Another rear shock question

[caperix]

Ok I hope I'm not beating a dead horse on this one, but I have been seaching for a few days & have not found an answer yet.  I am looking to upgrade the suspension & little bit on my '04 620.  I don't track it & it is my "comfortable bike" so I am leaning away from getting on ohlins unit for it.  I have been looking at used shocks from other ducati modles to get a little more adjustability out of it & give me a good excuse to get a better spring out back.
A friend of mine has a Showa rear off a ST series, an ST3 I think.  I don't see any reason why this shock would not work on a monster, but I would like some opinions before I pull the trigger.  I have read that the ST front forks are sprung far too stiff for a monster, I am guessing the same will be true for the rear?  Does any one have any experiance with an ST shock, am I better off just searching for a 999 showa?

[junior varsity]

Ok, some suspension basics:

Springs - These are replaceable on all shocks and forks. They should be replaced to suit your weight - check out the RaceTech website.

Forks and Shocks have valving - this controls the pogo-stick effect of the springs (which compress and elongate to absorb bumps and keep the tires on the road). A Showa rear shock has better valving than  Boge-Sachs rear shock, but in its factory delivered form, its still not all that great. Like the springs, forks and shocks can be revalved.

For what you say you'd like to do with your bike, you might consider a basic fork and shock revalve and respring.

Your bike likely has very little adjustability in the suspension, but one thing that needs to be done is the preload. You should have a friend help you set the sag so your suspension is in the area where it can do its job.

I'm not certain whether you'll be able to directly swap a shock in and it will work, I am not sure whether it will fit. For your forks, you'd need to know the diameter of the forks you like and your triples' diameters. (just measure your existing forks). For forks, there are companies that make a replacement "cartridge" for your forks, you plop it in and it replaces all the internals.

Price-wise and bang for your buck, your best bet is to call a suspension shop and inquire about various packages. The guys at Traxxion Dynamics in Atlanta are wonderful for this. They have various levels of upgrades to the suspension and can ask you about your wants and needs and give great advice. I've used them before and hope to again soon. I've got a Penske 8987 rear shock, and it really improved the ride of my bike more than I could have imagined. It is about the same price as the Ohlins, and that may beyond the amount you are looking to invest. There are many other options that are less expensive, and will satisfy your requirements in adjustability.

But yeah, springs. respring front and back for your weight, even if you rob a shock off another bike. If its not sprung right, then its not going to help you all that much.

[He Man]

+1 to the last of that statement, nothing will work right if atleast the spring is correct for your weight and you have a matching valve. HOWEVER at the costs of doing a revalve and springing of your stock components you might as well just buy an aftermarket and throw that one on, some places will put the right spring on it for you free of charge.

as to a swap.....i have my S2R1000 jacked up right now ready to install a 999Showa. Its a physicaly bolt on, just need to relocate the rear ignition coils and remove the breather box.

I dont know how close the 620 is to the 695, but i have an 1098 Showa that im selling on the parts for sale section. If the 620 is anything like the 695 shock, it should fit. Physically the shock itself is about 3/4 inch shorter,but im pretty sure you can jack up the ride height bar to compensate for it. With the way its shaped it doesnt look like you would need to move anything, maybe the breatherbox.

[caperix]

I have checked with Race Tech & Traxxion on revalving.  They both do not list any revalve kits for the front forks or the Sachs rear shock, only the Showa's.  There is a drop in cartridge option for the front the the price is a little higher than I was looking to spend on this bike.  The factory settings only allow for rear compression & preload adjustment, I have turned both of those up.
He Man please post you riding impressions after installing the 999 shock & what spring rate you went with.  The shorter length of the 1098 shock makes me a litte nervous as I have already raised the bike about 1/2", forks level with tripple adjustable rear link.  I don't know how much thread there is in the rear link.
I did pass on the ST shock.  The body is not threaded so it has no preload adjustment.

[He Man]

i wont be riding for a bit, but ill let you know in two weeks, i kept it at a stock rate ( im only 140+20lbs in full leathers+bootsglvoes etc)

[Old_and_slow]

The stock Sachs shock has adjustable rebound, not compression.  Some of the higher-end DSS bikes have a Sachs shock with a piggyback reservoir and both adj rebound and compression.  It's a drop-in replacement.

[Goat_Herder]

i wont be riding for a bit, but ill let you know in two weeks, i kept it at a stock rate ( im only 140+20lbs in full leathers+bootsglvoes etc)

Hi He Man.  Just wondering if you have any update on the swap.

[He Man]

yea. tis awesome. I went with a slightly stiffer spring than you would go for street (my forks are also a bit stiffer than idea for street).

The stock 999 geometry allows the rear spring to be very soft (the forks are much too stiff for monsters unless you weigh enough to warrant it). Case in point, if you use a rear spring for a stock 999 (which IMHO is fine for someone who is 150ish) it wouldnt even hold the monster's own weight up. THe second i sat on the bike, i was able to flat foot my bike with my knees bent (where as im normally tippy toeing it).

I swapped to an Ohlins rear spring ( i cant remmeber which model, but if you want to i can read it off the spring and PM you) and the rear is great. Though honestly, you really cant tell the difference unless you get down and dirty in the corners. It is a lot smoother. I havent brought it to a shop to have it setup yet, but i can only inmagine it would be much better when i do.

The install was a breeze. Once you fab a plate to move your coil and regulator, you cut the tab for the original coil mount and you re-route the crank case breather hose however you please (I just connected the two tubes together) and just drop and go.


Got bored and made a video of it. 
999 Showa + ohlins spring + S2R1000 = Affordable suspension upgrade!

[cduarte]

Go for the ST3 shock, it will work well. I have a 3-way adjustable showa shock from an ST2 on my 695 monster and am very happy with the improvement in handling. I also put forks from an S4 on it, which was also a huge improvement and a direct bolt-on. Just so you know, the forks from the ST series bolt right on to monsters and are a huge improvement over the junk marzocchis which come on the 620/695/S2R800 models. I also happen to have a set of brand new ST2 forks that I'm not using if you're interested...  

btw, for the ST2 shock, which has a remote reservoir, I mounted it to the rear frame rail below the grab handle. Here's a pic.

ETA: I had to make no modifications at all to mount the ST2 shock other than the remote reservoir, it was a bolt on and go. I am on the heavy side at the moment (250ish) and the stock springing on this shock is perfect for me.

[Goat_Herder]

Thanks He Man and cduarte.  It's people like you who have made this forum awesome!

[rule62]

I've got an '04 620 and I put a 749 shock on it.  All I had to do was find a new place for the oil breather catch box and ignition coil.  I added about an inch of ride height using an adjustable dog-bone from a 999.  Dialed in the pre-load to 30mm of sag, set the compression and rebound damping, and away I rode.  I'm about 180 lbs and while I admit it's not an ideal set-up, it's way better than stock, and worth all of the $65 investment.  For the forks, I just made spacers to fit between the springs and the retainer clips to give me 30mm of sag.  It was closer to 50mm before.  I made the spacers out of aluminum, but many people have used PVC piping of the right diameter.  Changed my fork oil to adjust the rebound and compression without revalving.  Great improvement and also worth the $0 in aluminum I found to do the trick.

[He Man]

i would really put the right spring for that 749 shock. if you are running the stock spring, it is way to plush and youll see a huge difference with the proper spring.

[caperix]

I ended up running a 1098 rear shock, I had to remove the fender and raise the rear ride height to get it to fit without hitting the tire.  It with the raised ride height really changed the way the bike rode, now I just need to get to work installing the 998 forks I have sitting in my garage.

[erichan8757]

i would really put the right spring for that 749 shock. if you are running the stock spring, it is way to plush and youll see a huge difference with the proper spring.

I will have to agree with him.

IT MAKE A HUGE DIFFERENCE

but again it is also because my bike has really crapy rear suspension.
e.