FCR install : question on intake boot

[hillbillypolack]

Finally got the time to sort out the FCRs I got from Chris and am now sorting out little details.

All looks pretty cut and dry, but my question is about the alignment of the rubber boot on the intake runners.  On the stock carbs, the boots looked to be lined up (L to R).  They also fit snugly onto the intake and carbs even before tightening the hose clamps.

The FCRs look to be about 1/4" wider center to center than the stock carbs.  The boots of course can be contorted (via hot water soak and wrangling into position).  BUT, is this normal?  Or, is there a way to get them to fit as well as the stockers did?  I see there are the cross brackets on the FCRs, but I don't want to dink with these unless they actually do accommodate width adjustments.

Thanks.

[671M900]

didn't you get an adapter set with the fcrs?

[hillbillypolack]

Adapters are there, connected to the carbs.  When off the bike, the rubber boots fit snugly on the adapters as they should.  It's when I try to install the carb onto the intakes where the width difference shows up.

It's manageable, but the boots are much more contorted than when the stock carbs were in place.

[brad black]

just fit them, it can take a bit of effort to get the boots around the carb spigots, but a scriber/pointer run around and some lube usually works fine.  that's all i do.

[greenmonster]

What do Chris say?

You do not want any rubber to disturb the flow.
I converted mine fr an IL4 so I can´t say how exact a factory kit centers.

[Cloner]

just fit them, it can take a bit of effort to get the boots around the carb spigots, but a scriber/pointer run around and some lube usually works fine.  that's all i do.

And if anybody knows, it'd be Brad.  That guy's word is gospel when it comes to two-valvers.

How many dozens of these have you installed, Brad?  Is it over 50 sets?

Since we're on the subject, I was messing about with the FCRs on my '95 SS last week and, although they've been there for ten years, I'm not really happy with the cable routing.  What advice do you have on that, BB?

[brad black]

And if anybody knows, it'd be Brad.  That guy's word is gospel when it comes to two-valvers.

How many dozens of these have you installed, Brad?  Is it over 50 sets?

Since we're on the subject, I was messing about with the FCRs on my '95 SS last week and, although they've been there for ten years, I'm not really happy with the cable routing.  What advice do you have on that, BB?

he says, falling off the pedestal:

i've only fitted 2 sets of fcr, they generally just don't get done out here.  local importer price is quite a bit higher than buying them direct from chris kelley, and most people don't seem to get that carried away in general.

the cables i run across the front of the ignition switch and in between the lh frame rails.  probably as you have it.  they're much to stiff to do anything else that works as far as i can see.  i've told the owners of the two bikes i've done to lock the steering to the right, so you don't mark the dash foam.  cable routing is the only annoying thing i've found with fitting them.

[Cloner]

No accounting for Aussie foibles, huh?   

Thanks for the "heads up", anyway.  That's how I have them routed, but the cables do interfere with the foam pretty heavily.  I tried routing through the front stay, but the holes are too small for proper play, so that's out.  Under also doesn't work well.  I think those cables should be about 50mm shorter.  Maybe I'll just order a custom set after I play with them a bit.  I'd also like the carb end fittings to be a tad more bent, maybe right at 90° in lieu of the shallower bend of the ones in the kit. 

Maybe the lower bars were a poor idea, huh?   

[junior varsity]

the cables that come with 'em are motionpro's. sidenote: they make custom cables, so if you ever want longer or shorter ones, they'll easily make 'em for you. I had them make me a set of cables for the FCR 41's so I could use the multi-cam profile ER Racing Quickturn throttle I had on the shelf.  (LOTSA FUN!)

putting the airbox over the keihin's on the other M900 was a pregnant dog. had to shave up the box quite a bit where cables go in.

[koko64]

the cables that come with 'em are motionpro's. sidenote: they make custom cables, so if you ever want longer or shorter ones, they'll easily make 'em for you. I had them make me a set of cables for the FCR 41's so I could use the multi-cam profile ER Racing Quickturn throttle I had on the shelf.  (LOTSA FUN!)

putting the airbox over the keihin's on the other M900 was a pregnant dog. Had to shave up the box quite a bit where cables go in.

Same here.

I have been fitting the rubber bell mouths to the carb ends first, clamping them, then squishing them into the holes in the air box. I then use a small flat head screw driver to seat the rubber bell mouths also using my fingers between the filter support 'grate'. You kind of 'knead' them on. After much wiggling and cursing the jobs done. Then I have a beer. Pods are so much easier, but I'm sticking with the air box at present. I might consider pods if a m starts mass producing his carbon battery holder  . Chris Kelly provides extra installation tips with his carb kits which helps. His site will also have this info.

I run the the single pull cable and like a m have relieved the air box moulding near it to route it easier. Since I run the stock breather hose to the stock air box, I push the cable bend in as close as possible to the side of the air box moulding to fit the hose (and clear the tank). I have found the single cable set up works better than the dual set up. The throttle snaps shut much more quickly and crisply with a well adjusted single cable set up. Others may disagree, but they may have a great way of setting the twin cables to work as the legislators intended.

I find the cable length a few inches too long for my liking, but I've shortened my bars an inch each end. I run the cable under and around the steering head and in front of the gauges to use up the length and avoid kinks. I've got the DP bikini fairing though so it's hidden. I'm guessing the SS cable is shorter so I'll order one for the Monster sometime.

[junior varsity]

It is shorter - identical in every way otherwise.

i have considered doing a single cable as well. Never really understood the "push" cable's purpose. enlighten me.

[koko64]

I have read over the years (mainly in Harley performance books), that the push cable is a requirement for safety in some  states/countries to ensure the throttle closes and doesn't jam open. It kind of became standard on carbs in time. It has also been claimed to make the throttle pull easier. Funny thing was that the Harley guys really favoured butterfly style carbs like S&S and the stock Keihin, Bendix, etc carbs were all car type butterfly carbs. Big Mikuni and Keihin flatslides are are more recent phenomenon for the cruiser guys. (This will bring back some memories for some of the more mature forum members).

I've always found the twin cable system quite I'm of the opinion that a well set up system that's properly adjusted, routed and lubed works the best. Correct carb maintenance is important, especially slide carbs (round slide carbs even more so) to avoid throttle jamming. There is little chance of a butterfly carb jamming open with the cylinder vacuum wanting to suck the butterfly shut, but some slide carbs have been known jam open. I suppose an object caught inside any carb could jam it open. A badly pinched cable could cause a jam. I have had an Amal carb jam open on an old Triumph when the slides were worn, but it needed a rebuild. It had little to do with the cable set up. I know guys who have run Delortos who have preload shimmed the closing springs to lessen throttle pull effort and reduce the chance of throttle jam. Some guys I know have run graphite or teflon on their round slide carbs to do the same (more memories).

The good news is the FCRs are designed in a way to remove stiction, they are a fantastic design. The rollers the slides run on, the operating arm leverage and spring design have solved the problems of early flatslide design. I have run a well set up single cable with no problems on two bikes.  In fact I have found throttle pull lighter and 'snap back' sharper with a single cable.

I can't say if you would be breaking any regulations going to single cable, it might depend on your state laws.

[brad black]

this is what i do to the airbox - http://bradthebikeboy.blogspot.com/2011/01/airbox-mods-when-fitting-fcr-to-ducati.html

i don't remove the rubbers from the airbox, i just drop the airbox on, spray some silicon spray around the rubbers and using a little hooked scriber i push them out around the carb inlet bosses whhile loading the airbox down and with a little effort on they go.  easy.

[koko64]

That's what I did with the Superlight, seemed to work well, but I used Chris Kelly's method on the Monster. Buggers (intake boots) were real stubborn with the Monster, don't know why.

[Cloner]

I also modified my airbox as you guys indicate.  Further, I split the battery tray from the rest of the airbox assembly so I can simply remove the battery box portion during valve adjustment rather than trying to work through/around it.  I install my airbox as Brad described, except I don't use silicone lubricant, I just load the box and work the boots on with a rounded awl.

I have considered a single pull system, but I'm not sure why I never installed one.  It would definitely take up less space around the instrument cluster and I'd have greater variety in choosing a throttle, I think.  Hummmmmm.

I know Rick Yamane at Motion Pro, so getting cables made should be no problem.  In fact, Rick has my watch for repair right now (he fixes watches in his spare time and Tag Heuer wanted a MINT to repair my Calibre S) so maybe I can talk him into making me a cable and throwing it in the box with the watch.  I guess a little measuring is in order this evening.

Thanks for the advice, gents.

Cloner
ABQ, NM