now. You realize the risk you take when you ride now, any corner can be your last. Im still trying to get back to where i was. And my let down wasnt even that bad. I went in to hot and picked the bike up and ran into gravel. I keep replaying that scene on a small 2 lane road. and me being smashed into a tree.

Solution? For me, its to ease into it. Half the problems i had after i went down was due to a broken left fork. Had that repaired and it boosted my confidence alot. Sometimes when i approach a turn, i say, ill take it a wee bit faster this tiime, but my body wont do what i tell it to do, and i end up taking it at a speed i know nothing will happen. and also very slow. :(

MSF isnt going to help much i think, im trying to get lee parks ARC class in before summer is over. Its all slow speed parking lot stuff. and some moderate 30mph turns with full knee drag. Just keep riding man. DONT GIVE UP! You cant be a better rider without crashing and realizing your only human.

+1 for the Lee Parks Total control class.  I took levels I and II in June.  Worth every penny.  [thumbsup]

You learn the techniques on your own bike so there can be a direct translation to how ride on the street.  All the exercises are controlled, but a little faster than anything MSF offers.  And the majority of the exercises are all about cornering.  Lots of fear and riding mentality is discussed in the classroom portion. 

Good luck and keep riding!! Your confidence will return with time.   [moto]

Beck, so sorry to hear about your wreck.  The most important thing to do is to throw a leg over and force yourself back to the basics.  Look FAR ahead through every turn, making sure your entire head (and probably your torso) is pointed that way.  Lead with your torso.  Make sure you stay gently (at least) on the throttle all the way through. 

I highly recommend taking a track school.  I wouldn't do it for your first track day since it would be a bit of a firehose for you.  I'd suggest a nice, safe, chill track day where you can just get the jitters out.  Do a few like that and then take something like what we have here at VIR, Cornerspeed.  ERC might help out with all the street stuff.  Total Control has also come highly recommended.  Get as much saddle time as possible.

I had a somewhat frightening loss of control less than a week ago at the track when my throttle got locked open.  I knew that if I was physically able to ride I had to.  I couldn't lift my leg over my bike, but I had to get back on.  I fully admit that I got spooked when I saw pink paint all over turn 14 and the tears just started pouring, but it was important to get back out there in that environment.

Saddle time and getting back to the basics will be your friend.  Be patient with yourself.  You don't have to use your entire bike.  You just have to enjoy it!

Thank you sorry about your wreck

Fear can be healthy.  I had a pretty scary "moment" on my 695 when a harsh dip threw me off my line.  I got a really good look at a deep ditch before riding in which stopped the bike, but not me.  I'll leave flying for superman next time. 

I was totally freaked for quite a while.  Any bump sent me into panic mode.   :o I went back out and rode the same stretch of road where I crashed over and and over.  I did the same thing as you described.  In fact, I found myself braking and downshifting into first for the turn.  I've yet to take that turn at anything close to speed, but I was able to get my confidence back.  I've also found that since my accident, when I get that "ohhhhhh noooooo" feeling...usually after turning into a corner waaay early...in my gut after blowing a corner, I no longer fixate like used to.  As soon as it starts, I now find myself focusing hard on where I want to go. 

Just give it time and be patient with yourself.  You will be a better rider for the experience.   [thumbsup]

+++1 on the trackday.  Do at least two.  One to get over your fear an build confidence and the second to learn and practice handling and the limits of your ride.  Unless you live in a mountian area with lots of twisties one trackday will equal a year of flatland riding experience.

This is a really great thread.  Thanks to Beck for starting it and to all the contributors for some wonderful perspective and honesty.

I think getting your mojo back is something everyone does in their own time or they quit riding. When my brother crashed his big Yamaha several years ago and broke his ankle he was done, never rode again. Several people I've met say the same thing, crashed once and don't want to ride anymore. I've crashed a couple of times but they were both my own fault (in other words I was not at the mercy of another driver) so it was not too hard for me to get back in the saddle.
Good luck to you.
BTW, aren't you the guy that used to have the Speed Triple?

I think it all comes down to how a person can accept uncertainty.  Uncertainty runs through our lives.  Some of it we can accept, some of it we can't.  I think I recall reading that the guy who originally started TOB got into a bad tankslapper and folded his moto-riding for good.  Didn't like the prospect of his family being without a father (...correct me if my memory is faulty on this one). 

However, it would be ruse to believe that we can control our lives and ensure our safety.  It's just not possible.  Something to think about.

I think that people often don't have a clear understanding of the risks & consequences of riding, that's why some people quit riding after an accident.

Riding is something that we do for fun but risks are always there. You can do everything right and still get messed up. I try to remind myself of that whenever I'm going out on the bike.

I've also heard a lot of people say that they quit after they started noticing all the dangerous obstacles on the side of the road. I find this strange because I've always noticed them.

I feel like people often have an incomplete picture of the risks of doing dangerous things and then when they find reality, they quit. That's a good thing of course, more of a concern is that they'd been riding for so long without a clear understanding of the dangers.

i agree with what you say,

the reason why people do what you say is because basically a majority of people are idiots, including all of us.  the reason is we never look at the whole picture and the consequences of our actions, we are always egotistical and say "that bad stuff will never happen to me, that is the other person, i'm better than that, i'm better than anyone else, i'm good, etc".

its human nature to be a moron and think you are better than you are even when you aren't.

I crashed twice last year the first one didn't really bother me, I hit a patch of black tar sand on a freshly paved road and it was over before I could react and aside from some questioning the choice of a tinted visor on an overcast day I'm not sure what I could have done different. The second one was entirely my fault, I let my concentration drift while riding a pretty technical road and came into a corner too hot and ran out of skill and road. That one slowed me down. I am just now getting my confidence back 4000 miles later. I have spent a lot of time this year on making myself look through the corner and using later turn in points. I have a riding partner that has been a tremendous help because we have talked about the accident and how to overcome the perfectly reasonable fear that comes with finding the limits of our skills. I have spent a lot of miles forcing myself to follow through on proper technique and increasing speeds 2mph at a time.   

i had a bad wreck about 2 months ago. Had to have re-constructive knee surgery. Knee is still recovering.

I still have the same desire to ride. Possibly because it was a freak accident and not related to traffic or anything else.

Since my leg still doesnt function right im currently riding a scooter. I can lean and ive got 2 wheels, so im good.

Sorry to hear you cant ride the same way, thats unfortunate. Everyone is different and im sure you will eventually re-gain your self confidence, but i will never ever trust other people out on the road.

^^ Good advice.  [thumbsup]

I fought the same battle.  After a high speed lowside in a left-hander, 3 years later I can rail a right hander but still park it in a left hander.  I finally figured out that as I entered a left hander, I would cut my eyes for just a split second and were I would land if I crashed again.  Once I broke myself of that habit, all was well and I could ride normally.  I'm still a bit slower in a left hander, but I'm improving my form correctly now ~

JM

I just wanna say, I'm lovin' this thread.  Thanks to all.

get out in the dirt, ride an mx course or trails.  you learn a lot about riding in nasty conditions. and if you fall, it's usually not too bad as long as you're geared up.

ok so i tried to take this one corner today that always gets me, anyway i went in too fast instead of leaning and LOOKING ahead I looked at the corner/double yellow line and STABBED my front brake out of panic and skidded over the solid yellow, thank god no cars otherwise id be posting from hell. anyway I suck i need a track lesson, some days im great some days i suck big ones today i sucked a big one.

RST--- Well said.  [thumbsup]   When I crashed my friends (stock 620) I was pushing the hell out of the suspension and bottomed it out pretty bad. Took me some time to figure it out, BUT I forced myself to hit the Canyon the very next day. I was hurting physically, but I wanted to get back on that bike before the mental games set in. It was a good crash too. Messed up both my elbows, but I was sporting leathers. I remember feeling the way you do when I was riding my 996 and pulled into a gas station when the bike fell under me as I went over one of those metal plates they pump the gas in. I did not ride for a month after that. I had issues with my right turns after that experience.

Take your time, take a break if need be. RST said it well.  Glad your ok friend.
 [thumbsup]

A few things I have learnt about crashes. (This is personal stuff mostly, lot of it is obvious)

1) Don't crash. It really hurts and you never recover 100% if you break something. I still feel it every day on various parts of the body. Right arm, ankle, knee, ribs etc etc....

2) By the time you realise, "my God I am going to crash" it is too late, a large % of the time there is just nothing you can do. This is same as many things in life. Do not get yourself into that situation in the first place. Always think the worst case. What if there is a stationary car parked just over the brow of that blind crest? Should I be doing 110mph here?

3) Be aware when learning, there is a mismatch between ability and confidence, confidence always rises before ability. Therefore most dangerous time is about your second or third track day or the end of the day, riding with faster friends.

4) When that "my God I am going to crash"  feeling hits, concentrate on saving it. Look where it is clear not at the danger. You go where you look. i.e. look at the open space in front of the car not the car itself. This is especially difficult if your mate in front has just wiped out and is sliding on his arse down the road. You watch him thinking "thats gotta hurt" and pretty soon you are following him off the road. 

5) Be aware of your physical condition, for me this affects my mental ability when riding fast. You can ride fast when tired, but you may not be able to get out of a "situation" successfully

6) Be aware in a "situation" of the balance of physical laws against your mindset. So may people think they will crash, so they do when in reality they just manufactured the whole incident in their heads. Another rider may just calmy ride through the situation.

7) When you turn off your conscious brain, you ride instinctively. You have two options, make sure your instinctive riding is correct, or never turn off.  (relates to 5 above)

Couple of examples for me, always looking over my shoulder when changing lanes, you just do it without thinking and has saved me on many Occasions. Or (4) above which I cannot do instinctively and have to make myself do.

8 ) Crashing on the road and racetrack are different. Covered in leather and crashing at high speed I felt like a balloon full of water being sloshed in all directions. Not physical scuffs just a lot of bending and rearrangement into unnatural positions. Crashing on the road in Jeans at slower speeds, lots of scraped off skin and friction burns. Neither is very nice.

Stay safe [moto]

+1

Sandy spot in the middle of the corner, pot holes, oil slicks, stationary cars parked over brows of blind crests; all part of the real world we drive in.  Gotta ride accordingly.  Takes some of the fun out of it, but that's how you live to ride another day.