Police Work Van

[heatherp]

Eloquently put Dragon.   

But you're preaching to the converted  [moto].  Is there no action we can take against this stupidity?? I can't bring myself to conform but you can't win against the bastids either. 

And I'm loathe to say anything about the lack of revenue I have donated to official retirement funds lately during my 9000km junket.  Especially now I have a legal number plate that will stand out like you-know-what's in a photo. 

But then I do ride like a girl 

[CairnsDuc]

We now have 3 Speed Cameras
2 new Highway Patrol cars (Not counting the 2 already up here)
and more Speed Guns then ever before.

And yet our Road toll before Xmas was the highest ever recorded, and yet still people
swallow the "Speed Kills" bullshit hook line and sinker everytime.

there was a crash a few months out from Xmas, A family friends Sister and brother in law
and there Child, Killed because a Drunk driver decided to over take in Fog coming in the
other direction and pulled out in front of them, instantly killed.

And yet, the police blamed Speed...... 
1. The Guy was drunk out of his brain
2. He pulled out over double lines
3. 2 cars doing 100k's hit each other head on

And the local Traffic plods blamed Speed as the factor that killed them?!?!?
It wasn't until days later that it came out he had crossed double lines and he was drunk out of his brain.
The Driver he went around was doing 80k's in the clearing Fog came forward with the complete story
about the guy's reckless driving at which point the Police admitted he was also well over the Blood Alcohol limit.

And yet to this day, the Police still put this accident down to Speed 
HOW THE make the beast with two backs DOES THAT WORK?

[dragonworld.]

Its very easy to blame speed!! Duh!! Sharp as bowling balls these investigators!? Of course they were speeding, they were moving werent they?? Therefore they were at speed?? Yes?

Investigating properly and thoroughly and looking and reporting  ALL factors and not just the politically preferable elements that fit nicely into the authorities' agenda wheelbarrow is what SHOULD be happening! 

[FIFO]

  Is there no action we can take against this stupidity?? I can't bring myself to conform but you can't win against the bastids either. 

The ballot box is one way to go.
At the end of the day we vote.
But unfortunately we don't all stick together.
And the guvmn't here listen to the likes of the road safety council aka HAROLD SCRUBY bleating  on 
Need to send letters to your local member etc.
 A good case for example is the shooters party in NSW.
They put some people up and got elected.
The shooters party now have two members in the NSW Parliament.
Now i don't want to start a debate on the values of owning a nice big gun.
But goes to show people power works.
And the shooting fraternity stick together
 There must be more Bike riders and other car enthusiasts out there than gun owners, to get some voted in, to fight these bastards and there draconian laws.


We need a party name and a leader

I will give Betty my vote for leader 

[heatherp]

Its very easy to blame speed!! Duh!! Sharp as bowling balls these investigators!? Of course they were speeding, they were moving werent they?? Therefore they were at speed?? Yes?

Just what I was thinking but you beat me to it.

Investigating properly and thoroughly and looking and reporting  ALL factors and not just the politically preferable elements that fit nicely into the authorities' agenda wheelbarrow is what SHOULD be happening! 

That's too hard, they don't have the resources and it would drain tax payer inputs into pollies fat super policies.

Article in the Herald Sun today re: Bob Jane setting up courses at Calder raceway for 'hoons' to show them the dangers of their behaviour on the streets and letting them get it out of their system at the track instead with legal off-street drag racing.  I would like to see a scheme introduced where you have a choice - pay a fine or pay to attend this course. Bet I couldn't get a pollie to support  education over revenue raising though.

[heatherp]

There must be more Bike riders and other car enthusiasts out there than gun owners, to get some voted in, to fight these bastards and there draconian laws.


We need a party name and a leader

I will give Betty my vote for leader 

Rob - all the pollies are the same doesn't matter who you vote for, they all want us to pay for their slice of pie.

There is, and has been, riders' advocates on all these road safety boards for years but, as a minority, we seem to get ignored more and more.

  Betty gets my vote too.   

[FIFO]

Rob - all the pollies are the same doesn't matter who you vote for, they all want us to pay for their slice of pie.

There is, and has been, riders' advocates on all these road safety boards for years but, as a minority, we seem to get ignored more and more.

Advocates aren't enough.
We we need a dedicated party
How this for a name.
Fair go for road users party.
I recon it would get votes, especially if we got Betty as leader.
in NSW 

You guys will have to find your on leader down there

[monstermick58]

Its very easy to blame speed!! Duh!! Sharp as bowling balls these investigators!? Of course they were speeding, they were moving werent they?? Therefore they were at speed?? Yes?

Investigating properly and thoroughly and looking and reporting  ALL factors and not just the politically preferable elements that fit nicely into the authorities' agenda wheelbarrow is what SHOULD be happening! 

Years ago (geeze Mick your an old bastid) when I was in MRA NSW (real old) we used our own forms at accidents which at the time was more comprehensive than what the cops used and we found in most cases 'other' factors than speed.


Even today when I'm wearing my RFS cap, I watch how the Traffic Accident squad go about there bussiness, they take lots of pictures and paint lots of yellow lines on the road, and yet the result nearly always seems the same - speed. Me, I've got my own theory, mobile phones. Now there is a subject on its own.




                        Mmick

[dragonworld.]

I hear ya Mick!! Being a Bona Fide "old bastard" meself I can remember these "private" traffic conflict reports! And the difference between unbiased and politically oriented crash reporting! 

[CairnsDuc]

I remember reading a while ago from one of the Guys on Netrider (I think) he was involved in one of the discussion groups
for some road safety committee for Vic Roads and the TAC, they were discussing various items and assorted bits and pieces,
then one thing about crashes really caused him to sit up and take notice, A senior traffic Cop mentioned when determining the
reason for an accident, they were instructed if no clear reason for an accident could be determined, it was marked as a speed
related incident.
Also if someone had a crash, say on a wet road, you were doing 60 in an 80 zone and had a bingle, it would be a marked as
a speed related incident (To fast for the conditions)

He started to bring up a number of different scenarios:
Oil slick on road + Bike has crash because of Oil = Speed related crash (To fast for the conditions)
Car pulls out in front of you + Hit car and crash = Speed related crash (To fast to take avoiding actions)

He rattled off a staggering amount of scenarios to this Cop and just about every time they could twist it into a Speed related
accident, He said this was pushed from the very top levels of the Police and Vic roads/Government. and was to assist
with the role of Speed related enforcement. Revenue raising.

So you can see why I get on my Soap box every time the issue of Speeding gets raised, there is just so much lies and bullshit out there
it is incredible.
And Quite frankly why I don't vote, I don't want to be seen supporting any of the Wankers in power or trying to get into power.
Because the are all Thieves and Liars. Favorite Quote from the Movie Hunt for Red October from a Politician
"When I'm not kissing Babies, I'm stealing there Lollipops!" Never a truer word spoken!

[Betty]

That's too hard, they don't have the resources

I don't know if that is true ... I think the 'serious' accidents are investigated pretty thoroughly - its just how it is reported that's the problem.

Heather, you may recall a little incident on the F3 not too long ago (well perhaps your clutch arm wants you to forget) ... most of the initial delay was related to 'crash investigation' so I think we can't dismiss the job that they do. My understanding was the cause of the accident was 'speed differential' ... in other words somebody was going TOO SLOW in comparison to the other traffic.

No prizes for guessing that it was reported as a 'SPEED RELATED ACCIDENT'. The fact that it caused many hours of delays (some people taking 8-9 hours to get home from work) only made it easier to push the 'road safety message' ... even though the delays were mostly caused by bureaucratic cock-ups which resulted in some heads rolling.

But the over-riding message ... SPEED KILLS.

[Betty]

... all snipped for brevity ...

Anybody with any amount of logic knows that is what happens ... if speed is mentioned anywhere on a crash investigation report, i will be listed as a cause ... or the cause.

The problem is you need hard evidence that this is what is happening ... so you need people like the guy mentioned (but more than one) to turn 'whistleblower' and have enough public support to cause an uprising. I honestly believe for something to happen there needs to be some kind of sustained public protest on a massive, massive scale.

But the problem is that the Australian public are far too tolerant, too lazy and concede when boredom sets in ... but we are all happy if somebody else does it for us.

Plus anybody that leads this type of thing becomes a political animal themselves and they start to push there own agenda, the real issues get lost and the confused movement becomes easy prey for our political 'representatives'.

See, not a cynical bone in my body.

[heatherp]

Anybody with any amount of logic knows that is what happens ... if speed is mentioned anywhere on a crash investigation report, i will be listed as a cause ... or the cause.

The problem is you need hard evidence that this is what is happening ... so you need people like the guy mentioned (but more than one) to turn 'whistleblower' and have enough public support to cause an uprising. I honestly believe for something to happen there needs to be some kind of sustained public protest on a massive, massive scale.

But the problem is that the Australian public are far too tolerant, too lazy and concede when boredom sets in ... but we are all happy if somebody else does it for us.

Plus anybody that leads this type of thing becomes a political animal themselves and they start to push there own agenda, the real issues get lost and the confused movement becomes easy prey for our political 'representatives'.

See, not a cynical bone in my body.

Agree totally with ya Betty.  That's why we are voting for you.  All the points you make are exactly what I'm thinking - creepy.

Oh and I was being sarcastic with my "Too hard, no resources comment".