Pick up truck tries to kill biker

[Mother]

So, you would have made a U Turn and gone the other way?

Uh

Yeah dewd

When I said I would want my buddy to stop and call PD

What I really meant was I would turn tail and run the other way

[duccarlos]

FTR, as far as I'm concerned, anyone who thinks that the riders did anything wrong are, well, bent.

I will say it again, just because this is exactly how you would react in this situation, does not mean that it wasn't stupid. A whole lotta dumb on that video.

[NorDog]

I will say it again, just because this is exactly how you would react in this situation, does not mean that it wasn't stupid. A whole lotta dumb on that video.

Stupid is one thing (though I disagree that the riders were stupid).  Calling someone an asshole because he didn't cut and run for the nearest telephone is quite another.  A friggin' telephone.

The guy in the truck could have run the guy on the bike off the road, where he could bleed out while you're looking for a cell signal or a pay phone.  Now THAT'S stupid.

Someone calling themself an asshole, like Jacob has done, is fine.  I won't doubt his word there.  But calling others assholes because they stick together when the going gets tough is, well, to be an asshole.  So I guess I don't disagree with Jacob altogether.

FTR, if anyone here sees me on my bike out in the boondocks being chased by a deranged redneck in a pickup truck, please, PLEASE, don't go looking for a friggin' telephone.

[Mother]

For the record, I don't see how the riders were total assholes. Truck driver? Of course.

We will try and start here, The Driver is definitely an asshole

Bike riders? Not so much. The first rider didn't do anything I haven't done in oh, maybe four decades of street riding. And I really don't consider myself an asshole.

I would hazard a guess that every single person on this board

including myself

is guilty of that pass

OK, sure my ex-wife thinks so but make the beast with two backs her!

thank you for the offer but we are getting off topic

And if I was the second rider I would have done the same thing. Hang back and let the camera record. Who knows, hillbilly asshole might have wrecked out an oncoming bike or car and I am sure the local DA's office would have loved to have that vid. Can you say incriminating evidence? I knew you could!

or taken your friend out when he stopped at that stop sign with just a slight nudge of the wheel

Just another crazy mother make the beast with two backser behind the wheel of a potentially deadly weapon with their brain stem unattached. Thankfully no one was hurt by said hillbilly asshole.

Ok lets take some creative license and change out the truck with a firearm

would you have done the same thing?

the truck made two swerves at rider #1 and then pursued him so lets say he took two shots and began chasing your friend

would you have followed to record film for the DA?

a truck is a 8000lb slow moving bullet but the results are the same when they meet flesh at velocity

[Mother]

The guy in the truck could have run the guy on the bike off the road, where he could bleed out while you're looking for a cell signal or a pay phone.  Now THAT'S stupid.

You are very right, that is exactly what could have happened

what would you have done if he caught up to your friend and splattered him all over the road?

you certainly aren't going to contribute in any clinical fashion without any equipment or an operating room in your pocket

would you then go look for a cell signal or a pay phone...after the fact?

what happens when there isn't a signal?

are you going to leave your friend to bleed out in the ditch to go find that pay phone that you past or flag down another car?


More importantly

what are you going to say to the police when they show up and your friend is roadkill?


"Mister police man here look at this video, it shows the whole thing"

"Look here where he swerves twice trying to kill my friend"

"and watch here how he chases him and is driving like a complete lunatic and endangers all these other drivers"


The cop is going to look at you and say:


"You witnessed this individual attempt to murder your friend"

"and you followed this individual while recording him as he chased your friend down and killed him"

"then you decided it was time to get us involved?"

"you have 5 minutes of footage, that is 5  minutes that we could have used to intervene before he killed anyone"



Then there is the ever pleasant alone time in the dark

after the funeral

and

after all the back slapping

where all your mutual friends tell you what an amazing person you are

by being there when your buddy was killed


but

you have those nagging couple of questions left

did I do everything I could have done to prevent this from happening?

would the police have gotten him in time if I had just stopped and called 911?

[Raux]

The guy with the cam did have a cell phone but would have had to have stopped to use it and thereby could have lost contact with his friend. As soon as he was able to stop he did call the police.

[corey]

You are very right, that is exactly what could have happened

what would you have done if he caught up to your friend and splattered him all over the road?

you certainly aren't going to contribute in any clinical fashion without any equipment or an operating room in your pocket

would you then go look for a cell signal or a pay phone...after the fact?

what happens when there isn't a signal?

are you going to leave your friend to bleed out in the ditch to go find that pay phone that you past or flag down another car?


More importantly

what are you going to say to the police when they show up and your friend is roadkill?


"Mister police man here look at this video, it shows the whole thing"

"Look here where he swerves twice trying to kill my friend"

"and watch here how he chases him and is driving like a complete lunatic and endangers all these other drivers"


The cop is going to look at you and say:


"You witnessed this individual attempt to murder your friend"

"and you followed this individual while recording him as he chased your friend down and killed him"

"then you decided it was time to get us involved?"

"you have 5 minutes of footage, that is 5  minutes that we could have used to intervene before he killed anyone"



Then there is the ever pleasant alone time in the dark

after the funeral

and

after all the back slapping

where all your mutual friends tell you what an amazing person you are

by being there when your buddy was killed


but

you have those nagging couple of questions left

did I do everything I could have done to prevent this from happening?

would the police have gotten him in time if I had just stopped and called 911?

i'm not going to say that anything you're bringing up here is invalid, but i WILL say that what i think you're referring to here is all based on hind-sight.

IMO, none of us can say exactly what we'd do in the heat of the moment. Hind-sight is always 20/20. We can ALL say we we think we SHOULD have done in the moment.

i can honestly say, i likely would have done the same thing in the video based on how i've reacted to similar (but not nearly as dangerous) situations in the past.

[NorDog]

Jacob,

I'm amazed at the level of fatuous rationalization and withering sarcasm you employ to justify the fact that if someone's in trouble you will choose to cut and run.

Of course, it should be noted that at least everyone here knows this now, so that's a good thing.

[Veloce-Fino]

Handlebar mounted shotgun.


/discussion.

[NorDog]

Handlebar mounted shotgun.


/discussion.

Needs dual gyros for training and elevating guidance.  But count me in.   

[JBubble]

Jacob,

I'm amazed at the level of fatuous rationalization and withering sarcasm you employ to justify the fact that if someone's in trouble you will choose to cut and run.

Of course, it should be noted that at least everyone here knows this now, so that's a good thing.

I've seen him deal with life or death situations, both with strangers and friends, and I trust him with my life. He does what is appropriate in the situation because he deals with people's life threatening decisions every day.

You don't like his opinion, thats fine. But to insinuate that he's a bad person when you have no idea who he is and haven't even met him? Not cool.


Back to the actual topic at hand instead of personal attacks:
I think that most people in that situation would have gone with their adrenaline and followed the guy as well and I think all those involved made mistakes and were wrong in varying degrees.

[duccarlos]

The pass and following was dumb. Confronting asshole in truck = assholish.

[triangleforge]

Just to throw out an alternate ending -- there's what looks to be a full country church parking lot at around the 2:00 mark. Instead of continuing to play the rabbit in a high speed chase for an extra six or seven minutes, would it have made sense for Rider #1 to pull off into the crowded parking lot? While I wouldn't necessarily expect a lot of sympathy for moto riders there, having a crowd of witnesses would seem to me to diminish the likelihood of a 9mm ending to the video.

[ducatiz]

Lot of monday morning quarterbacking here.

Easy to criticize someone looking at their video, while they are trying to make up their minds and shitting themselves at the same time.

I don't know what I would have done, but my range of experience isn't typical.  But it's been a long time since I sat and picked off guys carrying katyushah rockets, and I'm now an attorney with kids. 

but 5 minutes in the thick of things is a blink of an eye.

[Mother]

Jacob,

I'm amazed at the level of fatuous rationalization and withering sarcasm you employ to justify the fact that if someone's in trouble you will choose to cut and run.

Of course, it should be noted that at least everyone here knows this now, so that's a good thing.

this is your second accusation of turning tail and running

maybe if we do this step by step

we can see where the miscommunication is happening

1. Witness homicidal action

2. Identify continued threat

3. Consider a course of action
(this is the part where you think vs react)

4. Understand personal/equipment limitations and secure resources
(this is the part where you understand that you don't have the ability to affect a situation and need the help of people who do)

5. proceed to the scene

maybe this will help, I'm not sure

and

For the Record   <-(see what I'm doing here)

This is sarcasm

My previous post is stark make the beast with two backsing reality

I understand the need for people to react when their blood is up

and

I don't judge them negatively for it

but

maybe this one time we can simply agree to disagree and forgo the assumptions of character    <-(might still be snarky sarcasm there, I dunno yet)