Dresden VW factory

[DRKWNG]

Spending $100k on a car is a huge gamble. 

Not to the people who are likely willing to drop that kind of money on a car.  Well, to the people who can actually afford to drop that kind of money on a car I mean.

[ducatiz]

Not to the people who are likely willing to drop that kind of money on a car.  Well, to the people who can actually afford to drop that kind of money on a car I mean.

Exactly.  Go back to what I said about Europeans;  They buy what everyone else is buying.  If you're going to drop that much coin on a car, you're going to look and see what your neighbor is buying-- partly because you want to keep up and partly because you want to know what's out there.  VW sold only 3700 Phaetons in the USA over 5 years.  Not too many neighbors have them, no buzz nothing. 

Chances are if you're going to fart out 100k for a car, you're going to head to the AMG dealer or the BMW or the Audi. 

Which is really how VW should do things.. Audi should be their luxury line and maintain VW as the middle of the road line and Seat/Škoda as the shit line.

[teddy037.3]

One word, Audi.

that's not quite the same, though... if audi was invented for the US lux market and contained nothing but badge engineering, then maybe... hell, look at chevy/GMC...

parts bin sharing aside, audi is it's own thing.


what I thought was silly about the phaeton was that it was a competitor to the A8...

[DRKWNG]

I was about to say, you forgot Skoda at first.

[Speedbag]

Meh.

Beetle R.... 

[ducatiz]

I was about to say, you forgot Skoda at first.

Škoda is what happened when VW make the beast with two backsed a Saab

[DRKWNG]

parts bin sharing aside, audi is it's own thing.

Not really.  They dictate certain things to VW, especially here in the states.  Look at power ratings of the sporty VW models in Europe, and then compare them to the state-side model.  All of the US spec cars are down, some by as much as ten percent.  That's not because the engine is de-tuned, but because Audi does not want the VW to seem like it is encroaching on their (Audi's) turf.

Also, the two companies devised their market strategy together several years back, with Audi trying to target BMW and VW (Phaeton) going after Merc.

[teddy037.3]

... but because Audi does not want the VW to seem like it is encroaching on their (Audi's) turf.

what I meant was they they are separate companies, and not up-branded items for the US market (like how the japanese do it).  VW didn't say, "hey, they won't buy our $30,000+ VWs, so let's call them something else."

[ducatiz]

they may try to bring it back ...

Some of the problems, as described by VW America CEO Stefan Jacoby, include initial quality issues, overpricing and lackluster styling. Prices for the car started at about $70,000 and went all the way up to $100,000 for the flagship W12 model. Speaking with Automotive News, Jacoby said a good price for the new model would be about $55,000 and described the new car as being smaller than the current model so as to not compete with its Audi A8 cousin. Jacoby wasn’t willing to give a release date for the car but earlier reports claim it will be launched in Europe by 2010.

To further differentiate the new Phaeton from its rivals, officials are also considering adding a diesel model to the lineup but no final decision has been made. The only thing that’s certain is that if it does arrive the car will still carry the Phaeton name. "The Phaeton is the name of Volkswagen's luxury. We are proud of this name, and this name fits this car," Jacoby explained.

[DRKWNG]

We shall see.  Jacoby is gone now though, so hopefully there will be a bit more "improvement" in VW of NA. 

[DRKWNG]

Škoda is what happened when VW make the beast with two backsed a Saab

[Howie]

The Phaeton is available in a sizable chunk of the rest of the world.  It is essentially a steel bodied A8 and even has family ties with some Bentleys.  Failure in the US market does not equal failure.

[ducatiz]

The Phaeton is available in a sizable chunk of the rest of the world.  It is essentially a steel bodied A8 and even has family ties with some Bentleys.  Failure in the US market does not equal failure.

In Europe, VW is like Ford is here.  They make a huge range of cars and people know them as a full-range brand rather than as an economy brand.  Same with Mercedes, the A class is only £16,000 including VAT in England.  Figure about $18,000 if they sold it in the US (based on price comparisons with VW and Toyota models sold in the US and UK).

WHen Americans think VW they think "cheap, mostly reliable."  Not "shares a frame with a Bentley" and certainly not the price!

[DRKWNG]

WHen Americans think VW they think "cheap, mostly reliable."  Not "shares a frame with a Bentley" and certainly not the price!

Which reinforces my original sentiment.   Collectively, we haz teh dumbz... 

 

[ducatiz]

Which reinforces my original sentiment.   Collectively, we haz teh dumbz... 

 

I'd say it reinforces my point that VW has sold themselves as an economy car company in the US.