Going from road riding to off road

[duccarlos]

I looked aound and could only find a few tid bits, like Raux's thread of getting his kids into motocross. After realizing that buying a road bike in Chile is make the beast with two backsing expensive, even the used ones, I've decided to give off road a try. Gear and stuff should be easy, go to your nearest shop and buy.

Now what should I look for in a used dirt bike? Any brand that holds up better than others? What should I change in my riding technique? Notice that I won't be flying off ramps. It will be mostly trail riding. Any suggestions would be highly appreciated.

[zooom]

1st...in terms of bikes, think about what speeds you need?...if you don't need to exceed 70 for extended periods of time, then something 400cc's or under will suit you fine( most thinking in terms of weight, but also power)...also think about parts availability...generally speaking, the Japanese singles are most prevelant in terms of all things available out there and they are of the more modifyable in terms of all manner of DS aftermarket bolt on bits...

2nd...gear...same general guidelines with dirt gear as road gear in terms of armor and protection, although mobility, and weather and elements in a more primal nature are going to be a bigger key...

3rd...in terms of riding...the most general thing I can say, that will have to be felt and learned, is body nuetrality so that when the bike gets squirrelly under you, you let the bike do so and it recover itself before your inputs change the course of what is happening unless you specifically dictate it to do so...you will more than likely have to change your body positioning type from what you are currently comfortable with and some of your habits ( like leaning to the inside of the machine in a turn for example)

I am sure many will expound further and I am just starting off with initial basics...

[Slide Panda]

Body position and traction are going to be the biggest changes. Instead of leaning towards the inside of a turn or getting off the bike you'll be keeping your weight over the contact patch and pushing the bike down into the turn. As Aaron from Corner-Spin describes it, your arms will be like you're shoveling. Inside arm down and straitened  out, outside arm bent, elbow up. Keeping your weight neutral and over that contact patch is something that will require work.

Obviously traction will be a lot different, spinning the rear is very common and quite fun once you get past the initial pucker factor that it induces.

As far as bikes - are things like the DZ series a viable option?

[fastwin]

Haven't ridden dirt bikes in years and I miss it. I grew up on dirt bikes in the 60s. Started racing MX in the really early days and my folks had a nearby farm that I had a practice track on. Nothing like today's tracks, no doubles and triples... more like TT tracks back then. Learned a million bike handling lessons and skills that still serve me well on the road to this day. Great way to start off riding scooters. MSF courses are all well and good but nothing could replace spending a few years on the dirt before ever turning a wheel on the tarmac.

Anyway, good luck with the dirt bike adventure! My physical issues will never let me enjoy trail riding (or MTN biking) again and I will forever be sorry for that. Glad I got to do what I did when I could.

[duccarlos]

Thanks for the responses guys! Keep them coming! I was looking at some Honda in the 250 range. They are still expensive, even used, but not as bad as a road bike. I don't see myself getting too adventuresome with this one. There are some dirt trails really close to my house. I would probably start there and work my way up to more technical stuff as I get better. Basically using the same mentality that I used on the road bike, started riding to work only, then progressed to mountain twisties, to trackdays.

[IZ]

Haven't read the responses so I don't know if it's been said but best to go from off-road first and then to road..IMO.     

So, you're looking at a 250?  YOU could even go with something smaller if all you're going to do is trail riding and exploring.  You can stilll have a lot of fun on a 200 or 125.   I'd probably get the biggest bike I could find though too. 

I started on a Suzuki DR350 Dual-sport up in Flagstaff.  Dropped it many times.  Get ready..you'll drop it too.  Good thing though..these bikes can take a beating.  Important to watch out for the ruts in the dry mud!!  I got caught up in those a few times.  When they narrow and come to an end with you caught in them..there isn't anywhere to go but down!! 

Check out the equipment DantheMan has when he rides.  It's full body armor.  A wise investment!

Have fun riding down there!!  Riding off-road will definitely make you a better road rider for when you get back up to the States.

[ungeheuer]

I went from a lifetime of road riding to a Suzuki DR650 for dirt road riding (its not really an off road machine).  I'm having to cope with that fact that whilst I'm pretty competent on the bitumen.... there's much learning to be done on the loose stuff.  Its fun though, but as IZ said I think its probably easier to go from dirt to road than the other way around.  I think it would be helpful to spend some time riding with others who're already good at the dirt and can give some constructive critique on my/your riding "technique". 

I'll get there though.... and if I can, so can anybody  . 

Just get on with it, you'll be fine  .

[Raux]

another good question... braking?

I know on the street many of you don't even touch the rear brake. I use it alot, maybe something I remember from the dirt days?

[ungeheuer]

Yup, I've discovered the value of my DR's rear brake (hardly ever touch it on my Monster 'cept when coming to a stop at traffic lights etc).

[lethe]

touching my front brake is a definite no-no offroad, 4 piston caliper plus big rotor in the dirt means I'd fall down before I knew what happened 

[lazylightnin717]

Riding in the dirt is a great way to unleash yourself when you can't on the road.

[zooom]

another good question... braking?

I know on the street many of you don't even touch the rear brake. I use it alot, maybe something I remember from the dirt days?

you use the rear more for sure, but you still use the front too, but you have to learn to modulate and feel, especially if the surface isn't packed...you'll be much more effective in this department once you get comfortable with the feeling of traction loss/sliding which is possible to somewhat feel/control before dumping/crashing...playing with this traction learning is much more effective on a smaller displacement like any 4 stroke 100cc to 150cc ( ie:XR100, DR-Z125L, TT-R125L, CRF150F, etc.)because the consequences in the learning process are greatly reduced....and the bike isn't generally going to be fast enough to do anything to it when you crash and is ultimately light enough that you won't tire due to picking it up over and over and over again while doing so...maybe in addition to the CRF250 you are probably looking at, look for an old beater XR100 in addition as a learning tool to play with and ride the 250 a lil more conservatively till you get some skills down from pushing your limits on the smaller beater bike...this is all kinda like starting out on the road on a Ninja 250 to build your skillset and progressing to your bigger bike in a way...

[dennisd]

A light bike is your friend off road, more so than HP.  Additionally, low end torque will get you out of more trouble than it will get you into so a thumper is somewhat better for recreational riding.  Unless you are a really good off road rider, top end power is not really an advantage.  Since you won't necessarily need lots of top speed you can change sprockets for more power to the ground at low speeds.  I tend to ride the front wheel (weight forward) on hard surfaces but in soft sand you have to shift your weight over the rear wheel and keep the front as light as possible.  It might sound funny but giving a burst of throttle will save you in a LOT of situations (you will learn that with time).  Keeping your weight on the pegs is a real advantage also.  Not only does it shift the weight down lower but it also will let the bike move around better below you keeping the tires more planted.

If you can find one, a dual purpose can be good because you can still use it around town.  But remember, blinkers and mirrors really like to smack trees and the ground every chance they get.  That can get expensive replacing them.  For me here in Texas, blinkers are not required so I removed them.  I also take the mirrors off when off road.  I believe Accerbis makes foldable mirrors (fold out for street then fold in against the handlebar for off road) but I've never used them.

[duccarlos]

I think I will just go with the smaller, lighter bike. I will start my search at the 100 to 150 range. I considered the dual route, but discarded it because of the prices. Bikes down here are terribly expensive. Once I move back to the states, i migt be looking for a KTM 900 or similar. The good thing is that there are places for me to ride very close to my house. I would be on the street for less than 2k. I think I'll start at the local store that sells gear. I'll see if someone from there is selling a bike they outgrew. Then I'll be posting all sorts of questions about technique.

[RC]

My first bike was a DR 350 and it was just enough for me to respect a dual sport. Lightweight, power is suitable, and reliable. Following the DR 350 was my XR 650L; In one word; damn reliable. Much taller than the DR 350, a mild bump in power, and highway legal. I rode it on the road for several months commuting 32 miles one way. The first time I took it off roading is when I realized that it was a dirt bike. Never had I felt more confident than when I hit the trail entrance. It was like autonomous; I just whacked the throttle and the bike did the rest. I was impressed. However, it is a heavy bike but I'm not worried about that. I have to man up. Things to watch out for on the XR650L are oil changes and the rockers. Frequent oil changes are a must.

My most recent dual sport is my GS 1200. I'm never letting this bike go. It's titty milk to an adult. It has everything one would need for a world traveller, which I have to work up to. I've taken it to the race track, the desert, and the trails. I love it. A bit heavy but it makes the XR seem like a lightweight.

Hit up thumper talk or ADVrider for more info. Also, walk into your local dual sport shop or off roaring store and gobs of real time info should come your way. Good luck!