powered by:
August 25, 2024, 06:13:28 AM
Welcome,
Guest
. Please
login
or
register
.
1 Hour
1 Day
1 Week
1 Month
Forever
Login with username, password and session length
News
:
Tapatalk users...click me
Home
Help
Search
Login
Register
Discussion Boards
Introduce Yourself
FAQs and Policies
General Monster Forum
Remembering our friends...in Memorium
Riding Techniques
Tutorials
Tech
Accessories & Mods
Gear
Racing & Trackdays
Stolen Motorcycles
No Moto Content
Board Tech Issues
Local Club Boards
BOMb
RCP
Sponsors
Valley Desmo Service
California Cycleworks
MotorcycleGear.Com
Monsterparts
Minor Sponsor Board
Sponsor Info
Flea Market
Monsters for Sale
Monsters Wanted
Other Bikes
Parts for Sale
Parts Wanted
Gear for Sale
Misc for Sale/Wanted
Ducati Monster Forum
>
Moto Board
>
General Monster Forum
(Moderators:
ducpainter
,
bigiain
,
Speeddog
) >
1199 Photo leak!
Pages:
1
...
13
14
[
15
]
16
17
...
28
Go Down
« previous
next »
Print
Author
Topic: 1199 Photo leak! (Read 82221 times)
He Man
Post Whore
Offline
Posts: 11596
Re: 1199 Photo leak!
«
Reply #210 on:
September 21, 2011, 09:06:07 PM »
frameless in 2009, but that year stoner was pretty much out, however he still from time to time made the bike competative. if i understand it right, the only reason stoner could take that bike to that kind of limit was because he had some serious balls and trust in the bikes ability.
Logged
2006 Ducati S2R1100 Yea.... stunttin like my daddy CHROMED OUT 1100!!!!
Check out my Latest Video! 05/13/2017 :https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4xSA7KzEzU
EvilSteve
not so evil, not so steve
Full Member
Offline
Posts: 179
Re: 1199 Photo leak!
«
Reply #211 on:
September 21, 2011, 09:45:42 PM »
You guys are right, I looked it up, it wasn't frameless in 2007.
As for arguments about the GP bikes, I just don't think they apply to a street bike.
Logged
2011 M796
Raux
Guest
Re: 1199 Photo leak!
«
Reply #212 on:
September 21, 2011, 11:44:06 PM »
Quote from: EvilSteve on September 21, 2011, 09:45:42 PM
You guys are right, I looked it up, it wasn't frameless in 2007.
As for arguments about the GP bikes, I just don't think they apply to a street bike.
the front connected to the motor and not to the rear it was frameless as per the definition that ducati has
just the air box was separate instead of integrated
As far as bayliss he's on the payroll he's not going to say it has the same issues. as the gp bike
until this bike tech wins with another rider I'm not convinced
When or better if it does then i will concede it is a good bike
Logged
Triple J
Guest
Re: 1199 Photo leak!
«
Reply #213 on:
September 22, 2011, 07:49:11 AM »
Quote from: Raux on September 21, 2011, 11:44:06 PM
until this bike tech wins with another rider I'm not convinced
+1
It may be fine for a SBK, since they're quite a bit different from GP bikes...but I want to see.
Logged
junior varsity
loves ze desmodromics.
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: 7355
GT1k, 99 M900(V), 98 M900(W), 00 M900S, 02 748E/R
Re: 1199 Photo leak!
«
Reply #214 on:
September 22, 2011, 10:27:15 AM »
Quote from: Triple J on September 22, 2011, 07:49:11 AM
It may be fine for a SBK, since they're quite a bit different from GP bikes...but I want to see.
i'm not sure how different they are - wheels, brakes, motor, chain drive, swingarm, forks, tank, clipon bars, etc - sure they are each slightly different, but not different animals. its not flat-tracker to road-racer different. Heck, They race them on many of the same tracks! So what's the difference in GP to SBK that would make lack of front-end feel "ok"?
There's an issue when there are two former world champs on the current machine who've done great on other manufacturers rides, but are having difficulty with this bucket o' bolts.
Logged
Raux
Guest
Re: 1199 Photo leak!
«
Reply #215 on:
September 22, 2011, 10:29:33 AM »
Quote from: j v on September 22, 2011, 10:27:15 AM
i'm not sure how different they are - wheels, brakes, motor, chain drive, swingarm, forks, tank, clipon bars, etc - sure they are each slightly different, but not different animals. its not flat-tracker to road-racer different. Heck, They race them on many of the same tracks! So what's the difference in GP to SBK that would make lack of front-end feel "ok"?
There's an issue when there are two former world champs on the current machine who've done great on other manufacturers rides, but are having difficulty with this bucket o' bolts.
also the fact that the specs are close to the same. @400 lbs and @200hp
Logged
Triple J
Guest
Re: 1199 Photo leak!
«
Reply #216 on:
September 22, 2011, 11:11:21 AM »
Quote from: j v on September 22, 2011, 10:27:15 AM
So what's the difference in GP to SBK that would make lack of front-end feel "ok"?
Horsepower, motor configuration and power delivery, front tire grip and the forces that are put back into the chassis, 800 riding style vs. SBK riding style...off the top of my head. I'm not saying a lcak of feel would be OK, but maybe it won't be as noticeable on a SBK.
Quote from: j v on September 22, 2011, 10:27:15 AM
There's an issue when there are two former world champs on the current machine who've done great on other manufacturers rides, but are having difficulty with this bucket o' bolts.
Agreed. I'm very curious to see how the new chassis works on the SBK. It could very well be a POS.
«
Last Edit: September 22, 2011, 11:13:06 AM by Triple J
»
Logged
$Lindz$
Sr. Member
Offline
Posts: 253
Re: 1199 Photo leak!
«
Reply #217 on:
September 22, 2011, 11:17:36 AM »
Tires also.
The MotoGP Bridgestones are a very hard carcass tire so when you're at big lean angles it transmits a lot of feedback, but it also means the frame has to be the more pliant 'suspension'. Back when Stoner was winning on the Duc, Bridgestone weren't the only tire in MotoGP. Even as they became the spec tire, they were making a special front for the D16. Now they've done away with that and every team gets the same tires. That's why this season, more than any other, Ducati have been having problems with their "front end". The other 3 teams giving Bridgestone data and input are 1.) Japanese also, and 2.) aluminum twin spar frames. There is no reason for them to cater to Ducati anymore.
The 'frameless' design has the ability to be lighter than a twin spar. This is negated in MotoGP, however, because the minimum weight is so drastically heavier than what Ducati are ABLE to achieve with their bike. For a road bike there is nothing saying you have to make your bike heavier. In SBK the minimum weight is apparently not a hindrance to Ducati either, as Prezioso only complained about MotoGP weight limits.
In SBK (and especially the real world) they have tires that aren't such a hard construction as the Bridgestone GP tires (you're not seeing nearly the same loading and stress on the tires). The spec Pirellis in SBK are a much softer carcass (as are all other tires) so they are able to better soak up bumps mid-corner vs. relying on the frame to do all the work as in MotoGP.
Logged
IdZer0
Sr. Member
Offline
Posts: 444
BE
Re: 1199 Photo leak!
«
Reply #218 on:
September 22, 2011, 11:18:21 AM »
I wonder whether the DP catalogue will list a Alu or a CF airbox
Logged
2007 Monster 695, DP ECU, Low mount Alu Termignonis
replaced by 2011 848 EVO
junior varsity
loves ze desmodromics.
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: 7355
GT1k, 99 M900(V), 98 M900(W), 00 M900S, 02 748E/R
Re: 1199 Photo leak!
«
Reply #219 on:
September 22, 2011, 11:22:59 AM »
I think the minimum weight rule is BS - these are supposed to be prototype machines - If a manufacturer can produce a 220hp 800cc bike tipping the scales at 295 #, then so be it. I can only imagine the rule exists to prevent Honda from bankrupting the competitors in this fashion (instead they are allowed to have a 5-man factory team
)
Logged
$Lindz$
Sr. Member
Offline
Posts: 253
Re: 1199 Photo leak!
«
Reply #220 on:
September 22, 2011, 11:34:09 AM »
I think a lot of Honda's performance this last season has been the culmination of several things, not least of which is the termination of the F1 program. They spent so much time effort and money in F1 and sacrificed so many seasons for "the future" and they finally had a world-class car and then they quit. Brawn took the car, put a Mercedes engine in it and dominated 2009.
They've been the same way in MotoGP, always 'looking towards the future' and sacrificing the present. Once the F1 program stopped they redistributed those lot of engineers. Many went back to Motorcycles and you get them finally working out how to include seamless shift transmissions and stuff like that.
Logged
TAftonomos
is without a monster :(
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: 2482
Re: 1199 Photo leak!
«
Reply #221 on:
September 22, 2011, 04:14:33 PM »
Quote from: $Lindz$ on September 22, 2011, 11:17:36 AM
Tires also.
The MotoGP Bridgestones are a very hard carcass tire so when you're at big lean angles it transmits a lot of feedback, but it also means the frame has to be the more pliant 'suspension'. Back when Stoner was winning on the Duc, Bridgestone weren't the only tire in MotoGP. Even as they became the spec tire, they were making a special front for the D16. Now they've done away with that and every team gets the same tires. That's why this season, more than any other, Ducati have been having problems with their "front end". The other 3 teams giving Bridgestone data and input are 1.) Japanese also, and 2.) aluminum twin spar frames. There is no reason for them to cater to Ducati anymore.
The 'frameless' design has the ability to be lighter than a twin spar. This is negated in MotoGP, however, because the minimum weight is so drastically heavier than what Ducati are ABLE to achieve with their bike. For a road bike there is nothing saying you have to make your bike heavier. In SBK the minimum weight is apparently not a hindrance to Ducati either, as Prezioso only complained about MotoGP weight limits.
In SBK (and especially the real world) they have tires that aren't such a hard construction as the Bridgestone GP tires (you're not seeing nearly the same loading and stress on the tires). The spec Pirellis in SBK are a much softer carcass (as are all other tires) so they are able to better soak up bumps mid-corner vs. relying on the frame to do all the work as in MotoGP.
The Spec tire is THE problem.
Can't move the wide V4 forward anymore cause it will foul the tire.
Can't get the front tire hot enough because you can't push hard enough as the front end feel is to vague (not my words, VR and NH).
Use a soft front and it goes away after the first part of the race, and the ducs start to drift back. Have cold temps and they are in real trouble. When the venue has been hotter, they have done better.
VR said the 12' bike was better, because the motor/speed loaded up the front better, which provided heat, etc. Other reason was the bike can "ride around" the tire issue easier, as the 1000cc bike makes more torque.
Most of the above was straight out of an article. When I find the link, I'll post it.
Logged
MyDucParts.com
My Ebay Store - Ducati and more!
Howie
Post Whore
Offline
Posts: 17109
Re: 1199 Photo leak!
«
Reply #222 on:
September 23, 2011, 10:21:38 AM »
Another article:
http://www.cycleworld.com/2011/09/17/finding-flexibility-in-motogp-racing/?zeta_mid=HFM2_572783&zeta_rid=80693876
Lots of variables, the most difficult being the rider.
Logged
Travman
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: 2488
‘70 Guzzi, ‘73 Norton, ‘73 V7 Sport, ‘12 V7 Racer
Re: 1199 Photo leak!
«
Reply #223 on:
September 24, 2011, 05:32:24 PM »
«
Last Edit: September 24, 2011, 05:35:31 PM by Travman
»
Logged
ducatiz
No trellis. no desmo. = Not Ducati.
Post Whore
Offline
Posts: 15590
Re: 1199 Photo leak!
«
Reply #224 on:
September 24, 2011, 05:35:30 PM »
So they are testing them with American riders now?
Logged
Check out my oil filter forensics thread!
Offended? Click here
"Yelling out of cars, turning your speakers out the window to blast your music onto the street, setting off M-80 firecrackers, firing automatic weapons into the air—these are all well and good. But none of them create a merry atmosphere of insouciance and bonhomie quite like a revving motorcycle.
Pages:
1
...
13
14
[
15
]
16
17
...
28
Go Up
Print
« previous
next »
Jump to:
Please select a destination:
-----------------------------
Introductions
-----------------------------
=> Introduce Yourself
=> FAQs and Board Policies
-----------------------------
Moto Board
-----------------------------
=> General Monster Forum
=> In Memorium...Remembering our Friends
=> Riding Techniques
=> Tutorials
=> Tech
=> Accessories & Mods
=> Gear
=> Racing & Trackdays
=> Stolen Motorcycles
=> Random Cool Pics
-----------------------------
Kitchen Sink
-----------------------------
=> No Moto Content
===> Board Suggestions
===> Fixed Board Issues
=> Stella's Pop
-----------------------------
DMF Sponsors
-----------------------------
=> Valley Desmo Service
=> Ca-Cycleworks
=> New Enough.Com
=> Monsterparts
=> Minor Sponsors
=> Misc Info
-----------------------------
Local Clubs
-----------------------------
=> Monster Women
=> Ducati MOB
=> SoCal Monsters
=> CAM
=> OZ monsters
=> NorthWest
=> NEMHA
=> NYMMC
=> MHM
=> SoCO DOG
=> DFWM
=> MADDOG
=> MOCHA
=> THCM
=> AZDRA
=> M-ROC
=> Central Cal Monsters
=> DOCSF
=> MCMC
=> DDCM
=> DOCTOR
=> Hoosier Hooligans
=> OMHA
=> DOCIA
=> Rising Sun Ducatis
=> MCM
=> NMMR
=> MIA
=> Desmotropic
=> COW
=> MOTH
=> DesmOK
=> Bayou Country Ducati Riders
=> DeVal Mostro
=> Coastal Ducati Club
-----------------------------
Configurators and Calculators
-----------------------------
=> Valve Shim Calculator
Loading...
SimplePortal 2.1.1