So the wife and I turned vegetarian......

[Triple J]

Eating that much fish really isn't very healthy.

Heavy metals in the water (i.e. mercury)

Depends on which fish you eat. Not all have heavy metal problems.

[Holden]

Eating that much fish really isn't very healthy.

Heavy metals in the water (i.e. mercury)

Depends on which fish you eat. Not all have heavy metal problems.

http://ducatimonsterforum.org/index.php?topic=21888.msg391443#msg391443

I would just as well assume that all of them have toxin problems, but that it won't necessarily translate to health problems for you. But you never know what trace elements may be contributing to in the long run for your particular physiology. Like I said, everyone is different.

Hell, the stuff they find in cattle and swine is probably worse.

[somegirl]

With regards to iron:

It is certainly possible to get enough iron in a vegan diet; it's a bit harder in a lacto-ovo diet, as dairy products are low in iron and furthermore inhibit iron absorption.  It is also important to make sure you get enough vitamin C with the iron, as it helps iron absorption, and avoid consuming things with your iron such as tea/coffee or oxalate-rich foods (including spinach), as they inhibit iron absorption.  Rich vegetarian sources of iron include leafy green vegetables (broccoli, kale, collard greens), legumes such as lentils, soybeans, black beans, garbanzo beans, soy-based products such as tofu and soymilk, blackstrap molasses, and quinoa.

B12:

The vast majority of B12-deficient people are not vegan/vegetarian and are not due to inadequate intake; it is generally due to inadequate absorption, which gets worse as people age.  In some people it is worse and is known as pernicious anemia, and may require injections of B12 (whether you are an omnivore or vegan).  It is important to make sure you have a regular source of B12; this could be from a supplement, fortified soymilk, nutritional yeast, fortified breakfast cereals, dairy products, eggs, or meat.  B12 is produced by bacteria that usually live in the ground; the reason that animal products contain B12 is because they consume bits of soil or manure along with their food.  Vegetarian sources of B12 are made from cultures of bacteria producing B12.

BTW, omnivorous diets are prone to their own deficiencies, which is why things like milk, cereals, and flour are typically supplemented with various vitamins and minerals, and why multivitamins are so popular.

For anyone who thinks that a vegetarian/vegan diet is insufficient and unhealthy, here is a list of some vegan/vegetarian athletes:
http://www.veganathlete.com/vegan_vegetarian_athletes.php

If anyone wants recommendations for books on vegetarian/vegan cooking and/or nutrition, feel free to PM me.

[Holden]

B12:

The vast majority of B12-deficient people are not vegan/vegetarian and are not due to inadequate intake; it is generally due to inadequate absorption, which gets worse as people age.  In some people it is worse and is known as pernicious anemia, and may require injections of B12 (whether you are an omnivore or vegan).  It is important to make sure you have a regular source of B12; this could be from a supplement, fortified soymilk, nutritional yeast, fortified breakfast cereals, dairy products, eggs, or meat.  B12 is produced by bacteria that usually live in the ground; the reason that animal products contain B12 is because they consume bits of soil or manure along with their food.  Vegetarian sources of B12 are made from cultures of bacteria producing B12.

BTW, omnivorous diets are prone to their own deficiencies, which is why things like milk, cereals, and flour are typically supplemented with various vitamins and minerals, and why multivitamins are so popular.

For anyone who thinks that a vegetarian/vegan diet is insufficient and unhealthy, here is a list of some vegan/vegetarian athletes:
http://www.veganathlete.com/vegan_vegetarian_athletes.php

If anyone wants recommendations for books on vegetarian/vegan cooking and/or nutrition, feel free to PM me.

From the article I posted earlier:

The human gut also contains B12-synthesizing bacteria, living from the mouth to the anus. The presence of these bacteria is an important reason that disease from vitamin B12 deficiency occurs very rarely in people, even those who have been strict vegetarians (vegans) all of their lives. The colon contains the greatest number of bacteria (4 trillion/cc of feces), and here most of our intestinal B12 is produced. However, because B12 is absorbed in the ileum, which lies upstream of the colon, this plentiful source of B12 is not immediately available for absorptionâ€"unless people eat feces (don't gasp). Feces of cows, chickens, sheep and people contain large amounts of active B12. Until recently most people lived in close contact with their farm animals, and all people consumed B12 left as residues by bacteria living on their un-sanitized vegetable foods.

[ducatiz]

Eating that much fish really isn't very healthy.

Heavy metals in the water (i.e. mercury)

I've often wondered about this claim.  Since Japanese eat about 20 times the fish that Americans do, you'd expect to see more mercury-related diseases in Japan.  However, the incidence of mercury poisoning and birth defects is no higher than in the USA.

Depends on which fish you eat. Not all have heavy metal problems.

What's funny to me is how the FDA tells pregnant women not to eat fish, but Japanese women (while pregnant) consume no less fish (and raw), but the incidence of disease and birth defect related to heavy metals are the same as in the USA.

[ducatiz]

Keep in mind that your [possibly diseased] physiology does not represent mankind as a wholeâ€"I know mine doesn't!

Think of George Burns w/r/t smoking. Just because he lived to be 100 smoking multiple cigars each day doesn't mean it won't kill you prematurely. Everyone is different.

Regarding B12 (which is synthesized in human intestines), here is an interesting one:
http://www.drmcdougall.com/misc/2007nl/nov/b12.htm

McDougall's beliefs are not mainstream and while his nutritional recommendations may work for some people, they will not work for everyone. 

For instance, it is well known that Eskimo traditionally survive on a diet consisting of whale and seal meat and fat -- about 50-70%.  However, the incidence of cardio and circulatory problems related to a high-fat diet are non existent among Eskimo who keep a traditional diet.

[Holden]

For sure. There really are so many variables to consider...

[Popeye the Sailor]

a completely vegetarian lifestyle isn't appropriate for humans.  long-term vegetarians always show muscle degradation, common b12 deficiency and deviant sexuality.

i was 100% vegetarian for over 20 years and it took its toll on me. 

So.....you were a sexual deviant?

[redxblack]

My wife has been vegetarian for 22 years, and I've been for 19 (not 16) years. Next year I don't think I'll have time to post if Tizzz is at all accurate! 

[ducatiz]

So.....you were a sexual deviant?

well, to be honest, i was before being veg, but i thru that in just to see if ppl were payin' attention...

[ducpainter]

1/2 of 1 cow.

Everyone knows meat grows in those styrofoam trays covered in plastic wrap.

[ducatiz]

I really don't think I need to throw down a 16oz NY Strip every sunday night.

that's way too much

i would hate to be paying your toilet paper bills.

[Holden]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20090421/hl_nm/us_cancer_pancreatic_meat_1 for what it's worth (didn't deserve its own thread).

[Sinister]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20090421/hl_nm/us_cancer_pancreatic_meat_1 for what it's worth (didn't deserve its own thread).

All that study supports is what I've been saying for years:  steak is better rare. 

I love how meat is the devil, in so many of these "studies."

[Holden]

All that study supports is what I've been saying for years:  steak is better rare. 

I love how meat is the devil, in so many of these "studies."

Maybe so (and I definitely agree that steak is better rare). Notwithstanding, it says "those with the highest intake of very well-done meat had a 70 percent higher risk for pancreatic cancer over those with the lowest consumption." That doesn't imply that the people with the 70 percent lower risk ate just as much rarer meat to make up for it...