2010 Silly Season

[gm2]

i was a bit surprised that broc parkes didn't do more on the kawi.  but apparently you can't even put a qualy tire on that bike or it ruins the entire set up.  there's a bike that needs some revision...

[tufty]

***Important; this IS NOT a side swipe at Ben Spies.***

JT is being treated harshly both in MotoGP and here. In MotoGP he is at the very least a solid mid-pack rider, in WSBK he is a two time world champion (once against Bayliss and Haga, hardly second rate riders).

Other MotoGP riders have had much longer mid-pack careers and been treated in a kinder fashion, so what gives? I'm shocked that Carmelo didn't seem to do more to find a ride for him (or any other Brit), and instead allowed another American rider who's only current claim to fame is winning AMA Superbike championships. MotoGP is dying for markets and viewership and in one fell stroke they have disenfranchised one of their largest remaining markets, non too bright I think.

If Spies doesn't win WSBK and goes on to have a mid-pack career in MotoGP, (which I'm sure he will while on a Tech3) then he will have made a huge career mistake imo. I for one am thrilled that they are doing away with 250 2 strokes, at the very least it will slacken the domination of the GP classes by Italians and Spaniards.

I know this is an American dominated board and yes as a Brit obviously I'm disappointed that there won't be a Brit in MotoGP next year, but come on guys!

[desmoquattro]

***Important; this IS NOT a side swipe at Ben Spies.***

JT is being treated harshly both in MotoGP and here. In MotoGP he is at the very least a solid mid-pack rider, in WSBK he is a two time world champion (once against Bayliss and Haga, hardly second rate riders).
...

Dunno...I think people here treat everyone *but* Valentino Rossi harshly at times

[derby]

***Important; this IS NOT a side swipe at Ben Spies.***

did you type this before or after composing your post? 

JT is being treated harshly both in MotoGP and here. In MotoGP he is at the very least a solid mid-pack rider, in WSBK he is a two time world champion (once against Bayliss and Haga, hardly second rate riders).

Other MotoGP riders have had much longer mid-pack careers and been treated in a kinder fashion, so what gives? I'm shocked that Carmelo didn't seem to do more to find a ride for him (or any other Brit), and instead allowed another American rider who's only current claim to fame is winning AMA Superbike championships. MotoGP is dying for markets and viewership and in one fell stroke they have disenfranchised one of their largest remaining markets, non too bright I think.

i think that james didn't do himself any favors when the only reason he was sure that he wasn't leaving gp was because there's no way dorna was going to allow the only brit to leave.

If Spies doesn't win WSBK and goes on to have a mid-pack career in MotoGP, (which I'm sure he will while on a Tech3) then he will have made a huge career mistake imo. I for one am thrilled that they are doing away with 250 2 strokes, at the very least it will slacken the domination of the GP classes by Italians and Spaniards.

depends on how you define "mid pack..." colin doesn't seem to have a problem beating some (most) other factory efforts on a second tier yamaha.

i personally think ben will finish the 2010 championship higher than colin.

I know this is an American dominated board and yes as a Brit obviously I'm disappointed that there won't be a Brit in MotoGP next year, but come on guys!

i totally understand your point... i'm somewhat surprised that it's going to be a brit-less championship. i'm pretty sure that james had a choice of either taking a factory yamaha seat in worldsbk or trying to find a non-yamaha (likely non-factory) seat in motogp.

[EvilSteve]

JT is being treated harshly both in MotoGP and here. In MotoGP he is at the very least a solid mid-pack rider, in WSBK he is a two time world champion (once against Bayliss and Haga, hardly second rate riders).

His first championship was crap, his second was definitely good on an un-developed bike.

Other MotoGP riders have had much longer mid-pack careers and been treated in a kinder fashion, so what gives? I'm shocked that Carmelo didn't seem to do more to find a ride for him (or any other Brit), and instead allowed another American rider who's only current claim to fame is winning AMA Superbike championships. MotoGP is dying for markets and viewership and in one fell stroke they have disenfranchised one of their largest remaining markets, non too bright I think.

Spies has done more than "just win the AMA championship". I know you're not having a go at Spies but that's *vastly* understating his achievements so far this season. Best rookie in the history of WSBK and will either win the championship or push Haga until the last race. I personally want Haga to win but that's just an opinion. He hasn't seen most of these tracks before, had never raced the bike & it was a new bike. JT is a very good rider but his effort in WSBK didn't even approach that. JT had 16 wins *total* in WSBK over the period of 7 years. Spies has 13 wins in 1 year.

If Spies doesn't win WSBK and goes on to have a mid-pack career in MotoGP, (which I'm sure he will while on a Tech3) then he will have made a huge career mistake imo. I for one am thrilled that they are doing away with 250 2 strokes, at the very least it will slacken the domination of the GP classes by Italians and Spaniards.

Colin Edwards has done really well on a bike that's approaching factory spec & is still very close to getting 5th in the championship behind the "aliens" and Dovi. How is that bad? Spies should allow one year (lap? ) to learn the tracks on the near factory spec Yamaha & then he will have options. JT initially did well but really hasn't been making any progress compared to his team mate which is a very important distinction. Tech 3 already have an experienced rider & it makes sense to pick someone up with potential. Unfortunately for JT, he's in this position when there's a glut of riders out there.

I know this is an American dominated board and yes as a Brit obviously I'm disappointed that there won't be a Brit in MotoGP next year, but come on guys!

I'm Australian, so I'm apparently going to pregnant dog about anything I can think of. Personally I think JT gets over hyped. He's an overly aggressive rider (or was in WSBK) to the point of bumping people out of the way. Some people love that, I don't. I don't think that any one deserves to be in any racing unless they're good enough to compete, irrespective of their nationality. I don't care if there aren't any Brits in MGP & to be honest, if there weren't any Australians because they weren't good enough then so be it. I'm also American truth be told so I'd love to see Spies do well in GP but I'm not going to hold my breath.

As for the comment about 2 strokes breaking the domination by Italians & Spaniards - MotoGP has the best risers in the world. The lower classes prepare these riders better for GP than SBK racing you seem to have the causality ass about. Having riders with less experience riding in the manner required and therefore allowing other nationalities in doesn't exactly sound great to me. I hope that Moto2 will foster the same riding style that will allow GP to have the greatest riders in the world and *NOT* so that we can lower the bar to let people in because we "need" representation from particular countries. Of course I mean *any* country, including my own.

Go look up Bradley Smith btw: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bradley_Smith_(motorcyclist)

[gm2]

***Important; this IS NOT a side swipe at Ben Spies.***

JT is being treated harshly both in MotoGP and here. In MotoGP he is at the very least a solid mid-pack rider

so is chris vermeulen. 

instead allowed another American rider who's only current claim to fame is winning AMA Superbike championships.

even if he completely duffs up portimao and finishes second in the wsbk championship, this whole year is unquestionably a claim to fame.

i mean... seriously.  come on.  he blitzed the entire series from day one.

If Spies doesn't win WSBK and goes on to have a mid-pack career in MotoGP, (which I'm sure he will while on a Tech3) then he will have made a huge career mistake imo.

i don't see how taking the chance to go to GP if you get it can ever be a mistake.  this is exactly what JT just did.  if you're serious about being a racer and you get the chance, you take it.

I know this is an American dominated board and yes as a Brit obviously I'm disappointed that there won't be a Brit in MotoGP next year, but come on guys!

i agree, it's disappointing.  but your whole post seems to suggest that ben somehow 'stole' JT's seat.  that, uh, aint what happened.  this isn't a popularity contest and no one is 'treating' james any which way.  he didn't get the job done.

[Jester]

Don't forget that JT shot himself in the foot this season by the garage swap drama.  He *had* to do better than Colin or risk losing his seat imo.  I think JT took a few steps back this year and with Spies sitting in the wings, there is no way he was keeping his seat with Tech3 after his performance.

[fastwin]

Good post Jester, my feelings exactly. JT is a good rider and he'll do well in his return to WSBK... I hope. I hear that there's some guy named Bayliss who went back to WSBK and even won some championships. Didn't seem to do him any harm. JT certainly didn't get on anyone's Christmas card list pulling the smoke and mirrors crew chief swap last year. Surprised Edwards didn't sucker punch him over that one. But it didn't help him on the track one iota and all it did was put up a curtain in the Tech 3 garage. Probably motivated Edwards to beat him in every round. I can easily see Yammyhammer putting the squeeze on JT to do the swap with Spies. If you are going to be "demoted" for not performing in MotoGP going to the Yamaha factory WSBK team with a great crew and bike isn't so bad. A whole lot worse things can happen to a rider.

[tufty]

I'm kinda sorry I mentioned Spies honestly since that's what folks are latching onto.

I'm not suggesting or even implying that Spies stole JT's seat (those are your words). My point about Spies was if he doesn't win WSBK, then history isn't going to remember the stellar year he's had. Only that he went to GP having only won AMA superbike. I'm also not denying his talent... on a superbike, but, as we are seeing the most successful 800cc GP riders come up from 250's or 125's where corner speed is king. Everyone, but everyone says that switching to 800's changed the whole game, forcing riders to go back to their 250 days for riding pointers. I'm of the opinion that superbike riders who came up through supersport then superbike are going to struggle in GP until they finally go back to 990's. I don't want to see a talent like Spies reduced to a grid filler. Let's face it, Hayden, Edwards and JT were/are awesome superbike pilots but struggle to get the 800's to run up front.

Back to my main point, and that is seeing as there are 4 Brits in the top 10 of world superbike and 1 in the top 5 of world supersport that there aren't any, or even the prospect of any in GP's?

And for my Aussie buddy, yes thanks I know who Bradley Smith is.

[zooom]

1st, I want to break the JT bashing ice with this nice lil tidbit about another in WSBK paddock for next year...

http://hellforleathermagazine.com/2009/10/ktm-quits-gp-racing.html#more

now...to the point of 250's cultivating GP racers over the past, I agree now moreso with the idea of that being a working formula with GP's being the current format of 800cc's. With the Moto2 bikes being more or less supposedly Supersport machines with free range of chassis, the whole dynamic of those riders is going to change, and with the fodder having settled into the quiet for now, GP is next. Whether it be 2011 or later, the distinct feeling still looms that either bigger bore will return with a stripping of electronic aids, or a spec motor and computer set-up is on the horizon, which will usher in a more loose and freestyle show of riders that the SBK riders are much more akin to. I think nationality will have nothing to do with it as this is a world sport that is being driven by the world media machine, not by a national or regional aspect only. Fans will still be fans if "the Show" is something exciting to watch.

[Jester]

As far as I can tell, the Brit crowd sucks Rossi's knob like a homegrown hero anyway, so what's the problem?  Its not like you guys don't have anyone to root for.

[derby]

what about Esparago?

espargaro to pramac ducati:

http://www.crash.net/motogp/news/153260/1/espargaro_set_for_2010_pramac_motogp_ride.html

[derby]

this seems to be getting some more traction...

camier and byrne to an additional aprilia worlsbk team:

http://www.visordown.com/motorcycle-racing-news-wsb/scoop-camier-to-partner-byrne-in-second-aprilia-team/8351.html

[EvilSteve]

As far as I can tell, the Brit crowd sucks Rossi's knob like a homegrown hero anyway, so what's the problem?  Its not like you guys don't have anyone to root for.

Look in the mirror mate, just about everyone sucks Rossi's knob.

I'm not happy about the whole Moto2 thing, Honda 600cc supersport motors in random chassis. What I do like about Moto2 is that there seems to be broad support & interest in the series which will hopefully get more people involved & make for interesting racing. I think it's important to note that it has actually been proven that people from a 250 background seem to ride the 800 GP bikes better so how will this affect the GP in terms of Moto2 being a feeder? Of course I may have it backwards too, possibly the best riders are actually from a 250 background so they made the GP bikes the way they are to accommodate those riders?

Tufty - I think that part of the reason that there aren't a lot of Brits in GP is that WSBK & road bikes are more popular? I don't know England or English riders but it just seems that there really hasn't been many Brits coming up through 125s & 250s anyway suggesting that the preference is to go through WSS/WSBK to get to a world championship. It's not as though there are a lot of Aussies either probably for similar reasons (plus the distance factor). Bradley Smith has been doing pretty well actually - very cool.  

this seems to be getting some more traction...

camier and byrne to an additional aprilia worlsbk team:

Byrne deserves a seat, he's been riding like a champ.

[tufty]

Look in the mirror mate, just about everyone sucks Rossi's knob.

I'm not happy about the whole Moto2 thing, Honda 600cc supersport motors in random chassis. What I do like about Moto2 is that there seems to be broad support & interest in the series which will hopefully get more people involved & make for interesting racing. I think it's important to note that it has actually been proven that people from a 250 background seem to ride the 800 GP bikes better so how will this affect the GP in terms of Moto2 being a feeder? Of course I may have it backwards too, possibly the best riders are actually from a 250 background so they made the GP bikes the way they are to accommodate those riders?

Tufty - I think that part of the reason that there aren't a lot of Brits in GP is that WSBK & road bikes are more popular? I don't know England or English riders but it just seems that there really hasn't been many Brits coming up through 125s & 250s anyway suggesting that the preference is to go through WSS/WSBK to get to a world championship. It's not as though there are a lot of Aussies either probably for similar reasons (plus the distance factor). Bradley Smith has been doing pretty well actually - very cool.  
Byrne deserves a seat, he's been riding like a champ.

I totally agree (weird! ), which is why I'm pumped about Moto2 I think it will open up GP to more world talent and not just leave it to Italian and Spanish kids on 125 2 strokes that don't even sell anywhere else in the world. Like I said, I believe the writing is on the wall for 800 GP bikes in their current configuration. The races are a real snooze-fest mostly, either yank the traction control, go back to 990's or preferably both.

I agree about Byrne too (yeah I know, I must be sick or something ), he is a way better rider than his results this year indicate. It doesn't help that he is riding the slowest 1198 ever made.