Adjusting the brakes...Options?

[Blue]

Let's talk about brakes on my 2000 M900ie.

I bought the bike used with the stock brake set up.  The stock set up is dual 320mm steel spoke brembo rotors, with dual twin pin gold line calipers, stainless steel braided "Y" brake lines and remote gold line master cylinder complete with the pee cup with the stock 4 position lever.

I have ridden with this set up on the street and track and have been quite happy with the set up.

This past winter I needed to replace my brake pads as they were getting thin.  I purchased Dunlop HH+ pads as the replacement.  I also took this opportunity to switch the rotors to brembo snowflake rotors that I "home floated".  With this new set up, braking performance was increased and I was happy with the results.   Very linear power with a good initial bite.

The issue I am running into are the brakes on my GSXR track bike.  The brakes are twin 320mm rotors with twin 4 piston calipers with EBC HH pads, dual stainless steel brake lines with a remote master cylinder and CRG shorty levers.  The braking on this bike is progressive but powerful.

Comparing the two, the GSXR is soft at first but stops as hard as the Monster with a firm squeeze.  The Monster is linear with a large initial bite with little application of the brake lever.  I am having a hard time switching between the two due to the difference between the brakes.  I purchased shorty levers for the Monster to reduce the amount of leverage thinking this may soften the delivery a bit. 

Is there a way to adjust braking performance of the Monster other than buying new pads for either bike?  Some adjustment that I am not aware of or larger air gap in the reservoir?  Just curious what my options might be.   

[ducpainter]

Dunlop has 2 versions of the HH+ pad.

A street and racing. The racing version has a very harsh initial bite. I have those in my Monster.

I chose the non race for the 996 with 4 pad calipers and don't notice harsh initial bite.

Did you get the race version?

To answer your question...you need to change pads.

[Blue]

Thanks for the reply, though it isn't what I want to hear.
I believe I purchased these pads:
SDP SPORT HH+
But I will check when I get home as I saved the packaging. 
It lists a strong initial bite, which it definitely does have, I just am surprised by how little the lever has to travel to get full braking.  It wouldn't be an issue, but it is different enough from my track bike that it is currently bugging me when switching between the two. 
Perhaps I should move on to fixing something that is actually broken instead of something that works as it should?

[ducpainter]

The Racing version is pretty clearly marked, and IIRC the packaging is green/yellow.

Sounds like you should get better pads for the track bike and don't fix what ain't broke. 

[Howie]

Piston sizes of the calipers and masters the same on both bikes?

[Blue]

Piston sizes of the calipers and masters the same on both bikes?

Howie,

Monster master is 16mm, calipers are 30/34mm.

GSXR master is 5/8" or ~16mm, calipers are 30/34mm.
The casting on the master was hard to read with removal and I am not quite the motivated yet.  I will search the web to see what I can come up with.
 

[Blue]

The Racing version is pretty clearly marked, and IIRC the packaging is green/yellow.

Sounds like you should get better pads for the track bike and don't fix what ain't broke.  

I checked the packaging and the part numbers match, but are the older backing.  They are green with a yellow burst in the middle, but they say they are the street and not the racing version.  They do boast of being of SuperSport compound.  

Given the information here, I should probably switch the GSXR pads to the DPHH+ as I can't remember a time at the track where I wished for less brakes.  I found a set for my the Gixxer for $40.  Should probably scoop them up. 

[DarkStaR]

Maybe be a 15mm master would help, but I'm going to guess...if you don't want to replace the pads, you probably do not want to replace the master.

Not too sure if this will even work, but maybe try a banjo bolt with a smaller orifice.

Re: Are all banjo bolts created equal?
http://www.ducatimonsterforum.org/index.php?topic=39951.0

[bigiain]

To answer your question...you need to change pads.

One other thing to consider - I'm pretty sure the brakes on my Monster feel "bitey" because of the (stock) progressive weight springs I've got in the front. I had some 0.95 springs in it for a while, and the brakes felt quite different without the large initial dive from the initially very soft springs. My guess is that the difference in feel between the GSXR and the Monster is more to do with suspension, weight distribution, and CG height - I'd bet the near-identical brake systems are generating near-identical forces at the rotors.

big

[Blue]

Maybe be a 15mm master would help, but I'm going to guess...if you don't want to replace the pads, you probably do not want to replace the master.

It isn't that I am against changing the pads, I just want to understand as much as possible before doing so.  It would be a bummer to switch pads only to have the same problem arise.  That being said, sometimes that is the only way to know for sure. 

Plus, I like to think (over think) things from time to time. For me, riding is a third of the equation, the other two parts are spinning wrenches and thinking about them.  For others, the ratio between these are different. 

With that, this situation hasn't caused close calls or an accident.  I feel like the time spent at the track on the Monster and now Gixxer is helping me to develop preferences (for better or worse) rather than the need constantly upgrade.  I am not a pro, nor do I race.  Just a guy with a Monster with powerful brakes and a Gixxer with good brakes and trying to figure out what he likes best. 

[Blue]

One other thing to consider - I'm pretty sure the brakes on my Monster feel "bitey" because of the (stock) progressive weight springs I've got in the front. I had some 0.95 springs in it for a while, and the brakes felt quite different without the large initial dive from the initially very soft springs. My guess is that the difference in feel between the GSXR and the Monster is more to do with suspension, weight distribution, and CG height - I'd bet the near-identical brake systems are generating near-identical forces at the rotors.

big

The suspension on the Monster has been done, Racetech up front and Ohlins out back, sprung for my weight (though on the stiff side).  Sag is on the firm side for the Monster, a bit softer on the Gixxer, but set up well as well. 
I get a lot of braking with little lever travel on the Monster.  The new 6 position shorty lever has helped this.  With the lever on setting 1 (closest to the bar) the leverage is less and the input seems less abrupt.  It has smoothed it out for me.  Setting 6 is closer to where I was before.  I don't know if this is where I'll end up, just trying things out to see what I like and the effect of the changes.  I have time and motivation currently to do so.  Most importantly, having fun.