Monster S2r800 '05 - key not recognized (twice now)

[pmazdan9]

Hi everyone, me again with another problem. Ducati eh...

Some time ago I've had a problem with immobilizer/key. Immobilizer light would blink twice then go solid, which basically means key not recognized afaik. Sometimes resetting the ignition multiple times would help but it was getting worse to the point where it just didn't recognize key at all. I've changed the key and it worked fine for less than a month. Now it's happening again! This morning I had to turn ignition off and on 3 times and it worked but I know from previous experience it will only get worse.

What's going on? I rode in a heavy rain with both keys (trips to Wales and Cornwall) if that matters but are they that sensitive? It's ridicoulus. Or do I have another problem? I find it hard to believe I had 2 faulty keys. Any suggestions?

One thing I'll do is try using the old key again (one that stopped working), maybe it needed to dry, dunno. But still...

[stopintime]

Wales? Should have never gone there 


I suggest the antenna under the ignition lock plastic cover. You can try to clean, dry and lubricate it (use products intended for excactly that), but chances are you need a new.

[pmazdan9]

Maybe you're right considering it was raining inside my tent 

I was thinking the same thing first, in fact I thought it was loose but it sits very tight in the cover and looks ok (obv doesn't mean it's working). But then if it was faulty it wouldn't have recognized second key, right? Literally, old key stopped working completely, new one solved the problem straightaway. I assume if antenna was faulty, new key wouldn't have solved the problem.

[stopintime]

You're using logic to understand your bike  Not always the best approach 

[Speeddog]

Electrical problems are often intermittent.

[pmazdan9]

You're using logic to understand your bike  Not always the best approach 

I guess you're right haha you made me laugh Well, I'm IT programmer so always seeking logical explanation

Electrical problems are often intermittent.

Yeah true, thanks!

It's got to be the antenna, you guys were right I think. Second key solving the problem must have been a coinsidence. My third key didn't work yesterday I'll need to find new antenna or try to fix mine, until then I'll need to figure out the immobilizer override procedure.

[pmazdan9]

Right, just checked antenna connection (under ignition) on my lunch break. And of course it was full of water. I wiped it as much as I could. Turned key just to see what happens and guess what, 3 times it worked fine. I hope it was just that.

I should have checked that straightaway I guess. I can't believe this bike is so vulnerable to rain though... same thing happened to my oil pressure sensor and one of the brake micro switches ot long ago. Should have learned a lesson.

Every morning I pray for it to let me try to start it (immobilizer being funny). Then I pray for it to actually start (starter motor wiring and whatnot). Then I pray for it to not stall when getting out of neutral (cold enigne, wet clutch). Is it just my ducati or are they all like that? Makes me think all these ducati reliability memes are actually true lol. Never had a single issue with japanese bikes. But then I didn't really enjoy them as much

[Speeddog]

There should be a rubber gasket that seals between the female/male parts of the connector, was that present, and is it undamaged?
You can orient the connector such that the outer part of the connector is 'up', such that water does not sit on the gasket.
A bit of dielectric grease will help those connector pins/sockets as well.

There should be a rubber boot over the connector on the oil pressure sensor, is that present?

As far as your other problems, you said there was a bit of a mess under the tank with modified wiring.
Your slave cylinder was leaking.
Honestly, your bike is 14 years old, was the bike maintained with any sort of regularity and skill?
Or did it just sit outdoors 24/7/365 in the UK and only get repairs done?

There's 'repairs' and there's 'maintenance'.
Less maintenance=more repairs.

[pmazdan9]

There should be a rubber gasket that seals between the female/male parts of the connector, was that present, and is it undamaged?

Yes and yes. There was still some water in there though. To clarify, it works perfectly fine now once dry.

You can orient the connector such that the outer part of the connector is 'up', such that water does not sit on the gasket.
A bit of dielectric grease will help those connector pins/sockets as well.

There's a bracket on the frame which holds this very cable. If it happens again I might change it's position. Good point on dialectric grease, it's on my list.

There should be a rubber boot over the connector on the oil pressure sensor, is that present?

Again, yes it is, but some water still gets in in heavy rain unfortunately.

As far as your other problems, you said there was a bit of a mess under the tank with modified wiring.
Your slave cylinder was leaking.
Honestly, your bike is 14 years old, was the bike maintained with any sort of regularity and skill?
Or did it just sit outdoors 24/7/365 in the UK and only get repairs done?
There's 'repairs' and there's 'maintenance'.
Less maintenance=more repairs.

This bike has a full service history, it's been regularly serviced at reputable ducati dealer in London and never missed a schedule. PO even changed a bulb @ ducati dealer for £50! All receipts are present for regular maintenance and occasional repairs. It was garaged. Bike was well looked after, ridden by a mid aged bloke who, judging by tire wear, only rode straight It doesn't really matter it's 14 years old if it was looked after well. I've owned/seen older bikes in the past with higher mileage, abused, not requiring any work other than regular maintenance and sorting rustwelded bolts.

Ducati however, in 3 months time:
- new clutch due to broken damper springs and knackered primary driven gear, 32mm retaining nut went completely loose (ok this one obviously took much longer than 3 months but I had to bite the bullet). It's still not perfect as I had to keep old inner hub which is slightly notched hence the drag on cold engine
- new slave - OEM was leaking, aftermarket was too big
- dashboard cover needed replacing as it cracked from vibrations (ok, that's PO not me, I knew about it and used it to negotiate price - but I've heard it's a common thing and it shouldn't really be...)
- it's playing up after rain - oil pressure sensor and immo, and other things
- gas cap wouldn't open one day, it got stuck, had to take it to the garage/locksmith - the same thing happened to PO with the ignition and it had to be replaced (again, by ducati dealer using OEM parts)
- tank expanded a bit so had to adjust steering
- handlebar cracked, I guess from combination of bar end mirrors and vibrations
- rear brake almost non existent, need to keep bleeding it
- rear brake micro switch stopped working
- clutch micro switch keep getting loose

There's more, list goes on. I've spent a lot of time on repairs. And a lot of money too, but luckilly I'm single so no need to find excuses I just wanna ride and not worry about things like that. I rely on this bike, it's a toy as well as a commuter. I expect it to work considering it's service history, yet it keeps breaking. All these random things are driving me crazy, one day it works fine, next morning it won't start and I'm late to work.

Don't get me wrong, I am not complaining (maybe a little) - I absolutely love this bike and would buy it again! I've read that s2r 800 are one of the more reliable ducs. All 2V air cooled apparently are, they last forever if maintained well, they just need service more often and parts are more expensive. I was aware of it. I've heard of monsters with over 200k miles on clocks. I was pretty sure ducati reliability is a bit of a myth, a thing like all gixxer riders are gay, or stories coming out from people who neglect the maintenance schedule. Considering my experience so far... is it a myth?

[Speeddog]

"It doesn't really matter it's 14 years old if it was looked after well."

Some things yes, some things, no.
Lots of things on a bike degrade just due to time alone.
Primarily the rubber and plastic items.

You are in a wet environment.
Electrical items especially have problems in a wet environment, principally connector-related.
This requires a proactive approach, frankly I'm surprised that the dealer doesn't seem to have done much in that regard.

I'm in California, where we likely get as much rain in a whole year as you get in a week.
I've been working on Ducs for a dozen years, so I've seen a good sized sample of bikes.

Ducati however, in 3 months time:
- new clutch due to broken damper springs and knackered primary driven gear, 32mm retaining nut went completely loose (ok this one obviously took much longer than 3 months but I had to bite the bullet). It's still not perfect as I had to keep old inner hub which is slightly notched hence the drag on cold engine

Yes, that didn't happen in the 3 months you've had it, only that you discovered it.
It is a known issue, but not common.
Other motos have the same sort of system and suffer the same sort of failure.
IMO it's a poorly executed device.
The hub nuts do occasionally come loose, I suspect the hammering due to the broken cush drive is primarily responsible.


- new slave - OEM was leaking, aftermarket was too big

Again a known issue, but not common.
Time, mileage, environment.
The hydraulics on your bike use brake fluid, which is notoriously hygroscopic, and you're in a wet environment.
Higher chance of corrosion in the system.
Aftermarket unit sized to reduce effort on a dry-clutch Duc, which can tolerate a smaller throw.

- dashboard cover needed replacing as it cracked from vibrations (ok, that's PO not me, I knew about it and used it to negotiate price - but I've heard it's a common thing and it shouldn't really be...)

Known issue, not common.
I've seen it occasionally, but not isolated to one model, nor one configuration of instrument cluster.
IMO it's due to shrinkage of the plastic over time combined with a local defect from the molding process or mechanical damage.

- it's playing up after rain - oil pressure sensor and immo, and other things
- gas cap wouldn't open one day, it got stuck, had to take it to the garage/locksmith - the same thing happened to PO with the ignition and it had to be replaced (again, by ducati dealer using OEM parts)

Needs proactive maintenance; dielectric grease primarily.
The gas cap and ignition switch are not manufactured by Ducati, other bikes use the same hardware, check out Yamahas.

- tank expanded a bit so had to adjust steering

Chronic problem on plastic tanked Ducs.
Plastic tanked KTMs have the same issue.
Bad material choice for a gas tank.

- handlebar cracked, I guess from combination of bar end mirrors and vibrations

I've never seen this on a Duc.
Where did it crack?

- rear brake almost non existent, need to keep bleeding it

Quite common on S*R bikes.
Only countermeasure I've found is to adjust the brake line so it's not touching the motor.
That, and removing the caliper and orienting it 'bleeder up' when bleeding.
It cannot be bled properly when it's mounted.
OEM will never be great, but it can be serviceable.

- rear brake micro switch stopped working

I've only seen this when the bike gets dropped on the right side, the plunger pin gets bent and it sticks.
Beyond that, wet environment.

- clutch micro switch keep getting loose

Haven't seen that.
It may be that the tab on the lever is physically 'hard-stopping' on the switch before it's stopping on the bar.

----------------------------
Editad foor speeling

[Stuka Pilot]

Kudos to you Pmazdan, with that laundry list of problems after 3 months many people - me included - would have pushed it in the river and banished it from memory!

I admire your persistence.

[pmazdan9]

@Speeddog - thank you for all the comments, I appreciate it. Basically you just confirmed that all these things can happen. I'm not saying they are isolated to s2r, or any other ducati really. These can happen to any motorcycle. But they just don't - or at least not that often! None of mine or my friend's japanese bikes had that many problems in such a short period of time!

Lots of things on a bike degrade just due to time alone.
Primarily the rubber and plastic items.

I agree of course, but I've not listed any problem related directly to this. Theoritically, rubber hoses and things that do degrade over time and can affect performance, should be changed by the dealer every 2 years or whatever it is in the maintenance schedule.

I've never seen this on a Duc.
Where did it crack?

Just at the end of handlebar. I only noticed when my twistgrip locked in place, lol. A friend of mine welded it while I was working on the clutch

Kudos to you Pmazdan, with that laundry list of problems after 3 months many people - me included - would have pushed it in the river and banished it from memory!

I admire your persistence.

Thanks Trust me on few ocassions I considerd getting rid of it. But I really do love this bike.

There's more, really. Steering head bearing has a bit of play and will need replacing. Belts and valves are due. Idle needs to be set as it's only 1000, to do that I'll need to take it to the dealer to reset TPS. It was so much easier on my sv650... turn the screw, done. It could do with throttle sync too I guess, or/and new fuel map. I got a puncture in brand new tyre. Twice! RL indicator bracket somehow keeps bending, I guess it's from the seat. I might have a vacuum leak too. I was hoping it's just a loose spigot screw from scottoiler, but no. It's something else, grrr, not had a time to look at it yet.

There's few more little things but really I just don't want to list all of it, best not to think about it