Post first track day questions

[sejman]

Finally did my first track day this weekend.  The 100+ heat here in Texas broke just in time making for a gorgeous day and I had a blast.  They had a photographer there so when the pics are available I'll post some in the Track Day reports thread.  For now I have a few questions.  I've been riding a long time (about 30 years) but never beat on a bike that hard before (also never been down - I'm a pretty conservative rider).

1. Does my '01 M900Sie have a rev limiter?  A couple of times when I was accelerating hard out of turn into a straight the engine cut at somewhere just north of maybe 8K (wasn't looking at the gauge...).  I thought these bikes had no red line, so I wasn't being real careful about monitoring RPMs.

2. Related to above, I had some trouble early in the day with down shifts - everything on the track was so amplified (hard acceleration, hard deceleration, etc.) that I was locking up the rear on quick downshift to prepare for turns making for some scary moments.  One of the instructors suggested that I not shift up so much and just rev higher (leading to #1).  Later in the day, I was pushing hard on straights requiring upshifts to 4th.  I got better on the down-shift/breaking maneuver getting setup for the tight turns, but part of it was just getting comfortable with the rear tire skidding.  Is this normal? I know about slipper clutches, but any suggestions short of that expensive upgrade?

3. I had no idea where the limits of my tires were - no feedback that I could tell.  I probably wasn't near the limits of the tire, so maybe that's why I didn't get any warning signs.  I'm running older Pilot Roads (several years old - mainly commuting miles) - not even sport tire.  Looking at the tires now I can see that I was using all of the tire (no chicken strips anymore) but probably not at high enough speeds to cause any sliding.  How do you know when you are getting to the tire's limits so you can back off before going too far?  And all that chewed up rubber I saw on other bikes (mainly track only bikes) - is that because they are using a soft race type compound instead of harder street tires?

4. Any advice on post track day maintenance?  I've never thrashed any machine that I owned that hard, so I feel like she needs a little TLC.  I'm overdue for a valve check - what effect could that have on engine life, or is it more a performance thing?

I'm surprisingly stiff/sore from the day (partially from the ordeal getting the bike into the back of the Uhaul trailer by myself - that's another story).  Already looking forward to the next opportunity to get on a track!

[ducpainter]

Finally did my first track day this weekend.  The 100+ heat here in Texas broke just in time making for a gorgeous day and I had a blast.  They had a photographer there so when the pics are available I'll post some in the Track Day reports thread.  For now I have a few questions.  I've been riding a long time (about 30 years) but never beat on a bike that hard before (also never been down - I'm a pretty conservative rider).

1. Does my '01 M900Sie have a rev limiter?  A couple of times when I was accelerating hard out of turn into a straight the engine cut at somewhere just north of maybe 8K (wasn't looking at the gauge...).  I thought these bikes had no red line, so I wasn't being real careful about monitoring RPMs. Yes the fi bikes have a rev limiter in the ecu. You can have it reflased to change the limit, but it doesn't make more power.

2. Related to above, I had some trouble early in the day with down shifts - everything on the track was so amplified (hard acceleration, hard deceleration, etc.) that I was locking up the rear on quick downshift to prepare for turns making for some scary moments.  One of the instructors suggested that I not shift up so much and just rev higher (leading to #1).  Later in the day, I was pushing hard on straights requiring upshifts to 4th.  I got better on the down-shift/breaking maneuver getting setup for the tight turns, but part of it was just getting comfortable with the rear tire skidding.  Is this normal? I know about slipper clutches, but any suggestions short of that expensive upgrade? Practice rev matching. You'll get better.

3. I had no idea where the limits of my tires were - no feedback that I could tell.  I probably wasn't near the limits of the tire, so maybe that's why I didn't get any warning signs.  I'm running older Pilot Roads (several years old - mainly commuting miles) - not even sport tire.  Looking at the tires now I can see that I was using all of the tire (no chicken strips anymore) but probably not at high enough speeds to cause any sliding.  How do you know when you are getting to the tire's limits so you can back off before going too far?  And all that chewed up rubber I saw on other bikes (mainly track only bikes) - is that because they are using a soft race type compound instead of harder street tires? You probably would have done yourself a favor to put fresher tires on, but eating tires isn't a badge of honor...just expensive and possibly a sign of bad set-up on a trackday bike.

4. Any advice on post track day maintenance?  I've never thrashed any machine that I owned that hard, so I feel like she needs a little TLC.  I'm overdue for a valve check - what effect could that have on engine life, or is it more a performance thing? If you're worried, change the oil

I'm surprisingly stiff/sore from the day (partially from the ordeal getting the bike into the back of the Uhaul trailer by myself - that's another story).  Already looking forward to the next opportunity to get on a track!

Sounds like you had fun.
 

[ZLTFUL]

And all that chewed up rubber I saw on other bikes (mainly track only bikes) - is that because they are using a soft race type compound instead of harder street tires?

To kind of expand on what Nate said above, it really depends on the type of "chewed up" you are referring to. It is common for the tire to take on a rough look. The very edge of the tire will also collect irregular balls of rubber as the tire wears too. The key is that it is an even wear (the entirety of the tire surface looks the same from one side to the other.

But there are also other situations that will cause a tire to look chewed up...cold tearing, incorrect pressures...heck, even a track that has vastly more right hand turns than left will make a tire look oddly chewed up. Most orgs' control riders will be able to take a peak at your tires and inform you if the wear you are seeing is normal or if something is up. You can also post up pics and we can give you a general assessment as well.

Pretty good answers above from Nate.
I give everything on the bike a good once over to verify that everything looks good.

As far as the downshifting thing...it will come with practice. Eventually you will be comfortable with backing it in a bit.

[zooom]

and to further expound on what the previous folks said...

on #3...as far as feeling a tire and it's limitations, I have never seen a good way to verbally explain it...but it is totally a feel thing for sure...Cornerspin showed me some of the whisper signs that I had previously not exactly been listening to from my bike in terms of that, and learned a bit more since...but there seems to be no good way to put it into words....but some good slow speed dirt oriented schooling where you learn to play with the limits of traction can help...

[sejman]

Thanks for the feedback - probably the biggest concern I have is learning the limits of traction and what, if anything, happens near the limits that tells you to back off.  Having said that, I was going plenty fast enough for my comfort so it wasn't like I was frustrated or anything.  Biggest issue was trying to keep a tight line in hairpins and exiting on the "proper" line - I found myself often drifting out wide at the exits.

Overall a humbling but very exhilarating experience

[ZLTFUL]

You will learn with more time.
A big mistake most new track riders make is trying to fix everything at once.
Fix one corner at a time. Use one session to focus on fixing one thing at a time...braking, throttle inputs, corner entry/apex/exit...if you try to work on all of these things at once, you will become overloaded and start making mistakes.

Even if they are stock tires, your first day at the track is probably come to about 40% of the tires capabilities.
None of my crashes have ever been tire related and I have done track days on some very shagged tires.

[Spidey]

Congrats! 

1)  Yes.

2)  It'll always be a bit of an issue on a big twin, but learning to properly blip (what DP refered to as rev-matching) will help.  And you can always feather out the clutch to prevent rear-wheel lock up.  After a while, you'll get used to an occasional bit of tail wag as you brake for corners.

3)  You're not going to feel the limits of your tires at this stage of the game or with sport touring tires.  "Feel" is something that takes a while, and some people (read: me) have to crash first to understand what the tires were saying.  "Oh, that's what that vibration was right before I lowsided.  The tires were telling me to stop leaning so much."  Truth is, if this is your first trackday, you didn't even get close to the limits.  Don't try to 'read' the tires by how chewed up they are or the chicken strips.  BTW, what pressures were you running? That'll affect 'feel' a lot. 

4)  If it makes you feel better, give the bike a thorough once-over, clean it up and change the oil.  If you're running track tire pressures, add some air to get the tires back up to street pressures.

[sejman]

I figured I wasn't near the limits of the tire, except I was a little concerned about the age and type of tire - must be pretty hard since it still has over 50% life after 5000 miles and not a "sport" type tire.  I ran them at 28psi (cold) front/rear as a start and didn't have any reason to change it during the day.  For the next track day I'll definitely put on some fresh tires that are more sport oriented.

I'll practice the rev matching around town - I do this a lot in my car, but just didn't want to get overly busy during corner entrance.  I actually was getting pretty comfortable with my rear tire squirting around late in the day once I saw that nothing awful was going to happen.

Good advice on the "fixing one thing at time" thing...the instructors stressed that in the afternoon.

[Cider]

It's possible to overload a tire so quick that you have no warning (e.g. stab the front brake), so I try to work on smooth inputs and relaxed arms in an effort to feel what my tires are doing.  I doubt everybody interprets feedback the same way, but for me the steering feels loose and vague when front traction is approaching the limit; rear traction I feel more in the seat of my pants.

[sejman]

I finally got the pics from the track day photographer and posted them up in the track day reports thread.

Reflecting back on the day I can now understand why everyone recommends focusing first on suspension setup/improvements, etc.  The only slightly scary moments that I had during the day were due to bumps upsetting the bike enough to cause me to back off.  I learned to be more relaxed, gentle on inputs and power through these situations as the day went on, but I can see that suspension is the first limitation you run into once speeds start getting up there.

[gm2]

getting your suspension properly (i.e. professionally) set up for the track should be at the top of your list.  critical.

[zooom]

getting your suspension properly (i.e. professionally) set up for the track should be at the top of your list.  critical.

huge +1....I've seen guys with set up suspensions drop lap times faster and more consistantly than any other mod....

[zooom]

here is a nice lil bit about track days and the rider not the machine....just in the spirit of things....

http://www.ducatinewstoday.com/2011/10/will-my-ducati-monster-be-okay-on-a-track-day/