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Help me figure out this leak.

Started by Betlog, October 02, 2011, 06:42:08 PM

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Betlog

October 02, 2011, 06:42:08 PM
I have a small fluid leak by the clutch slave cylinder.  When I opened the master cylinder, it does not look like the level is going down.  As far as the consistency of the leak... it feels like oil.  How do I verify that it's engine oil and not brake fluid?  My guess is that the leak is coming out from the engine-side through the pushrod hole, however, I've replaced the two pushrod O-rings as well as the red O-ring that is lodged between the clutch slave cylinder and the engine cover.  Still leaks...  Any thoughts?

ducpainter

#1
October 02, 2011, 06:45:17 PM
I'd clean the area well, dry, and spray with aerosol foot powder,

The source will be evident.
"Once you accept that a child on the autistic spectrum experiences the world in
 a completely different way than you, you will be open to understand how that
 perspective
    is even more amazing than yours."
    To realize the value of nine  months:
    Ask a mother who gave birth to a stillborn.
"Don't piss off old people The older we get, the less 'Life in Prison' is a deterrent."


Betlog

#2
October 02, 2011, 06:59:31 PM
Thanks ducpainter.  The leak is oozing out of where the slave cylinder is attached to the engine case.  So either the leak is due to a leaking slave cylinder (brake fluid) or through the pushrod hole (oil fluid).

ducpainter

#3
October 02, 2011, 07:02:03 PM
Quote from: Betlog on October 02, 2011, 06:59:31 PM
Thanks ducpainter.  The leak is oozing out of where the slave cylinder is attached to the engine case.  So either the leak is due to a leaking slave cylinder (brake fluid) or through the pushrod hole (oil fluid).
Did you check the pushrod carefully for nicks/burrs when you replaced the o-rings? Did you grease it before installation to lube/protect the o-rings?

You'll find it.
"Once you accept that a child on the autistic spectrum experiences the world in
 a completely different way than you, you will be open to understand how that
 perspective
    is even more amazing than yours."
    To realize the value of nine  months:
    Ask a mother who gave birth to a stillborn.
"Don't piss off old people The older we get, the less 'Life in Prison' is a deterrent."


Betlog

#4
October 02, 2011, 07:33:23 PM
Quote from: ducpainter on October 02, 2011, 07:02:03 PM
Did you check the pushrod carefully for nicks/burrs when you replaced the o-rings? Did you grease it before installation to lube/protect the o-rings?

You'll find it.

I did check the push rod and didn't see any damage.  I used engine oil to grease the o-rings and I used brake caliper high temp grease for the clutch slave cylinder part of the rod.

ducpainter

#5
October 02, 2011, 07:35:53 PM
Sometimes they can be slightly bent.

If it turns out to be the o-rings again, which I now doubt based on your report, roll it on a flat surface.
"Once you accept that a child on the autistic spectrum experiences the world in
 a completely different way than you, you will be open to understand how that
 perspective
    is even more amazing than yours."
    To realize the value of nine  months:
    Ask a mother who gave birth to a stillborn.
"Don't piss off old people The older we get, the less 'Life in Prison' is a deterrent."


Betlog

#6
October 02, 2011, 08:50:17 PM
Quote from: ducpainter on October 02, 2011, 07:35:53 PM
Sometimes they can be slightly bent.

If it turns out to be the o-rings again, which I now doubt based on your report, roll it on a flat surface.

Thanks ducpainter.  I'll take it out and investigate further.  Any tips?  I've not fully taken it out of the bike, just pulled it out enough to replace the O-rings.

ducpainter

#7
October 03, 2011, 02:22:39 AM
I'd pull the push rod completely out and have a good look if it turns out to be the o-rings.

Clean it up and spray it first.
"Once you accept that a child on the autistic spectrum experiences the world in
 a completely different way than you, you will be open to understand how that
 perspective
    is even more amazing than yours."
    To realize the value of nine  months:
    Ask a mother who gave birth to a stillborn.
"Don't piss off old people The older we get, the less 'Life in Prison' is a deterrent."


Betlog

#8
October 04, 2011, 07:24:12 PM
Ok, so I took out the push rod and took some pics (see below).  I noticed that both ends of the rods have some shiny marks - on the clutch slave side, the very tip is shiny; on the throwout bearing side, a shiny groove can be seen by the curved tip (the groove does not look deep, just shiny).  Is this normal or related to my oil leak?



ducpainter

#9
October 07, 2011, 04:07:15 AM
I think the push rod looks OK.

The pushrod will spin a little bit with the transmission shaft and that could cause the shiny spots which would indicate the points of contact with the slave piston and the push piece that contacts the bearing.

If the rod spins too much, as it would if the bearing was bad, it would wear out the o-rings in short order.

Did you clean and spray the area yet?
"Once you accept that a child on the autistic spectrum experiences the world in
 a completely different way than you, you will be open to understand how that
 perspective
    is even more amazing than yours."
    To realize the value of nine  months:
    Ask a mother who gave birth to a stillborn.
"Don't piss off old people The older we get, the less 'Life in Prison' is a deterrent."


Betlog

#10
October 07, 2011, 10:31:43 PM
Quote from: ducpainter on October 07, 2011, 04:07:15 AM
I think the push rod looks OK.

The pushrod will spin a little bit with the transmission shaft and that could cause the shiny spots which would indicate the points of contact with the slave piston and the push piece that contacts the bearing.

If the rod spins too much, as it would if the bearing was bad, it would wear out the o-rings in short order.

Did you clean and spray the area yet?

Thanks Duc.  I did clean the area and put some sort of indicator I can use to help see if the leak is coming from where I think it is.  I'll update the thread if I see anything else or if I make any progress with this. 

Cloner

#11
October 12, 2011, 08:10:57 AM
This may sound gross....but taste it.  Don't drink it...just touch it to your tongue.

Brake fluid tastes bitter.  Oil doesn't.

If it tastes like pee....look for the neighbor's cat.   ;D
Never appeal to a man's "better nature."  He may not have one.  Invoking his self-interest gives you more leverage.  R.A. Heinlein

'64 Ducati Monza 250
'67 Aermacchi/HD Sprint SS (race bike)
'00 Aprilia RSV Mille
'03 Ducati 800 SS (race bike)
'04 KTM 450 EXC
'08 Kawasaki Ninja 250 (race bike)

Betlog

#12
December 24, 2011, 04:31:26 PM
Quote from: Cloner on October 12, 2011, 08:10:57 AM
This may sound gross....but taste it.  Don't drink it...just touch it to your tongue.

Brake fluid tastes bitter.  Oil doesn't.

If it tastes like pee....look for the neighbor's cat.   ;D

I checked the clutch master cylinder and it looks fine.  I did taste the leaking oil and it didn't really taste bitter.  Any other suggestions?

I tracked the leak to the spot where the slave cylinders is attached to the bike. 

This has got me stumped.   [bang]

Betlog

#13
December 24, 2011, 04:36:37 PM
PS Is it bad to run the bike like this?  I am not getting a puddle under the bike.  Oil levels seem fine.
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