Getting Ducati to replace bike

[jsriley]

So your saying that its normal for vehicles produced buy Ducati and Ferrari to have trouble starting when their brand new? I didn't even put 50 miles on the bike before it started acting up. I expect to have to take the bike to the shop and pay more than other bikes to fix it, but not before i hit 1000 miles. By the way I do plan on getting a Ferrari. It's going to be a graduation give when I get done law school. If that gives me trouble i'm sure any problems will not be fixed at the shop and not keep reoccurring.

[J5]

Well I have to take it to the same dealership one more time tomorrow. The only dealer is two hours away. Besides this dealer has my replacement tank panels.

The bike has 2800 miles on it now, but it had around 800 when it overheated real bad.

I want to take it to the dealer near Newark and have it looked over. I have to take it there because FBF doesn't have the computer needed to sync the ecu chip with the bike for the tremi slip ons. I just don't want to put more money into the bike if it keeps giving me problems.

If I still have trouble starting the bike, if it backfires more (which it has been doing twice a week now) or if it leaks oil again after I get if fixed. I'm going to demand a new bike.

Hopefully it gets fixed.

does it have the termis and ecu on it ?

if so was the tps and mixtures reset ?

this could be all your problems are

[jsriley]

No I didn't get the tremi kit on it yet. I plan to put that on during the winter and get the exhaust pipes coated.

[Howie]

Maybe I should ask Audi to buy my car back.  The outside air temperature reads high when the sun beats on the black top or I am in traffic.  The sun roof deflector broke.  I had to buy and service the car from a dealer further from my house because my local dealer is not good.  OK, it does start well and doesn't leak oil, but I do need to add oil between changes.

Back to your bike:
 
The ambient air temperature sensor is located between the cylinders.  It is hot there when the engine runs.

Your manual says use the fast idle up to 95^oF and the engine temp is less than 2 bars.  Do it.  If it is still hard to start you have a problem.  You may
need to leave it at the dealer overnight or a few days for them to find the problem.  You may even need to go to a more competent dealer.

At 6 bars in traffic your bike is not overheating.  Again, read the manual.  You will feel heat from the engine.  Open the hood on your car after while it is running.  Warm, isn't it.  Imagine sitting over it.  Try a Harley and see how the rear cylinder feels on a hot day in traffic. 

Peeling stickers?  Could part of the cause be something you cleaned the bike with?  Seems the dealer got you new panels.  No issue there.

Oil leak?  If it is the filter or drain plug it is most likely the dealer's fault, not Ducati's.  If not, there were some minor oil leak warranty issues a competent dealer should have no problem handling.

Might a Ducati or Ferrari or Chevrolet have a starting problem when new?  ...Ummm..., that is one reason why they come with warranties.

[jsriley]

Howie maybe your mother should return you because your apparently defective. My main issues are that the bike has trouble starting and leaks oil after repeated attempts to fix it. Don't address the minor problem in an attempt to be funny while glossing over the real issues. If your going to a sarcastic douche keep your thoughts to yourself.

I realize where the air temp gauge is and have stated that I don't care about it.

Again I have taken it to the dealer many times and unless I want to take a 4 hour ride round trip it the only one near me.

I have riding bikes long enough to know that air cooled bikes run hot. It wasn't a little hot. Like I said it was in the middle of night low 70F and going between 6 - 7 bars and the air temp read --- F from too much heat.

Unless car wash soap and water can make stickers peel then no and obviously it is not an issue if they are being replaced. Again the starting and oil are the real issues.

Ummm? Yeah and after repeated attempts to remedy the problem they would replace the car. It's call the lemon law.

[Cloner]

I sympathize, jsriley.  I have no patience for those who compare Ducati and Ferrari, then use that poor comparison as an excuse for substandard quality.  Ducati have positioned themselves within the mainstream market and there is NEVER an excuse for producing a product that doesn't operate as intended, especially when new.  I'm sure the bike was intended to start easily and run without weeping oil.  I'm also sure the decals were intended to stay on the bike.  I'm sure the air temperature sensor was designed to accurately measure air temperature.  None of your expectations are unreasonable.

I hope you've documented each visit to your dealer.  Your documentation is your first line of defense in such situations.  If Ducati NA are doing their jobs correctly, you should have no problem getting this situation resolved if you approach them with proper documentation (receipts, complaints at time of presentation, etc.).  However, before you have to contact Ducati NA directly (and that IS an option), you should work with your dealer to resolve each specific issue.  When it comes down to brass tacks.....your Ducati is a machine and some machines are imperfect.  Ducati's responsibility is to make your machine correct to your satisfaction, and their first point of contact with customers is their dealer network.  When you cannot receive satisfaction through your dealer (and I think the system works best if you maintain a relationship with a single dealer during the resolution of issues like yours), then you should contact Ducati NA customer service (http://www.ducatiusa.com/company/contact_us/index.do), or demand to meet with Ducati NA's area service representative, who is a representative of the corporation.

Stick with it.  There is no excuse for substandard products in a commodity market...and motorcycles are undoubedtly a commodity!  Ducati chose to enter the mass market several years ago, and have worked to make motorcycles that are easier to own, maintain, and sell.  In doing so they chose to abandon the specialty "niche" market they occupied for decades, which means they've also chosen to shed the characteristics for which many people here have made excuses....poor quality...poor reliability...poor performance (in individual units)...and poor customer service.  We shouldn't have to force them to live with that decision.  Rather, they should undertake to make sure they fulfill every nuance of that choice, and taking care of units with poor quality is one of those nuances!  

Good luck.  You shouldn't need it....but just in case.  

Cloner
ABQ, NM
General Partner
Desert Desmo, LLC
New Mexico's Premiere Ducati Service Specialists

[zooom]

Howie maybe your mother should return you because your apparently defective. My main issues are that the bike has trouble starting and leaks oil after repeated attempts to fix it. Don't address the minor problem in an attempt to be funny while glossing over the real issues. If your going to a sarcastic douche keep your thoughts to yourself.

have you read " How to Make Friends and Influence People" ??....Howie might very have been a little snarky and just a tad antagonistic....but he is a very technically minded resource and is potentially giving you a dose of the reaction that a dealer may fire back at you in some degree...maybe not prefeaced as so, but there nonetheless...

okay, so you have to go to a dealer that is 4 hours away as your nearest dealer?...where is the next closest?...where or who is this dealer and where are you in relation...maybe someone knows someone else to refer you to....I have a dealer that is 20 mins away from me, but I trust them not and would much rather drag my bike 2 hours to get to a competent dealer I trust...and you know what...that isn't wholly uncommon....especially if said dealer is a multiline dealer that maybe primarily specializes in the other brands moreso...

sorry , but rant off for now...

[Cloner]

Also, as to your travel time, you might want to approach your dealer with the proposition that you've given them "X" opportunities to correct each defect, and that they should at least cover your travel expenses, or transport your bike to their facility, for each future occurance under warranty.  I'm pretty sure the warranty has an allowance for towing.

[herm]

Howie maybe your mother should return you because your apparently defective. My main issues are that the bike has trouble starting and leaks oil after repeated attempts to fix it. Don't address the minor problem in an attempt to be funny while glossing over the real issues. If your going to a sarcastic douche keep your thoughts to yourself.

uncalled for - howie may have come off a little sarcastic, but i don't see anywhere that he personally attacked you. recommend you review the board guidelines!
I realize where the air temp gauge is and have stated that I don't care about it.

Again I have taken it to the dealer many times and unless I want to take a 4 hour ride round trip it the only one near me.

if you are going to own this brand (or any other), you are going to have to either deal with your local dealer or one further away. getting a new bike will not change this. the only difference in your case between a ducati and a honda are the number of available dealerships to choose from.

I have riding bikes long enough to know that air cooled bikes run hot. It wasn't a little hot. Like I said it was in the middle of night low 70F and going between 6 - 7 bars and the air temp read --- F from too much heat.

any idea what these bars translate to (degrees?) being able to tell us how hot the bike is actually getting would be more helpful than the bars.

Unless car wash soap and water can make stickers peel then no and obviously it is not an issue if they are being replaced. Again the starting and oil are the real issues.

Ummm? Yeah and after repeated attempts to remedy the problem they would replace the car. It's call the lemon law.

as someone else has already suggested, i don't see anything here that would be covered under the lemon laws. more likely a combination of carbon based errors. however, it is certainly your right to pursue it. best of luck.

[thought]

The bike has 2800 miles on it now, but it had around 800 when it overheated real bad.

I want to take it to the dealer near Newark and have it looked over. I have to take it there because FBF doesn't have the computer needed to sync the ecu chip with the bike for the tremi slip ons. I just don't want to put more money into the bike if it keeps giving me problems.

what does "overheated real bad" mean?  are you referring to the time you mention about it being 78 degrees at night, 6-7 bars on the temp gauge, and you sweating only wearing a tshirt?  because if that is the case then all bikes during the break in process run hotter.  it's from the extra friction from the new components.  this is pretty normal, and since the 696 does not have a oil cooler you should expect higher temps overall.  plus, most of the heat you're feeling is from the headers...  it's due to the routing and it's not going to go away.  expect to have your inner left thigh roasted on a regular basis.  also, put on some gear when you're riding

if you do a search of the board, you'll see a lot of complaints about the heat issues you are facing.  it's just accepted that the 696 runs at a higher temp.  and the air temp sensor really shouldnt ever be referred to as a point of reference.  it's pretty useless and they even removed it from the 1100/796 because there was really no point in having it there.

you might want to talk to FBF again... i think you might have gotten some bad info or misunderstood them.  in order to put termi slip ons onto a current monster, you dont need to "sync the ecu" at the dealer (i'm not sure what you are referring to when you say that).  if you're buying the full kit, all you need to do is put on the slip ons, put in the air filter, and swap the ecu.  after that it's a simple cycling of the ignition 3x and your tps is reset.  you can pretty much install it at home, i know because i did.

and offhand, if you asking for help on the internet, dont have a thin skin about what's said.  this board is pretty laid back and really good about helping people, but personally insulting someone who actually answers your questions isnt the best way to get anymore help from anyone.  just simply appreciate the fact that a lot of people are helping you and giving you advice for free.

[rgramjet]

So your saying that its normal for vehicles produced buy Ducati and Ferrari to have trouble starting when their brand new? I didn't even put 50 miles on the bike before it started acting up. I expect to have to take the bike to the shop and pay more than other bikes to fix it, but not before i hit 1000 miles. By the way I do plan on getting a Ferrari. It's going to be a graduation give when I get done law school. If that gives me trouble i'm sure any problems will not be fixed at the shop and not keep reoccurring.

Just get whoever is buying you the Ferrari to throw in a new bike!

[Drunken Monkey]

And thanks to the personal attack this thread is now locked and the insulter has earned a time-out.