Car Shopping...

[Howie]

Generally my first step in buying a new car is, of course, deciding what to buy.  Then I go on the web to get an idea of out the door price availability, incentives, etc.  Now I am ready to go to the dealer.  Just like Ducati dealers, not all car dealers are the same.  At the dealer I will find out more than just price.  I want to see older as well as newer cars in the shop.  The shop should also be reasonably clean and organized.  The techs should seem reasonably happy.  No older cars?  Likely customers don't come back after the warranty is up.  If I can hang around the service writer's desk and waiting room with a little discretion and ease drop I will.  Then I may take a trip to a few other dealers. I will also see what people say about the dealers.  Of course, some dealer evaluation may happen when selecting the car.  Keep in mind, every dealer will have some unhappy customers.  Read between the lines.

Last winter we decided to buy a new car, an Audi A4 Avant Quatro.  The first dealer I went to was the most convenient.  Two trips there and both trips made me want to go home and take a shower.  A look at the internet and I was correct.  There were two other dealers that seemed to be decent.  I went to one, sat down with a gentleman who was truly a sales adviser, not a salesman.  We were able to find and test drive in stock, which was great because we would be able to own it before Jan 1 and get a tax break.  Did we get it for the price the internet claimed we could get it for?  No, but damn close and an extra electronic key was thrown in to sweeten the deal.  Think about it.  Is $50, or even $200 significant over the period you own the car?  Can a bad dealer cost you more than you save?  The dealer we didn't buy the car from was known for bad service that could cost you a fortune in lost service and mental health over a routine warranty repair or a basic service.

The dealer will try and make money somehow.  Good dealers make money by running an honest, competent business.  Bad dealers low ball and get the money in a less than ethical fashion.  What comes to mind is a Buick my dad bought from a discount mega dealer.  Being a teenager, the first thing I did was try the radio.  Why does it sound like shit?  I took a closer look.  It was a cheap clone of the Delco radio that should have been there.

Anyway, back to my dealer.  There is an available engine performance upgrade that bumps horsepower from 211 to 261HP and torque from 258 to 305 ft lbs.  Well, you know I just had to have that.  They accidentally overcharged me.  I didn't call them immediately to straighten the bill out.  Some time went on, so I figured I might as well wait for the credit card statement to come in so the numbers would bee in front of me.  I opened the statement and they already corrected the overcharge without even being called.

I'm a big believer in a good deal is getting what you paid for.  If you are getting more than you paid for you better figure out why before you make the plunge.  If milk is on sale at least check the date.  Even then realize it may be spoiled.

[Monstermash]

hey monstermash... got any used GTI's? 

 I wish we did but we only have one VeeDub in stock at the moment. It's an 07 Jetta Wolfsburg with 19K on the clock. I'm a huge VW fan and the new style GTI is really nice. I had the opportunity to drive a newer style R32 and all I can say is WOW! It has a great mixture of power, style, and sophistication. It also has awesome brakes. We were driving it on this back road doing about 45 MPH when I told my passenger to hold on. I mashed the brakes as hard as I could and the thing stopped faster than anything else I've ever driven. The only way to stop a car faster is to drive it into a tree! Lol.

 If you're considering a pre-owned VW I would suggest buying one from a VW dealer and have it VW assured (certified). If you're local to the New England area I can point you in the right direction and make sure you're treated right.

 Also, I don't know how experienced you are with a vehicle purchase but if you have any questions feel free to shoot me a pm and I'll try and help any way I can.

[J5]

Fortunately I won't have to. My dealership was recently voted National Pre-owned Dealer of the year. We do about 85% of our business through repeat customers and referrals. FYI-The national average is about 11%. It just amazes me that people go into a dealership with a chip on their shoulder and expect the dealer to be happy to deal with them. Why is it ok to treat the salesperson your dealing with like shit and expect to be treated like a king?

congrats your sealership is doing something right

 I have never taken the first deal I find. Thats not what you said. What you said was you told the dealer you weren't going to be buying until next year. So my question is what could you possibly gain from shopping now with the exception of feeling out the dealer which you also stated wouldn't matter because you would be buying it online. Next year the models will have changed and there's a very good possibility the sales person you spoke with won't be there anyway and the deal they offer won't be even close. If you're talking about new vehicles the programs change every month so what you may be offered now is not going to be the same when you come back 3 months from now.
 

models generally don’t change a huge amount
finding the right dealer is just as important as finding the right car
if the sales person I spoke to isn’t there  and they turn over that often then there is a reason for that and I prob wont deal with that dealership

ironically when I bought a VW the salesperson I dealt with the first time was no longer at that dealership but I had his number so bought a car from him where he was now

I have dealt with a lot of folks who have come in and stated they weren't buying for a while. Most of the time it's pure bullshit. They are just trying to lessen the pressure from the salesperson. They wrongly assume that telling him that they won't be in the market for a while will make him less inclined to try and make a deal. I have always treated those customers with respect but it's my job to try and get them to buy now while they are in the store. I find it very difficult to believe that you would visit a bunch of different dealerships to get a feeling for how you were going to be treated in 3-6 months from now. Why not just wait until you were ready to buy instead of wasting everyone's (including your) time? Please tell me whats the point of walking into a dealership if you're not interested in buying something. Do you walk into the supermarket and just browse? No, you go when you want to buy something.
 

how is buying bread and milk got anything to do with spending $30K on a car

big dollar purchases often have a long lead time

plenty of people go to car dealers on weekends when they have some time free , check out some new cars , see whats out there , same applies to houses

I went looking for my vehicle as I was in the process of purchasing a business and it would be a business vehicle , I didn’t need it right then , I needed to know what vehicles were out there, what would suit my needs and what the lead time would be for when I needed it

When I did need it I made the calls and bought it straight away with no hassle

they may or may not need to buy something right now, but it may be in the next 6-12 months and are looking for info

good salespeople treat everyone who rolls through the door the same

many salesman have lost a sale by judging the look of the person

[Speedbag]

Back to the Mustang, the '11 V6 cars can be had with the same brakes and suspension as the GT; check the option list closely and you may have to order since most dealers will miss checking that box when ordering stock.

The '11 GT will run a road course neck and neck with a BMW M3.....check youtube for a Motor Trend vid. 

[duccarlos]

If you liked the GTI, you'll like a Subaru. I love sport hatchbacks. I would love a R32. Also check the Lancer hatchback. It looks great!

Mash, you got me all wrong. I am in no way talking deals here. Unfortunately I don't know enough people that own the cars that I'm test driving. Unfortunately towards the end of the year I will not have time to go to the dealers and test drive. My plan is to narrow down the cars to 1 and buy from my local dealer who will be servicing. I should also clear up that the only salesperson that has been less than stelar in the way they they treated me was from the Honda dealership, which is where I take my current car for service. I love their service department and Hondas really do sell themselves. The guy might also have been having a bad day. The Cadillac dealer was an older gentleman that was not as outgoing, but he was knowledgable. The Acura salesperson was very outgoing and he was very patient with my son. The Acura salesperson really sold me n that dealer and it helps that they have probably the best customer satisfaction in the area. When it is time to buy, I will be trying to contact the same person (except if we decide on the Honda). When the time comes to buy, I will talk deals then. Like you mentioned it is not worth talking about it now.

[Monstermash]

If you liked the GTI, you'll like a Subaru. I love sport hatchbacks. I would love a R32. Also check the Lancer hatchback. It looks great!

Mash, you got me all wrong. I am in no way talking deals here. Unfortunately I don't know enough people that own the cars that I'm test driving. Unfortunately towards the end of the year I will not have time to go to the dealers and test drive. My plan is to narrow down the cars to 1 and buy from my local dealer who will be servicing. I should also clear up that the only salesperson that has been less than stelar in the way they they treated me was from the Honda dealership, which is where I take my current car for service. I love their service department and Hondas really do sell themselves. The guy might also have been having a bad day. The Cadillac dealer was an older gentleman that was not as outgoing, but he was knowledgable. The Acura salesperson was very outgoing and he was very patient with my son. The Acura salesperson really sold me n that dealer and it helps that they have probably the best customer satisfaction in the area. When it is time to buy, I will be trying to contact the same person (except if we decide on the Honda). When the time comes to buy, I will talk deals then. Like you mentioned it is not worth talking about it now.

When I know what I'm buying, I'll be doing everything else online.

 This is a little contradicting no?

[duccarlos]

You know there is a new technology called "email". This technology allows you to contact people over a new machine called a "computer". Many people have access to this technology today and it allows you to have a conversation with people without having to be in front of them. You should look into it.

[zooom]

  If you're considering a pre-owned VW I would suggest buying one from a VW dealer and have it VW assured (certified). If you're local to the New England area I can point you in the right direction and make sure you're treated right.

and 1 guy at a good dealer in the DC Metro area!!! 

 

[zooom]

GTI, just check out the dealer real well.  Bad dealers are their reliability problem

amen!!!

the sop to us is..."you can drive aggressively in this baby and get reasonably good mileage"....ahhh yah sure!...give me a Ford 500 rental with all the insurance options on it and a 5th of Wild Turkey and I'll show you what a car can do :-)

sounds like a "Days of Thunder" rental car scenes moment awaiting.....LOL

[duccarlos]

So the VW's reliability issues are more due to bad service? If I might express an opinion here, I think we are expecting too much from a company that is basically the economy brand of Europe. I know that we pay a premium here for them, but it's still meant to be the cheaper alternatives. We haven't discussed the reliability of GM products.

[Howie]

So the VW's reliability issues are more due to bad service? If I might express an opinion here, I think we are expecting too much from a company that is basically the economy brand of Europe. I know that we pay a premium here for them, but it's still meant to be the cheaper alternatives. We haven't discussed the reliability of GM products.

Ummm...far from the economy brand in Europe.  Or Asia for that matter. 

[duccarlos]

Well, you're right. I'm playing a bit of the devil's advocate here. If you pay a premium, you should expect reliability.

[zooom]

So the VW's reliability issues are more due to bad service? If I might express an opinion here, I think we are expecting too much from a company that is basically the economy brand of Europe. I know that we pay a premium here for them, but it's still meant to be the cheaper alternatives. We haven't discussed the reliability of GM products.

the problem lies with the fact that some dealers are not investing in their personell to get them the training for to do the proper repairs and fault tracing and diagnostic  and other capabilities they should be equipped to handle readily to save money and have them at the ready to do services, as apposed to being out of pocket to get trained...and in multiline dealers, some techs get basic training to service multiple lines as apposed to have their guys segmented a manufacturer and trained fully. reliability in those reports you all read comes down to things like "fixed right the 1st time" and "addressed all of the customer's concerns" and various things that are straight up yes or no questions in the surveys that don't allow for the very reasonable circumstances and explanations that should accompany those oversimplified answers...

the other thing that does happen is that the consumer doesn't bother to read the 300+ page owners manual for thier new vehicle and something happens that coincides with something that the whore of a saleperson who is trying to make 5 car deals on the same day didn't explain to the customer when making his "perfect delivery" or on the "6 position and demo drive" ( sorry Mash-not directed at you per sey, but the stereotype of whoring salespeople)...so it falls on the service department to explain something that they should know already and a service order is written up and dinks that ratio of cars in service versus number of RO's written on vehicles that the bean counter survey companies count without explanation against a brand or model....all of these types of things and others figure into the whole "reliability reports" you are trolling the interwebs to find and yet may not accurately reflect the actual model's capabilities and steadfast actual reliability....so don't pay as much stock in some of those reports as you think....if you have a question...go to a reputable dealer and then ask the service people what to look for and what to steer away from...look at what cars are parked for service of broken issues and what are there for just maintenance....the picture and focus may change a bit...

[cokey]

Keep the neon and throw my motor (srt4 neon) in it..  bigger turbo and ya got 30mpg with over 400+ hp and a nice sleeper..

[duccarlos]

That right there is great advise. I have made it a point to befriend some of the service guys, be it while servicing my bike or my cars. They will straight up tell you what are the issues and service intervals you are looking at.