Ducati Monster Forum

Alright, so i'm a new rider, had my baby a month or so.  I've read Total Control, and Twist of the Wrist II, along with several dozen threads here... and one thing i'm missing is street smarts (oh, yeah, took MSF a couple of years ago which deals with a bit of that, but not nearly as in depth as i'm looking for)

The books give a lot of rhyme and reason for how to ride on a track.  Nifty, i have no doubt that trying to apply the principles within are helping my riding on a daily basis.  But it's not specifically about the street (or even racing, for that matter). (they say don't roll off/on the gas or change lines, but in the case where you need to do one or the other, they don't really point you toward which would be wiser here or there)

One of the biggest issues i'm having, is taking curves/turns at what are really pretty safe speeds and coming up on the back end of a SLOWING cage.  I mean, hello?!?!? don't they know, slow into the turn, accelerate out!?!?!

I'm trying to be good about rolling on, settling the suspension, etc.  and then i'm having to roll off to avoid bumper.

I'm not "getting on it" and the two times i've taken roads that could be called "twisties" (mullholland dr. and Topanga Canyon) i tried to take them like "The Pace".

I don't think i have a specific question here... just a general request for street riding techniques/ traffic specific tips. 

IMO, one of the best books for street-specific riding information is Proficient Motorcycling (http://www.amazon.com/Proficient-Motorcycling-Ultimate-Guide-Riding/dp/1933958359/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1219195427&sr=8-1) by David Hough.

You might also think about the MSF's ERC (experienced rider course).

don't think i yet qualify as an experienced rider ;) but i'll take the coarse at some point soonish.

Thanks for pointing me toward the book, i'll check it out.

You're always so helpful.

Most cagers brake during a turn.  Try leaving yourself a longer gap between you and the cager in front of you so you can properly accelerate out of the turn.

Yeah isn't that frustrating?  [roll]

I find that if that's the case, I can usually get away with keeping the throttle steady rather than accelerating, maintaining the same speed as the car ahead. If the car slows down mid-turn, the last thing you want to do (obviously) is transfer weight to the front (chop the throttle, or grab a handful of front brake). If slowing down mid-turn is unavoidable, then I usually just apply a bit of rear brake while keeping the throttle cracked. I find that this keeps the suspension fairly settled, and the weight off the front.  Ideally you should be far enough back where it's not an issue, but hey...sh!t happens, right?  :-\

+1, I always leave big gaps in turns.

It's not a big deal to stop or slow in a turn.  Just be smooth with your inputs and take away lean angle as you add brakes.  The ERC should have an exercise to cover this.

At the speeds most cars are driving, slowing and even slowing to a stop pretty hard in a turn is no big deal.   Rolling on through a turn to balance the suspension blah blah blah becomes important at speeds and levels of commitment higher than that.   At most street speeds braking in a corner is no big deal.  (now don't go off on this all you peg scrapers...I said most street speeds and I'm refering to the 80 percent of riding 80 percent of riders do)

On the other hand if you're riding in canyons and running up the back of cagers while cranked over pretty far, then please look farther ahead.

I think this is the crux of the problem.  If you're riding fast enough that you can't stop within your immediate field of vision, all bets are off.

This is what i was looking for.


The issue is that i'm not really taking anything that fast.  I'm a new rider, and still i feel like i've got tons of room to lean into these turns faster.  I'm trying to get there nice and easy, not rush it, and i know that at the speeds i'm going i'm not going to dump it by laying off the throttle, etc.  (going wide into traffic is another matter)  It's just very frustrating, knowing that i've got room to grow, and still i'm coming up on cages much too quick. (and as i said in the initial post, i'm not gunning the straightaways.)   When i do see a car, i try to lay off even more, but they're intent on creeping around the corners, and at this point, i'm only passing at intersections when i can split up to the line (they're not hitting the pullouts to let me by, and i'm not going over a double yellow).

I guess if i want to take a corner quick, i'm just going to have to hit a track day.

Practice my friend practice,the more miles you put in the more experience you will get.Just don't get over your head and stay relax  :)

likely a bit too soon but may i suggest taking a class with Reg Pridmore or Keith Code as soon as feasible.  I had been riding for years and learned more in those classes /weekends that i wish i had taken them sooner.  Reg is more street oriented.  +1 on the books, pretty good theory!

All great stuff in the above posts by all the members.

Totally unscientific suggestion here:  when riding in town, in traffic, on the freeway, wherever, instill in yourself a really healthy degree of paranoia (for lack of a better word). 

Keep one or two fingers on the front brake at all times.
Maintain a safety "cushion" in front of you, behind you, to either side of you.
Expect the semi in front of view to explosively shed a tire tread imminently in the next few milliseconds (don't ride in the near shadow of semis).
The bozo in the Hummer tailgating you has faulty brakes and won't be able to stop in time as the intersection light ahead suddenly changes to red.
Expect the cage in front/side of you will instantly change lanes and veer towards you.
That soccer mom driving the minivan in the opposing lane is actually an undercover Al-Quaida sleeper and she wants to kill you by turning left in front of you.
Expect someone to run a red light at that approaching intersection and T-bone you even as you go through with a green light.
Out in the countryside, be prepared for a doe and fawn to leap out of those bushes on either side of the road at any moment.
As you are leaning into that sweet right hand sweeper, expect there to be gravel or a dead tree branch right at the apex.
Never, ever be complacent.
Don't ride when you're tired, sleepy, hungry, etc.
Know and be confident in your machine (maintain it perfectly) and your accident avoidance skills (emergency braking, evasive maneuvers).
Get the best gear you can afford (all the gear) and wear it every time you ride.  Every damn ride, no matter how short.

I don't mean to be negative, but there's an awful lot of ways to die or get seriously hurt out there.  Don't be statistic.  Have a positive attitude when you ride. Getting into the zone and being 'wired' is part of the fun, I think.  It gets the adrenaline going and keeps your reactions quick and makes the ride funner.

Welcome aboard.  Good luck.

A little more advice from someone who lived on Topanga:

Yes, cars drive slow on Topanga.

Surf the gap. Meaning give yourself room and drift back a bit.

Some of the dereasing radius turns there can make it appear that cars come up quick. Again surf the gap.

Take Old Topanga. [thumbsup] Might not even see a cage.

As for braking I agree with Statler, maybe even a bit of rear brake if my line needs correcting.

+1

Hough is all about surviving the street.  He has about 700k mile under his belt, so I'd listen  [thumbsup]

i have to say that mullholland past the rock store and topanga canyon road are probably some of the most twisty canyons i've seen around in socal, then again i havent' seen many.

i think if nothing else if you are new you are taking on probably the harder canyon roads tehre are, both change elevation pretty fast and also the decreasing radius turns are pretty tight.

try piuma canyon and malibu canyon instead for starters tehy have somewhat genteler turns to them so that you can get used to looking through turns and rolling on the thtrottle and giving room to cagers going into turns.

Thanks, yeah, i was thinking those were pretty tight twists.