Plastic Tank problems: Discussion thread, see info thread sticky for updates

[BoDiddley]

It seems DNA is making it tough for the dealers to replace our tanks.  I emailed my dealer to see if I could get the old tank back for the hell of it and this is his reply.

>> Unfortunately Ducati had changed the procedure for goodwill tank warranties. We used to have to sit on the defective part for 90 days, then make the part unusable before disposal. Starting with your tank, Ducati has made the process kind difficult. In order for us to receive credit, the defective tanks are sent back to California. Once they under go a complete inspection, we then can receive our credit. We have upwards of about $15,000.00 hanging in the wind over this issue. For the month of June, I'm not submitting requests for tank replacements. <<

I would think they cannot keep replacing tanks indefinitely so if you are working on it you had better double time. If a dealer says he can't help you, I would try another even if the distance is rediculious it would still be worth a new tank
and maybe a road trip.

[ducmon695]

I am in the process of having my tank replaced as well.  I have an 07 695.  I took it to my local dealer and they took pictures of it, and said they will probably replace it because it is a safety issue because I am not able to latch the tank. 

But I am thinking, why don't we all go on Ducati's facebook page and start asking questions, or posting complaints.  We setup a day and everyone put on the Facebook page that we have had our tank replaced, and we want a permanent solution?  Flood the page.

Or is there anyway that we can right a formal letter to Ducati and all of us that have had a tank replaced put our name on it? 

Has there been an update to the lawsuit, besides Ducati pushing back?  Is there a place I can go and get updates to what is going on?

It is just something to consider.

I too love my bike, I love Ducati, I tell anyone I can to go out and buy one.  I am involved in my local club and try to organize events for fellow Ducati riders to get together and enjoy there passion.  But not, I don't tell anyone to go buy one, I feel this is a big issue that needs to be resolved, not just pushed away.
It is just sad that the passion for this brand by owners, builders, employees of this brand to be over shadowed by corporate lawyers.

[ducatiz]

I am fairly new to the Ducati family but have done a fair amount of research on the tank issue a spoken with mechanics familiar with the issue. 

It's a bigger issue than DNA from what I have been told so I'm not sure posting messages on Facebook will help the situation much.  From what I understand Ducati didn't want to put nylon tanks on bikes to only replace them free of charge every 2 years or so.  One tank MSRP's for about 1500.00, no company no matter how poor/wealthy wants to go around replacing tanks free of charge as well as running the risk of creating a community of unhappy customers.  The real issue as I have come to understand is with the Department of Transportation.  DOT mandated nylon tanks despite the tanks everywhere else being made of polyethylene. 

I could totally be wrong but thats what I hear is the root cause. 

This is false.  DOT does not mandate any sort of material for fuel tanks.  It (thru NHTSA) mandates safety minimums and EPA mandates emissions maximums.  A tank can be made of any material that passes those tests (NHTSA crash and EPA SHED tests).

The MSRP of the tank is irrelevant.  In quantity, rotomolding a tank like these runs about 50-100$ per tank plus the cost of finishing them (paint,decals) which (again, in quantity) runs under $100-200 each.

More likely, the cost of these tanks is being absorbed by Acerbis in whole or part.   The main issue they are worried about is the unhappy customer issue and despite many opinions on the matter, it does not mean that EACH and EVERY person needs to be happy.  It really means that if they had 30,000 happy customers yesterday, they want >30,000 happy customers tomorrow.  It doesn't matter if they are all different customers. 

That being said, in my conversations with the DNA folks I felt they were sincerely concerned about the issue both form a customer standpoint and from a materials standpoint. 

However, everyone needs to remember that Ducati is a company with only about 1100 people worldwide.  At the end of the day, making a custom run of metal tanks just for the bikes affected would likely bankrupt the company.

That being said, I believe they will eventually have a solution.  I don't know what it will be.  It's possible they are trying to burn up the stock of old (bad material) tanks and will roll out good material tanks later.

Thus far, there are NO tanks with new materials on the road.  Dealers who claim there is a "new formulation" are misinformed.  The proof of this is to look under the tank and find the "recycle" triangle logo.  If it has the same letters, the tank is still PA6 nylon.   Secondly, check the production date of the tank.

[WetDuc]

It's been a little while since I've checked in on this thread.
Good to hear there's at least some speculation DNA might fix this eventually.

[rockaduc]

Are you local to nymmc? just wondering which dealer you are going through to get your new tank. My problem is not so much cosemtic, yes its slightly blown out, but more importantly i cannot unlatch my tank.

I go to Trebour in ledgewood, nj. Good people

[stopintime]

There is some movement towards E10 in Europe - nobody knows if or when.

If that happens, the Euro ducatisti, especially the Italians, will without hesitation burn down the Bologna headquarters if they experience the same problems without Ducati fixing it PRONTO.

Don't know if it will help you US guys, but I'm sure that Ducati doesn't want their home continent on their backs as well.

[Mike_D]

I took my bike into the local dealer over the weekend and told the owner that I was beginning to see expansion problems.  As I mentioned earlier, it's not bad yet, just a couple of pimples and it's pushing the right tank rest off the frame.  He immediately took pictures and submitted the claim.  I even asked him if we should wait until the problem becomes more pronounced and he said no, we'll just send it in.  If all goes well, I should have my tank in about a month.  I'm a little worried though that DNA will refuse to replace it because it doesn't meet some severity threshold.  If a new tank does come in, I'll likely hold off on installing it until my original tank shows more severe signs of expansion.

[BoDiddley]

I took my bike into the local dealer over the weekend and told the owner that I was beginning to see expansion problems.  As I mentioned earlier, it's not bad yet, just a couple of pimples and it's pushing the right tank rest off the frame.  He immediately took pictures and submitted the claim.  I even asked him if we should wait until the problem becomes more pronounced and he said no, we'll just send it in.  If all goes well, I should have my tank in about a month.  I'm a little worried though that DNA will refuse to replace it because it doesn't meet some severity threshold.  If a new tank does come in, I'll likely hold off on installing it until my original tank shows more severe signs of expansion.

They are going to take your tank so I don't think you be able to hold off on it.....................

[Dave328]

This is false.  DOT does not mandate any sort of material for fuel tanks.  It (thru NHTSA) mandates safety minimums and EPA mandates emissions maximums.  A tank can be made of any material that passes those tests (NHTSA crash and EPA SHED tests).

The MSRP of the tank is irrelevant.  In quantity, rotomolding a tank like these runs about 50-100$ per tank plus the cost of finishing them (paint,decals) which (again, in quantity) runs under $100-200 each.

More likely, the cost of these tanks is being absorbed by Acerbis in whole or part.   The main issue they are worried about is the unhappy customer issue and despite many opinions on the matter, it does not mean that EACH and EVERY person needs to be happy.  It really means that if they had 30,000 happy customers yesterday, they want >30,000 happy customers tomorrow.  It doesn't matter if they are all different customers. 

That being said, in my conversations with the DNA folks I felt they were sincerely concerned about the issue both form a customer standpoint and from a materials standpoint. 

However, everyone needs to remember that Ducati is a company with only about 1100 people worldwide.  At the end of the day, making a custom run of metal tanks just for the bikes affected would likely bankrupt the company.

That being said, I believe they will eventually have a solution.  I don't know what it will be.  It's possible they are trying to burn up the stock of old (bad material) tanks and will roll out good material tanks later.

Thus far, there are NO tanks with new materials on the road.  Dealers who claim there is a "new formulation" are misinformed.  The proof of this is to look under the tank and find the "recycle" triangle logo.  If it has the same letters, the tank is still PA6 nylon.   Secondly, check the production date of the tank.

So what are your thoughts on DNA's apparent sudden resistence to no-question-asked replacement? I would think Acerbis still has the molds, so a new material would just need to be settled on for a completely new run of tanks. I just can't seem to grasp DNA's seemingly carefree attitude. That may not be their actual feeling but it's the perception that THEY are putting out there with their actions.

[muskrat]

I like the idea of hitting them on facebook at one time 
My old S2R is now on her third tank.  They want publicity?  Lets give it to them. 

[Howie]

This is false.  DOT does not mandate any sort of material for fuel tanks.  It (thru NHTSA) mandates safety minimums and EPA mandates emissions maximums.  A tank can be made of any material that passes those tests (NHTSA crash and EPA SHED tests).

The MSRP of the tank is irrelevant.  In quantity, rotomolding a tank like these runs about 50-100$ per tank plus the cost of finishing them (paint,decals) which (again, in quantity) runs under $100-200 each.

More likely, the cost of these tanks is being absorbed by Acerbis in whole or part.   The main issue they are worried about is the unhappy customer issue and despite many opinions on the matter, it does not mean that EACH and EVERY person needs to be happy.  It really means that if they had 30,000 happy customers yesterday, they want >30,000 happy customers tomorrow.  It doesn't matter if they are all different customers. 

That being said, in my conversations with the DNA folks I felt they were sincerely concerned about the issue both form a customer standpoint and from a materials standpoint. 

However, everyone needs to remember that Ducati is a company with only about 1100 people worldwide.  At the end of the day, making a custom run of metal tanks just for the bikes affected would likely bankrupt the company.

That being said, I believe they will eventually have a solution.  I don't know what it will be.  It's possible they are trying to burn up the stock of old (bad material) tanks and will roll out good material tanks later.

Thus far, there are NO tanks with new materials on the road.  Dealers who claim there is a "new formulation" are misinformed.  The proof of this is to look under the tank and find the "recycle" triangle logo.  If it has the same letters, the tank is still PA6 nylon.   Secondly, check the production date of the tank.

During your discussions with Ducati has the idea of Caswell or similar coating of the tank at the factory level come up? 

[ducatiz]

During your discussions with Ducati has the idea of Caswell or similar coating of the tank at the factory level come up? 

Yes, that is the preferred solution.  Caswell worked but did not meet homologation requirements, I wasn't given specifics.  It is possible another coating would meet specifications, but I don't have any information on that now. 

Coating is preferred for a lot of reasons, which I am sure you can list. 

So what are your thoughts on DNA's apparent sudden resistence to no-question-asked replacement? I would think Acerbis still has the molds, so a new material would just need to be settled on for a completely new run of tanks. I just can't seem to grasp DNA's seemingly carefree attitude. That may not be their actual feeling but it's the perception that THEY are putting out there with their actions.

I haven't heard of a nation-wide change.  My feeling is that this is the dealers getting tired of doing the work.  Ducati repays them for the labor and dealers who have done a LOT of them have claimed to get paid slowly. 

If DNA has indeed slowed the process it might be due to the increased number of claims (which means the pipeline is clogged) or perhaps an interest in more scrutiny on the tanks trying to prevent fraud.   Either way, it's a legitimate concern on their part.

Take anything a dealer tells you with a grain of salt.  If one dealer says they are slowing down things, but 10 other dealers report no change.....  Ever since this saga began, I have been collecting snippets of comments from dealers and I've forwarded some to DNA.  Did you hear the one about the dealer that required owners to make a deposit for the tank in case the replacement wasn't approved and then made the owner leave the bike at the shop until the tank came in?  Yep.  It happened.

[GLantern]

I just found my 08 1098 has an expanding tank and it is really bad, it is pressing against the mount for the steering damper.  The bike is out of warranty but should still be able to get a replacement tank correct?  Just want to clarify as I am going to call my dealer today.  Here are some pics the gap should be a LOT larger than that.

[ducatiz]

Go ahead and make the claim.  There is no reason they'll deny it at this point.  If it was my bike, I'd wait to see if it leaks as well.  The plaintiff in the lawsuit has a 1098.

[Heath]

When I had my tank changed out I believe the dealer said the tank issue has to do with emissions.  Went on to say the warranty on emissions is longer then the normal warranty.

Not sure if that is true or not but I got my tank replaced.