Power Commander Autotune? ? opinions

[causeofkaos]

The power commander V has a neat little box you can also purchase that is supposed to be able to create a map for your bike without a Dyno?
With technology thats available in the world i think its possible. I am curious what everyones take on this is. Would you trust it to do what it claims? More importantly would you put it on your M1100.

this is taken from Power Commanders web site

"We have taken virtually the same technology that our patented Tuning Link dynamometer software (for automated Dyno tuning) uses, along with Bosch Wide Band O2 sensors and miniaturized it to be used on your bike, ATV, or UTV, while you ride. Once installed, the Auto Tune kit monitors the fuel mixture (by installing the included Wide Band O2 sensor in the exhaust). It then sends this information to the Power Commander V and automatically corrects it while you ride. Each map that we offer has preset Air/Fuel ratio values included that we find to be the best overall settings. This lets you simply plug in the unit and let it do the work. For Harley Davidson models we even monitor and adjust each cylinder individually for increased precision as on these models required fueling can vary significantly between the front and rear cylinder. For advanced users that would like to change the Air/Fuel ratios from our baseline they are fully adjustable. Each throttle opening/rpm combination is individually adjustable, so that you can have both fuel economy, during cruise, while maintaining peak output at larger throttle openings. For most models of bikes it is also possible to adjust the Air/Fuel ratios "per gear". This gives you total control of the fueling in every gear and throttle/rpm area if required. "

http://www.powercommander.com/powercommander/Products/AutoTune/powercommander_autotune.aspx

i did a search and found nothing if derby im sorry.

[Raux]

 basically it puts the O2 sensors BACK into the system that the PC takes out but it works on a map that is all about power and not meeting emissions.

the PC V works on increasing or decreasing the fuel amounts... so you have to have a dyno to really tell if you are accomplishing what you think you are. with the Autotune you are telling the system the end result you want in air/fuel ratio and it adjusts the PC V accordingly.

the maps seem pretty simple and a bit confusing for me. I thought the best AFR is 14:1 but the Autotune maps i saw ranged from 13:1-13.7:1 at various points on the map. just wondering why they aren't just 14:1 across the board?

[causeofkaos]

My hold up for getting the boomtubes is you need a PC V ( for the m1100 ) or similair such device, this auto tune could it really be able to create a map after you swap exhaust systems? without a dyno? i feel like Scully from X-files "i want to believe"

[Raux]

My hold up for getting the boomtubes is you need a PC V ( for the m1100 ) or similair such device, this auto tune could it really be able to create a map after you swap exhaust systems? without a dyno? i feel like Scully from X-files "i want to believe"

no the autotune works with the PCV not independent of it.

you could use the TwoBrothers Juice box.

but who said you need the PC V for just exhausts? you should only need a system if you change the air filter giving you more air INTO the system making the bike run leaners. you should read the closed loop thread that is pinned in accessories.

[causeofkaos]

no the autotune works with the PCV not independent of it.

i understand the PC V works with AutoTune just cant beleive it does what it claims = swap pippes and "auto tune"



but who said you need the PC V for just exhausts? you should only need a system if you change the air filter giving you more air INTO the system making the bike run leaners. you should read the closed loop thread that is pinned in accessories.

the boomtubes are gonna lean the bike out and i dont want to risk burning a piston.
( not proud of my throttle abuse issues... dont judge me )

m1100 is not closed loop from what i gathered, and im one of those if it doesnt affect me i might not learn about it kinda guys.

[Raux]

as far as i've learned so far, swapping pipes does not lean out mixture. you can only lean the mixture by adding air into the mix or taking fuel from the mix.

so a straight pipe swap won't need a fueling computer. BUT swapping pipes does change torque curves from what i've read. so a fueling computer to play with the mixtures to adjust the curve does work to an advantage.

again, this is mostly book wisdom here, there are plenty of guys who can tell you more from experience.

M1100 is a closed loop system if it has O2 sensors.

[causeofkaos]

i blame the guys at FatDuc i called about the M1100 they said its not a closed loop.
I sit here ever more confused.

[causeofkaos]

Correction on previous post
let me clarify the guys at fatduc actually said

the Siemens ECU uses the sensor feedback differently than the Marelli ECU used on the other models and therefore FatDuc will not work.

[DoWorkSon]

IS the PCV even available for the m1100/696 yet? I have yet to see if for sale on their website, and month ago it was delayed without an ETA....

I am running the two brothers juice box on my bike... You can adjust the amount of fuel thats added into the system during acceleration and at WOT as well as how soon this is done.... I noticed less low end rpm surging and more even power through the power band.

But, it is hard to tell what the results are without a dyno

[muskrat]

I run a PC 3 on my wife's S2R 800 and it runs like a top, although it was mapped properly.  On my Harley (some would say Hardley but who gives a shit) I have two custom maps on my PC 5 and absolutely love it.  If I could afford a nemesis I'd be all over that on my S4R so I might jump on the little guy for the Duc later but so far no problems running it on the Harley, it is after all a TWIN 

[chisel]

Changing pipes can lean a bike IF the new pipes alter the scavenger pulse. If the pressure gradient grows, it'll pull more air through the bike. This is one of the reasons why things like torque change with a pipe change.

[causeofkaos]

IS the PCV even available for the m1100/696 yet? I have yet to see if for sale on their website, and month ago it was delayed without an ETA....

i spoke to their tech support a week ago the chap said January 2010

[chisel]

Thanks for sharing that info, DoWork. I've been wondering about that. I even signed up for their email alert system since I got tired of checking their website.

[Drunken Monkey]

Actually, this makes perfect sense. Especially given how powerful the chips they stick in these things are now.

Basically all the dyno guys do with an older PC unit is run your bikes through the RPM range at different throttle openings, and then feed the 0² data to a piece of software that suggests changes. Then they run it through a few more times to fine tune it.

No reason you can't do the same process with similar software on the Power commander box, on the bike, in real time.

Or "Think of a closed loop ECU that instead of trying to make sure your bike passes emissions regs, no matter what, this one tries to make sure your bike makes max power, no matter what"

[caperix]

Auto tune software has been out in other applications for awhile now.  They can not replace a good dyno tune for max power but they can smooth out issues with the maps.  $250 isnt too bad of a price depending how well it works.  I still prefer the innovate motor sports wide band recorders for self tuning.